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Message started by Jeff71 on 02/28/15 at 14:22:42

Title: valve stems
Post by Jeff71 on 02/28/15 at 14:22:42

Hey gang,
What do you think of these? Got my Ryca boxes yesterday and need to install the tires first but thought these valve stems looked pretty neat. (Silver ones) Had a few good reviews. I'm running the 18" Ryca wheels and tubeless Heidenau 4.00-18 tires.
http://www.motorcycleanchor.com/tire_valves/index.htm
Jeff

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Dave on 02/28/15 at 14:53:43

They aren't necessary on an 18" wheel....you have plenty of room for a tire inflator and gauge. They would help on the 15" rear wheel that was originally on the bike.

And although they probably don't weigh much....the valve stem side is already the heavy side of the rim most of the time.

And....it looks too much like "bling" for me to use it.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Jeff71 on 02/28/15 at 18:30:40

They said it was lighter than a stock rubber valve and I thought it might go along with my hand-sanded hubs and chrome rim. Still need to make sure I mount the tires without marring the rims.
Jeff

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by v-pilot on 02/28/15 at 18:45:08

Those are not for use with rims that require inner tubes

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Jeff71 on 02/28/15 at 19:18:42

My tires are tubeless. :)
Jeff

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by bobert_FSO on 02/28/15 at 19:30:46

Spoked wheels require a tube, even if the tire is made for tubeless. The problem is that the spokes ferrules and the spoke holes in the wheel don't seal. Some people have been successful at sealing all the spoke holes with various methods, but I wouldn't trust it to stay sealed.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Oldfeller on 02/28/15 at 19:40:26

4A6566663731000 wrote:

They said it was lighter than a stock rubber valve and I thought it might go along with my hand-sanded hubs and chrome rim. Still need to make sure I mount the tires without marring the rims.
Jeff

Sounds like you perhaps you are using a spoked rim set up. Your tires may be tubeless, yes, and a spoked rim set up can be made to be tubeless, yes it can.

But, having tried to do "tubeless" on a Savage rear rim you may well wind up having to use a tube before it is all over.

Tubeless tricks on a tube rim means the bead can run out of room in the center well for the tire to make the "go in to the center" movements it has to make on the far side of the wheel to get the bead over the rim on your near, operator side. Extra force may be required to mount the tire on the rim .... beyond what the rim, center relief section, extra rubber down in the center section and the bead can take without getting indigestion with each other.

(rubbing the 1" scar on his left wrist -- scar has shrunk some over the last 4 years to be sure).

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Jeff71 on 03/01/15 at 01:20:49

Eh, Looks like I'll go looking for some tubes.....

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/01/15 at 10:11:50

Spoked rims CAN be engineered from the factory to be tubeless (check out the rims on a 450, not 250, Honda rebel)
WHY the MC makers still use the idiotic design that requires the use of tubes, and all the problems that entails, is beyond me
Even Harley uses cast wheels on most of their model line FFS, why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Dave on 03/01/15 at 12:22:09

5A494F4C5E59593B0 wrote:

Even Harley uses cast wheels on most of their model line FFS, why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Kris01 on 03/01/15 at 13:38:56

64777172606767050 wrote:

why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

Because the bike was designed in the '80s! ;)

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Steve H on 03/01/15 at 16:06:07

My 76 Goldwing had tubeless tires. Spoked rims.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Dave on 03/02/15 at 03:14:12

647F26252423212E170 wrote:

My 76 Goldwing had tubeless tires. Spoked rims.

You can mount tubeless tires on a spoked rim - but it requires you to have a tube in the tire as the air will still leak out the spoke nipple holes.

Here is a link to the rear wheel on a 1976 Honda 750 - it shows a spoked wheel, a rim strip, a tube, and a tire.
http://www.hondaofflorence.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=2451478&category=Motorcycles&make=Honda&year=1976&fveh=131095

If you are running tubeless tires and no tube on your Honda - then someone must have done something to seal up all the spoke holes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbJueZ5prnU
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbJueZ5prnU[/media]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlItWwxiRvs
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlItWwxiRvs[/media]

I really don't believe that converting rims is a good idea....tubeless rims have a small lip to keep the tire seated on the rim, and spoked rims don't have this lip built into them.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 08:07:32

33080512030F141209010C13600 wrote:

[quote author=5A494F4C5E59593B0 link=1425162162/0#8 date=1425233510]Even Harley uses cast wheels on most of their model line FFS, why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

I like the looks of a conventional spoked wheel...works for me. If I were to buy a Royal Enfield or similar new bike....I would be horribly disappointed if the bike had cast wheels.

