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Message started by Datpoolboy on 01/14/15 at 18:16:08

Title: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/14/15 at 18:16:08

I bought it this bike dirt cheap and put in a modded tensioner and went with the rotella oil but here is where it stands, the bike starts fine but has a weird knock/rattle from what sounds yo me like sort of the left side\top end that is only there once it runs for a minute and it worries me something terrible. Once it starts on full "choke" and after a min I can move it to the half choke but if I try to ride there it will die and pop fire from exhaust but if I turn choke all the way off it pops fire after any kind of throttle at all and acts like the idle it too low. I realize this is kind of dragged out but just looking for any kind of insight! Btw the bike has 30,000 miles on her and the previous owner installed the raptor petcock and god knows what they did with the carb situation. The noise starts at about :50 seconds. Any input is much appreciated. http://youtu.be/nnYT5foEsnA

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by verslagen1 on 01/14/15 at 19:59:25

Take the front valve cover off and look down on the right side (from your point of view, not the bikes).
There's a little cam that may be hitting the rocker. If it is, adjust your decomp looser.

Also may be an indication that your cam has been starved for oil and is worn.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/15/15 at 07:00:51

Alright, I will look into that. Worst case if it was starved for oil any clue as to how much a complete rebuild might run?

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Serowbot on 01/15/15 at 08:42:59

Could be oil starvation damage to the rockers or cam,...

... but,... it's possible that it is bad jetting, causing detonation... or spark knock...
I'm suspicious of this because of all the popping and dying...and the fact that it takes 50 seconds to start making noise...

In olden times,... as cars were climbing mountains the engine would lug and get hot, and the air would get thin, and cars would begin to knock... The solution was to flip the air cleaner lid to allow more air and lean the mix...
I would clean the carb and jets and check what size jets are in there...

I always check the cheap easy fixes first... (with fingers crossed)... ;D...

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/15/15 at 11:57:54

I hate not knowing what the previous owner has already done but I will start with the simple things you guys have pointed out and I'll post updates. Serowbot, your idea with the carbs could have some truth, I actually bought the bike coming through little rock Arkansas and I live in shreveport louisiana so there is some elevation changes there and if I read correctly in some of the posts on this forum your elevation plays part in proper jetting.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/15/15 at 14:05:53

Verslagen, after pulling the cover the little cam doesn't seem to be making contact with the rocker. I see no signs of impact on the rocker anyways and the gap between them seems to be about a 1/16 or so. Should I cross this concern off the list as possible origins off the sound? I am pulling the carb now to see what I can find out from serowbots suggestions.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by verslagen1 on 01/15/15 at 14:30:17

Did you rotate the engine to max rocker height?

If so, check that one off.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/15/15 at 18:07:13

Vers, I pulled it back off and made sure I was at max height and all seems good there. Serowbot I pulled the carb and cleaned it and put it back together. While I had it apart I noticed that the main jet is still a 145 and I know for sure the bike has aftermarket exhaust so I assume the carb should have been rejected with the new pipe. Does sound like it would be a factor in your theory?

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/15/15 at 20:47:23

Now,now,don't go rejecting the poor innocent carb...

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Serowbot on 01/15/15 at 21:57:03

Since the knock occurs at idle,... too small a main jet shouldn't be the cause... (a loose one might)...
... a sticking slide might,...

The bike has a Raptor.... did the previous owner remember to block off the vacuum tap on the right side of the carb?...

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/16/15 at 05:09:30

Everything in the carb was TIGHT including the jets..... and yes the vacuum tap has a rubber cap on it. I did find on the cam chain side of the engine on the top under the chrome cover the bolt that goes where the red line is in my picture was loose and leaking oil. When I tried to tighten it i found that the previous owner had stripped the threads so I removed the washer and placed a small amount of high temp silicone and tightened it down so the threads below the stripped part could bite deeper without the washer and it did tighten but i didnt go crazy. Back to the carb, from what you said I assume my carb jetting is not causing the noise, should I still rejet the carb since the bike doesnt have stock exhaust? Unfortunately its starting to sound more and more like oil starvation damage to the engine internals. :'(

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Demin on 01/16/15 at 05:13:04

My '98 has 14,000 on it.Replacing the piston and rings and a bore job.Piston slap.

You might check your camchain guides too.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Dave on 01/16/15 at 05:33:18

That long bolt that was leaking oil.....is the galley where the oil comes up from the bottom end to the head. You might try using threaded rod in this location that can go all the way to the bottom of the hole, then trim the length of the threaded rod to allow you to put the sealing washer and a nut on top....the nut should be an acorn nut so it is sealed when installed....or put sealer on the threads if you use a standard nut.

Take that front cover off the front of the head again - and see if you can get a look at the camshaft lobes. Look for wear, scratches or rough surfaces on the camshaft.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/16/15 at 08:47:10

I was curious about how much thread was below the stripped part and all thread crossed my mind i will take the bolt to the hardware and find out the size and see if i can get some all thread so i can be sure it seals off.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Dave on 01/16/15 at 08:51:45

2F2A3F3B2424272924324B0 wrote:

The sad thing about this is that because it is an oil galley - you cannot hope to clean the hole out and JB Weld the stud in place, and even installing a heli-coil or Timesert is impossible as you don't want the chips going to the oil passages in the head.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/17/15 at 09:15:03

I haven't got around to getting all thread to make a new bolt but for now the original bolt with silicone and no washer seems to be holding. I did drill out the brass plug on the carb and adjust it and and idled it up a bit and now it will idle without the noise for the most part but if I just pop the the throttle while it's idling after the Rev falls back to idle the noise is there for a second then gone again.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/17/15 at 09:30:56

Don't be afraid to let it idle a bit too high. That's a lot better than any low idle.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by verslagen1 on 01/17/15 at 09:35:22

The bolt you have is 130mm long M6x1.0

here's a 140 long bolt (5.5")
https://www.boltdepot.com/Product-Details.aspx?product=7101

I'd put it in till it bottomed out, measure how much to cut off, compare with the old bolt, then cut it a little shorter to allow for tightening.
You don't want it to bottom out at torque.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/18/15 at 08:07:20

Thanks a lot vers, I ordered it and it is on the way.

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by Datpoolboy on 01/23/15 at 15:10:25

The longer bolt solved my leak and dave I pulled the cover off f the front of the engine but I wasn't able to see anything with the engine in the bike. No good angle to see. I think I am gonna take the bike for a good ride this weekend and see how it acts, I haven't really took it out and opened it up because I didn't want it comong apart on me going down the road! But I have fresh oil and two new tires so I think I'll find out how does on a real ride this weekend and hopefully I won't come skidding to a stop with a locked up engine

Title: Re: help! weird noise engine
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/23/15 at 19:00:40

Wait till you are headed back home to get too wild.. If you're Really gonna get stupid, ride the road,look it over, don't just go flying and hoping the road is safe.. Dodging a pothole or a dropped brick or gallon of paint, or, as I once saw happen, ALL the siding peeled off a trailer house and scattered across the road in front of a guy on a bike. He,somehow, drove between the sliding,spinning sheets. Anyway, you don't need any surprises
"At speed"..