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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right kit? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1442565034 Message started by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 01:30:34 |
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Title: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right kit? Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 01:30:34 1995 Suzuki Savage ls650 2003 Engine Is this the right clutch kit? Moreover, is it decent or do you recommend one that you agree to be better? http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/371038783368?ul_noapp=true&chn=ps&lpid=82 |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by Dave on 09/18/15 at 03:58:41 As the clutch wears, the adjustment available is not sufficient to account for the wear....without using a shorter rod. Suzuki offers 3 different sizes of rods, and more than likely you just need to install a different length rod. Here is a link to a long clutch discussion. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1270678838/0 I have not heard anyone on this site install the Kevlar discs.....not sure if they are any better than the stock discs on this bike. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 12:33:22 Ah well, the clutch started slipping a while ago. (at 21,000 miles). Then it started only shifting without using the clutch lever at all. Now, you can start up the bike without even pulling in the clutch lever (meaning it's always engaged) and when you pull it in and try to shift while hte bike is running it will just shut off. Overnight it went from average play to completely loose. I've adjusted it as much as possible to tighten it, but it only sits at an inch away from the handlebar. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by youzguyz on 09/18/15 at 12:56:25 This is sounding more like a cable problem than a clutch problem. The bike won't start unless you pull in the clutch, UNLESS someone disabled that interlock switch that is on the clutch LEVER. When you say "it will just shut off", does it STALL out? or does it act like someone turned off the key? If the latter, it means the kickstand is down. You can't put the bike in gear with the kickstand down UNLESS someone disabled that interlock as well. Maybe I am just reading your posts all kinds of wrong? :-/ |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 12:59:06 Haha, no I make sure the kickstand is up. Better be thorough though, so yeah. Other than that, it doesn't seem like the cable is damaged or strained at all. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 13:01:23 And it stalls, sorry about that. I'll kick it into first (which I shouldn't be doing because I can hear myself grind the gears as I do so) with the clutch pulled in and it will just lurch forward and shut off. (stalling) To add to that, yes. I find it very odd. The bike can start without pulling the clutch in at all, but not when I have the clutch pulled to the handlebar. As if it were reversed. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by youzguyz on 09/18/15 at 13:10:14 Try to move the clutch arm where it goes into the engine. It would normally take a good size wrench fitting over the arm to move it . If it moves freely very much, then you have a problem inside the case. Now I am thinking a busted cam. Especially because it went out "overnight". It could be that the basket has come apart as well, but not as likely. #23 in this picture http://www.ronayers.com/oemparts/a/suz/50d32fb6f8700232d0b3d922/clutch |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by verslagen1 on 09/18/15 at 13:16:59 654F424B416F424F454F472E0 wrote:
five completely confusing statements. 1. I assume it's lurching between shifts, huge clunk, whoops I've done it again? 2. In neutral, kickstand up? 3. Huge lurch and stall? 4. Did you drop it? 5. tight as you can get it and the lever is only an inch away? you did drop it and bent the lever? should be a couple of inches away from the bar when there's no freeplay. I'm thinking along the same lines as Youzguyz. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 13:33:20 I didn't drop it. The clutch arm does move fairly freely, but that's because of all the play still on the clutch. (Other than that, I have no idea what I am talking about). If it's a busted cam, would a clutch rebuild still benefit from this? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 13:49:04 Because I thought if the cam as busted, the bike just wouldn't start? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by verslagen1 on 09/18/15 at 13:58:17 7258555C56785558525850390 wrote:
If the lever is moving freely, no effort to pull the clutch in, then you aren't pulling in the clutch only moving the lever. Check the lever on the clutch case, can you move that freely too? If you can, then most likely your cam is busted and you'll need to replace it. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 14:13:56 I apologize if this is incorrect. as I have never done any clutch work before but I went ahead and pulled the clutch in and then tried to pull the clutch arm and it wouldn't budge. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by HovisPresley on 09/18/15 at 14:15:47 The cut-out switch is at the lever on the h/bar, rather than inside the right hand case. Is it a case of; 1. the clutch cut-out has been disabled previously and 2. there has been some failure in the clutch operating mechanism, ie the cam, pushrod etc, (rather than a clutch plate/spring problem)? It's a simple job to take of the r/h/s cover to check out the mechanism, but I'm sure there will be something recognisably wrong as soon as you see it |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 14:33:41 I have no idea how to take off the clutch cover. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by verslagen1 on 09/18/15 at 14:33:55 0E2429202A0429242E242C450 wrote:
