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Message started by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 10:02:06

Title: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 10:02:06

Hi Everyone,

I need your beautiful knowledge... Sooo I keep being told that... All the savage's make the BIG POW when you turn off the bike and that there is nothing you can do to change this... I've been told it's due to the piston's taking that last big swing of compression. Please tell me that is not the truth and what I can do? It is so embarrassing pulling up and shutting your bike off to have this load big pow :(

Any help would be great. Thank you

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by HAPPYDAN on 06/12/14 at 10:15:21

Once that pesky brass-plugged air-mix screw (I think that's what it's called) is properly adjusted (usually2-3 turns out), then just pull out the choke, Chugga-Chugga-Chugga, switch off and no POW!

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Dave on 06/12/14 at 10:15:32

When you turn off the ignition, the engine was turning at 1,000 - 1,100 rpm and it continues to pull fuel and air from the carb while it is slowing down and coming to a stop. This fuel and air is not ignited in the cylinder as the ignition is switched off....so the fuel/air mix is pumped out the exhaust valves and into the header and muffler. The header and muffer are still hot....and the unburned fuel/air mix will be warmed up by the hot exhaust....and if the fuel/air mixture reaches the flash point...it is ignited. The result can be a pleasant little "poof" that makes you kinda' snicker - or it can be a "POW" that makes folks duck for cover.

The difference in the sound level can be affected by a combination of idle speed and fuel mixture. The faster the engine is turning the more fuel and air is pumped into the exhaust - and the leaner the mixture the the bigger the bang.

What has been done to your carb? Has it had any jet changes, has the plug over the idle mixture screw been removed?

My bike is jetted really well, and on rare occasion I get a tiny little "pfft" after I turn the bike off. In order for this to happen I have to shut if off rather quicklly after riding at speed. If I spend anytime idlling or riding across a parking lot, the bike does not make a single sound when turned off.

Dave

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by nickthe_human on 06/12/14 at 10:19:50

what Dave said.

Mine doesn't all the time. Most of the time if I just stop and turn it off, I get a soft whoomphff. And at night sometimes if its big enough, a blue flame shoots out 8-)

But the choke suggestion is nice. I use it when I pull under roofs at banks and gas stations just to be nice and not scare anybody.

Also, if you let it idle for just a few more seconds before shutdown, it reduces the sound considerably.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 10:35:39

Hi Dave,

What has been done to the carb? Nothing as far as I know... I do not believe any jet changes, and I don't believe the plug over the idle mixture screw been removed.

I hate to admit this, but I am not mechanically inclined. This is my first bike and I was told that nothing was done to it other than regular maintenance....

What is this jet change you mention?

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by 1st2know on 06/12/14 at 10:35:53

Stock petcock?
The vacuum line from the right side of the carb to the petcock can develop small holes from the throttle body banging the hose against the head. The small holes allow additional air in to the fuel air mixture, causing the motor to run lean.

Loud backfire ("Big bang with a flash") is a symptom of this condition.
The test, and fix are both simple:
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1251932429/1

I wouldn't start tuning and modifying the carb with a stock petcock, it so troublesome, it's hard to isolate where problems are coming from.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 10:37:34

OMG Nick blue flames?? nuts I would die if that happened... lol

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 10:48:41

Yes I have a stock petcock... hmmm interesting, I would have never thought this would cause a problem.. Thanks I'll try to do the test

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 10:50:30

HAPPYDAN... What's the " pesky brass-plugged air-mix screw " you speak off? sorry for the dumb question... but where is it?

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by 1st2know on 06/12/14 at 11:10:14

Idle mixture screw plug removal:
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1221818822

I would think that a 1986 would already have its plug removed by now. It would be interesting if was still there.

Here's a site search tip - in google do this:
site:suzukisavage.com idle mixture screw

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Dave on 06/12/14 at 11:37:05

From the factory, the bike is jetted somewhat lean to provide an engine that satisfies the EPA, and the idle fuel mix screw has a brass plug over the adjustment so that you don't fuss with (improve) it. Jet changes can also provide for a mixture that allows a better running engine....and less noise in the form of pops and booms.

Can you do this yourself? Possibly....we do have "how to" threads in the Tech Section that you can review.

Dave

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/12/14 at 12:36:45

Thank you for all the great information... Now I'm going to go home and try all this out... Keep you posted on progress! You are all so wonderful!

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Serowbot on 06/12/14 at 13:11:06

Before trying anything mechanical,... try just letting the bike idle for 10 seconds before shutting off...
That may solve the "Pow" problem by itself...

Worth a try?... :-?...

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Fishbulb on 06/12/14 at 13:25:47

Factory jetting, filter and muffler around sea level-ish.