The rear of my trials bike had a spoked wheel and a tubeless tire. Those bikes only run 4 psi in the rear and they pinch tubes between the tire and rim when you bounce into/off things - so they have a deep center in the rim and a pliable rubber strip that seals off the spoke nipples. Some other bike have spokes that connect to the rim in a way that does not penetrate the rim.

[/quote]

but as mentioned, you can have a spoked rim without the necessity of a tube, like Honda did with the 450 rebel
http://www.ebay.com/itm/87-Honda-CMX450-CMX-450-C-rebel-rear-back-wheel-rim-/310796771827?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item485cee61f3&vxp=mtr

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 08:09:04

023B203A7978490 wrote:

[quote author=64777172606767050 link=1425162162/0#8 date=1425233510]why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

Because the bike was designed in the '80s! ;)[/quote]

end every Harley in the lineup was designed in the 60s or before, so invalid point ;D

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 08:11:10

09323F2839352E28333B36295A0 wrote:

[quote author=647F26252423212E170 link=1425162162/0#11 date=1425254767]My 76 Goldwing had tubeless tires. Spoked rims.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/02/15 at 08:54:43

53404645575050320 wrote:

why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

---------------

It's a two-fold answer.

1. The LS-650 is one of Suzuki's lowest priced bikes. Therefore every part and design choice is made with cost being a significant factor. Spoked wheels are very inexpensive to produce.

2. They are appropriate for the design. At about 50 ft-lbs of torque at the rear wheel the bike has to use a cast wheel, but below that spokes make sense because they are lighter AND most of the weight is centralized at the hub so they require less power to accelerate and stop (leading to lighter and less expensive brake components too). For example, dirt bikes continue to use spoked wheels because they are lighter then cast wheels. A MotoGP bike can't use spoked wheels because they make too much torque.

Low cost, light weight..what's not for a bike designer to like?

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 09:02:37

272D29232821252C727470400 wrote:

[quote author=53404645575050320 link=1425162162/0#8 date=1425233510]why do we have to put up with the problematic tubed design on a bike in this day and age?

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/02/15 at 09:33:03

4F5C5A594B4C4C2E0 wrote:

again, there are designs of spoked wheels that don't require tubes, so why do we have to be subject to that?

-------------

Because they're cheap, low-cost, inexpensive, low value, economy priced or in a single word...ECONOMICAL.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 09:42:44

so you think Honda's Rebel 450 used an expensive, hi cost, high value, un economy priced, in a word, uneconomical wheel? on a 450? really?
true they might cost $20 or so more to produce, but would a $40 higher price for the bike have turned that many people off? and then there's the cost saved by lack of need for tubes, but those are probably like $2 apiece if you're a manufacturer

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/02/15 at 10:09:08

I’m sorry Art. Apparently I can’t provide you with an answer that meets your needs. Nor am I in the position of providing every cost/value consideration for all of the major motorcycle manufacturers. I suggest you take this up with Suzuki.

Steve Younan
Director of Marketing
Suzuki Motor of America, Inc.
P.O. BOX 1100
Brea, CA 92822-1100

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 10:38:47

Hahahaha touche!
Maybe I'll write him at that, might be interesting to see what his reply would be
I'm guessing none

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Dave on 03/02/15 at 10:51:04

I just looked to see that the Honda 450 Rebel had to make the tubeless work. They have the nipples in the hub and a rim with a flange in the middle that the spokes hook into. Not a great look.....but I guess it works fine and could be cost effective if you made enough of them.

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by Art Webb on 03/02/15 at 10:55:12

it's different that's for sure

Title: Re: valve stems
Post by v-pilot on 03/02/15 at 14:34:34

Akront of Spain did that a long time ago. Mostly for small dirt bikes like Moto Beta...called it the Nervi rim