No, do 1 at a time. how easy is it to pull in the clutch lever? how easy is it to pull the clutch arm up? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 15:09:16 To answer both questions: They both have a small amount of resistance. To pull the clutch lever in you feel a slight force. When I pull the clutch arm up to there is a slight force, until of course the clutch lever is at the handlebar. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by youzguyz on 09/18/15 at 15:49:10 715B565F557B565B515B533A0 wrote:
Time to define some things here, and show how they work. If this sounds a bit too condescending, I apologize. Referring back to this picture: http://www.ronayers.com/oemparts/a/suz/50d32fb6f8700232d0b3d922/clutch #24 is the clutch arm. Disconnect the cable from the arm. There is a little piece of metal you bend open, then slip the cable out of the clip. When that is done, the only resistance on the arm comes from inside the engine case. Spring #25 is weak. It is only there to keep tension on the cable. The clutch springs (#15) are very strong. When you (or the cable) pulls up on the arm, the cam (#23) pivots, pushes on the rod (#22) which is resisted by the clutch springs (#15) and that allows the plates to separate, disengaging the clutch so you can shift gears. Pushing that rod in takes a LOT of force. If you can lift that lever up by hand at all, you are either one very strong dude (gal?).. or there is a problem inside the case. SO, if you have only slight resistance on the arm when you lift, then either the cam is broken, the rod is broken, or the clutch basket (where the strong springs are) is broken. You won't know what is going on until you take off the clutch cover. The small resistance you are feeling is just spring #25 |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 16:01:35 Not condescending at all, I am absolutely new to the clutch side of things here. How would I take the clutch cover off? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 16:05:38 Okay. I can't lift the clutch arm past it's position. Maybe a millimeter. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 16:09:58 Update: I removed the cable from the clutch arm, and can lift the clutch arm to the stopping point(?). About 30 degrees. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by springman on 09/18/15 at 16:13:34 Youzguyz, your explanation was great, not condescending. Thanks. I am just following along to try to learn myself. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by youzguyz on 09/18/15 at 16:30:24 7D575A5359775A575D575F360 wrote:
Then it sure sounds like you have problems inside. A Clymers manual and these two threads will help you get the clutch cover off. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1191167029 http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1256079122 Good luck!! |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 18:05:58 Thanks, you've been a great help Youzguyz. I guess all I can ask is if you think this would benefit from getting the clutch rebuild kit? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/18/15 at 19:07:38 Or could it just be the push rod? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by youzguyz on 09/19/15 at 05:59:00 I really doubt you will need that expensive clutch kit. My first bet would be the cam. No way to know until you open it, and the only part you will need for sure at this point is the clutch cover gasket. Once you know what you need, you buy it. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/19/15 at 13:21:02 How expensive of a job is the cam if I take it into a shop? Also, I have a 95 suzuki savage engine (that was blown). Would I be able to use any of the parts from it for this? |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by HovisPresley on 09/19/15 at 13:36:58 Really, don't take it to a shop.... We can guide you through it, it's an easy job, it won't cost a fortune. Read all the relevant bits from the Tech Section, be prepared to take a few photos on your phone and share them using photobucket/tinypic/etc. Above all, don't sweat, this forum is a deep well of knowledge that prides itself in it's ability to be of help ;) |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by youzguyz on 09/19/15 at 14:01:31 4F6568616B4568656F656D040 wrote:
Labor is expensive. The parts are not. The cam is $6.44. The expensive part is the gasket, and you won't be able to reuse that unless you are very lucky when opening up the case. Yes, you could probably use the parts from the 95 engine. You can test that theory by going to that link (yes, again) and clicking on the part. It will show you which years it applied to. I.E. I click on that Cam (#23) link, and I get this: http://www.ronayers.com/oemparts/p/suzuki/23263-24b01/cam-release Hey presto.. the same part is used from 1986 to 2015 !! |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/19/15 at 19:44:31 That is made of sintered metal.Mine broke, at low speed, thankfully. Messed up a cam chain guide. We've seen a few go. It's easy to fix. The oring the clutch arm passes through is almost free, and you're gonna be right there. Mine leaked,,, You don't need to get it from the dealership. A hydraulics parts shop, good hardware store.. Just get the right sealant. Be conservative, thin and even. This is a great opportunity, you'll get some experience and the money you'll save will pay for the tools and parts and your confidence will grow. |
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Title: Re: Pretty sure clutch is fried, this the right ki Post by KaleoAlakai on 09/20/15 at 02:01:07 Alright, then when I pick up my old engine from my old town, I can get to work on all this. Thanks for the help guys, and I will be asking for your guidance through this when I start! |
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