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Message started by justin_o_guy2 on 06/03/15 at 09:55:04

Title: is this true?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/03/15 at 09:55:04

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/crime/item/20985-self-defense-in-the-uk-is-illegal

I'm gonna need to hear from you guys who are or have been there.

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by Serowbot on 06/03/15 at 10:30:42

Probably is,... I think it sounds more restrictive than it is...

A cricket bat, tire iron, kitchen knife, sharp pointy stick,.. are not "defensive" weapons... but, they are legal and can be used for defense...

Here, in America, you can't own brass knuckles, but you can wear heavy rings... can't own a switchblade knife but you can own a flick-knife... you can legally own a shotgun, but you can't saw off the barrel to less than 18"... etc...

Here's another quote from the same English website regarding defending yourself from an intruder... rules are very much the same as ours...

Quote:

In the heat of the moment it is not expected that you should make fine judgements as to how far you can go. What you honestly and instinctively believe is lawful and necessary self defense of either yourself, your family or your property, even if you use a weapon could constitute reasonable force.

You do not have to be attacked first to be able to use reasonable force in self defense.

Even if the intruder dies, provided you have used reasonable force in the circumstances described then you will not necessarily be prosecuted. If, having disabled the intruder you then go on and inflict further punishment then this would be deemed to be excessive and gratuitous force and you could be prosecuted.

I have a camera monopod, with a heavy weight attached to the end,.. that I keep by my front door... I bring it along when I hear a suspicious noise outside...
...(don't want anyone messin' with my bikes, ya'know?)... ;)...

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by Art Webb on 06/03/15 at 11:21:09

On another forum (one dealing with martial arts and self defense) I was told by an Aussie that putting a baseball bat by the front door would be illegal, as that was 'intending to use it as a weapon'
There was a whole thread dealing with this, what you could or couldn't have or carry for self defense
It was a tiny list, and most 'legal' items were determined as to legality according to 'intended use'
for example, you could carry a flashlight if checking out darkened areas at night (not while looking for intruders, but, say, looking for keys you dropped) but having such a light for regular carry, would be considered carry for use as a weapon (especially mag light style flashlights)
If he was telling the truth, your mono-pod could be illegal, there

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by pgambr on 06/03/15 at 15:11:28

Quote:

You do not have to be attacked first to be able to use reasonable force in self defense.

Even if the intruder dies, provided you have used reasonable force in the circumstances described then you will not necessarily be prosecuted. If, having disabled the intruder you then go on and inflict further punishment then this would be deemed to be excessive and gratuitous force and you could be prosecuted.

If you turn someone's head into a canoe you will have to justify your actions. Which is to say if their is not an enormous amount of circumstantial evidence to support your claim, you will have to go to court to prove your innocence. It will be your word vs: some one else's.

Best regards,

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by Paraquat on 06/04/15 at 06:06:41

2731263B23363B20540 wrote:

...(don't want anyone messin' with my bikes, ya'know?)... ;)...

Or crates. ;D

--Steve

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by HovisPresley on 06/04/15 at 06:13:57

Is this true?
Yep, pretty much.

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by old.indian on 06/04/15 at 08:44:35

"Self Defense" is defined on a case by case basis by the local Judiciary (read political influence). At least that has been my observation over the years....

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/04/15 at 09:21:43

597E677862416374627D7468110 wrote:

Is this true?
Yep, pretty much.

This comes from someone who knows.
Anyone else who has experience over there?

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by HovisPresley on 06/04/15 at 15:00:17

This was an interesting case;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Martin_%28farmer%29

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by pgambr on 06/04/15 at 15:37:41

It said he killed a "traveller" that was in the act of robbing him. Is this Hollywood's rendition of a "traveller?

[media]https://youtu.be/ySyBMTo-1sc[/media]

https://youtu.be/ySyBMTo-1sc

Best regards,

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by verslagen1 on 06/05/15 at 12:27:35

2B0C150A10331106100F061A630 wrote:

This was an interesting case;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Martin_%28farmer%29

And you thought we were messed up.

Quote:

He was sentenced to life imprisonment, with a recommended minimum term to serve of 9 years, reduced to 8 years by the Lord Chief Justice.

For killing
Quote:

Fred Barras, the dead youth, had accumulated a lengthy criminal record, having been arrested 29 times by the time of his death at the age of 16, and had been sentenced to two months in a young offenders' institution for assaulting a policeman, theft and being drunk and disorderly. On the night he was killed, the teenager had just been released on bail after being accused of stealing garden furniture. Barras' grandmother, Mary Dolan, stated: "It's not fair that the farmer has got all the money and he is the one that took Fred away.

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/05/15 at 14:28:02

Rather than congratulate the old man they punished him.

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by old_rider on 06/07/15 at 11:08:45

Fred's grandma sounds like thug grandma's here in the states.

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by Art Webb on 06/07/15 at 21:53:48

thug grannies are thug grannies everywhere, same with thug mamas
"It ain't right my boy is (your choice, locked up, dead, on the run, in the hospital) he's a good boy"
Never mind he assaulted the guy that put him there
While trying to rob him
While drunk (and underage)
and on drugs

Title: Re: is this true?
Post by arteacher on 06/11/15 at 17:25:23

We had some trouble with some bad teens hanging around in our condo complex a few years ago. A police consultant told us to carry a big metal flashlight, like a six battery Mag light, and to always have it turned on. If it was turned on legally it was a flashlight- if not the courts would consider it a weapon. We finally hired off duty police to patrol two nights a week (at $50 an hour each) and the bad kids moved on.