I come to a stop, pull the choke out and then hit the kill switch. No pop, bang, or puff anymore.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by verslagen1 on 06/12/14 at 13:28:28

And fattening up the idle mixture screw an 1/8 to a 1/4 turn will do it to.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/12/14 at 13:47:31

Seems I remember someone saying putting it in gear & letting the clutch ALMOST start pulling while ya hit the kill switch helped, but Im not gonna swear to That one,,

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Blinky-FSO on 06/12/14 at 13:48:02

I don't know about everyone else, but I always considered the bang to be the Savage's hairy chest, knuckle dragging, crotch grabbing, spit on the sidewalk expression of it's nature and had fun with it. Let it be and enjoy the looks.

Good hunting

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Steve H on 06/12/14 at 16:12:07

I enjoy the big bang. Many times, especially during colder weather, it lets go a whopper when I shut it off. On a good night, it'll send blue flames a foot or so and send everyone around ducking for cover. Overheads and walls really amplify the sounds and make it a really big boom. I figure it's not too loud...hasn't set off any car alarms or anything yet.

Just part of the character of the bike. ;D

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Sassy Savage on 06/13/14 at 07:07:31

Thank you for the words of encouragement... It just so happens that my last name is POWE the "e" is silent - I've adopted the nickname KA-POWE... because of this loud bang my bike produces. That paired with being the only girl rider, I often get a hard time and alot of attention. I am just trying to be a little more low key... ;D

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by WD on 06/13/14 at 07:57:09

Embrace the boom. Enhance the boom. Enjoy the boom.

I will intentionally wind my bike up tight and heel the kickstand enough to stall it while rolling.. then pop the clutch and get an even bigger bang when the engine catches and fires off. The 2003 still has its safety switches.

My 1998 has a small gutted glasspack muffler shell as a resonance chamber and a 29 inch long fishtail extension. When it ran 155/55 jetting, I could wind it up and hit the kill switch (since deleted) and get 2-3 feet of flames out of the pipe. Sounded like a 155mm howitzer going off. Normal riding it sounded like a Vietnam War era Huey UH-1 helicopter... 8-)

The huge afterfire potential, the squeaking belt, rattling headlight and speedometer, and multiple oil leaks are what allow the bike to have some character. The engine is very loosely based on old British racing singles, mostly the Norton Manx, it is just showing its heritage.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by shorty on 06/13/14 at 08:14:39

I love the boom, wish it happened more often ;D

edit: back on topic, when I removed the brass plug covering the idle mixture ADJUSTING SCREW the booms almost quit happening..

I put adj screw in caps because I hate when they do stuff like that (EPA)

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Dane Allen on 06/13/14 at 13:00:55

I always stall it out in 2nd or 3rd gear and I get no after fire. It was pretty bad when I first got the bike new from the stealership and the adjustment screw process did not fix the boom. Someone recommended the stall method and I have done that ever since. Works like a charm!!

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by S-P on 06/13/14 at 16:39:37

4B796B6B614B796E797F7D180 wrote:

Simple fix: Pull your choke out and it will either die or if it doesn't, hit the kill switch. No BOOM!

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by shovelbum87 on 06/14/14 at 19:50:44

73313670292C2D35420 wrote:

I would think that a 1986 would already have its plug removed by now. It would be interesting if was still had it

my 87 still had it!

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by anebv8 on 06/14/14 at 20:42:19

I love the boom the beast makes,can get a few good cracks chopping down the gears coming up to the lights. A mate almost come off his bike when he was following me thru a tunnel and I was making it fire off,he was laughing so hard he almost hit the wall ;D
But will try the choke pull when going into a gas station,I usually hit the kill switch and roll in...rather embaressing forgetting to turn it back on again :-[

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by S-P on 06/14/14 at 20:58:07

[quote author=303F34332769510 link=1402592526/15#24 date=1402803739]
But will try the choke pull when going into a gas station,I usually hit the kill switch and roll in...rather embaressing forgetting to turn it back on again :-[/quote]

When you come to a complete stop, reach down and pull the choke out then you can either put the kickstand down if you're in gear, or hit the kill switch. Yep, I've forgotten I had the kill switch on a few times, and don't forget to push the choke back in... that's another OOPS!!!!... Too many things to remember! :)

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by anebv8 on 06/14/14 at 21:50:32

When you come to a complete stop, reach down and pull the choke out then you can either put the kickstand down if you're in gear, or hit the kill switch. Yep, I've forgotten I had the kill switch on a few times, and don't forget to push the choke back in... that's another OOPS!!!!... Too many things to remember! :)
[/quote]

I know all too well I'll forget it :) ;)

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Yoshi on 06/15/14 at 02:52:34

My bike use to poof and run like it didn't have enough gas at 60 mph until I switched to a 55 pilot

The bike still use to poof even with the 55 pilot, it stopped tho after tuning the mixture screw to 2 turns out, it runs great in all rpms too

Im at sea lever and running both cone filter and pretty open muffler

I still do tho get that loud backfire once in a while when I'm snapping the throttle shut quickly

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by Steve H on 06/15/14 at 17:11:46

I've tried cutting it off letting the clutch drag a little until it starts to pull and then hit the kill switch. No boom. Otherwise, I get a nice loud, satisfying report when switching off.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by WD on 06/15/14 at 22:45:31

Shut off "boom" is now a fairly quiet "whump"... but upshifting sounds like there is a .380 in the muffler. :o

Changed to a Mac or similar right side (upper) Intruder take off pipe/muffler. Bike sounds like a Honda CR500 (ginormous 2 stroke) race bike with a big bore kit... Hate the sound, but the bike gained 12mph at regular cruising throttle position, and at 2/3 throttle was running 80+ and still accelerating. AND used a full quart less fuel on my commute. 8-)

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/16/14 at 01:14:39

Before I tuned some of it out mine went off like a gun,,
I pushed down on the sidestand just enough to cut power to the spark plug & let off when I saw 2 cops in a yard.. They both looked like theyd been shot at..& OHH yea they looked at me,, but they count know I did it.. or that it was on purpose,,

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by ToesNose on 06/16/14 at 03:56:33

I typically only get the bang at shut off when it's cold out or I abruptly turn the engine off, but I absolutely love being able to BLAT BLAT BLAT at will while riding ;D

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by MnSpring on 06/16/14 at 08:21:32

Yep I had the, "Ka-Pow" boom on shutdown.
Now it's gone ! (6 times replicated the situations it had happened)

Read all the artitcals about it.

The "brass plug", was gone.
So on idling, 1050 RPM, I played with it, going in and out,
Could hear no difference.
Then reading more, found someone said, if the idle is to high
turning that screw doesn't make a difference, because the idle is to high.

So later, I adjusted the idle down to (Just know it was 8-9 hundred)
Now, I could hear the, gas mixture screw make a difference, in in and out. kept turning out, the RPM's increasing, tell they started to decrease, then went back to the highest RPM. (By Ear)

Rode it. "Ka-BOOM" on shut down. Hmmm,
Next I am thinking to tackle the TEV on the Carb.
(The two PO's ran crap gas, so thinking that at least needed a good cleaning.)

Then, let's double check. Put just a wrap around the spark plug tack on, and lowered the RPM by the 'throttle screw', to 800.
And played with the 'idle gas/air' screw, (under what used to be the brass plug), and I adjusted it to 1/16 of what I did by ear.

Didn't really want to tackle the TEV, but didn't want the big 'Ka-Boom",
Cops in this county will pull you over if you smell, scotch tape.

Then one night, 'amber fluid in hand of course'.
Went out to the shed, and decided to take out the muffler bolts that go into the head, and give them a shot of 'anti size'.
Just so they are ready when I decided to check the cam chain tensioner.

Found my stool, got the right socket, just double checked, that it fit the top bolt. Yep, it fits, then put it on the bottom bolt, and it turned !!!!

WHAT ! No way did they put two different size bolts in their.
Well they didn't, I turned the bottom out by hand, then lubed it, put it in finger tight. Took the top one out, it needed the ratchet for about 1/32 of a turn, lubed that put in finger tight. Then put the ratchet on, and, 'firmed them up', to a point, just from experience in running a steel bolt in a piece of threaded Alum. (About 1/4 turn)
Both bolts were Shiny New, they looked Like they were just picked out of the bin.

Now, YES MOM, I know, (KaBoom = Check Muffler tightness first)
I did, but by only grabbing every part I could and trying to wiggle.
No Wiggles, so no looseness, air leak. (I Thought)

Then I put a wrench to the clamp, where the muffler goes on the pipe.
Yep, several turns to make it tight!

Now, 6 times, consecutive, no "Ka-Pow" on shutdown.

So, my suggestion, for Kapow, Check Muffler, for air leaks,
by Wrench, Not hand ! Then adjust screw, (under the brass plug),
with, Low idle. Then if that does not do it.
Keep chasing.

Title: Re: The big Pow when you shut off?
Post by MnSpring on 06/17/14 at 17:03:59

On the, 'mods/adjustments' to the KoPowe, on shutdown.

After doing the above, 7 & 8 times, fine.

On the 9th time, shut it down, probably, 1-3 sec faster,
KOWPOWIE ( But it was less)
Then on the 9 the & 10 times, waited about 6-8 sec, on idle,
no Bang.

YMMV Later.