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Message started by Stimpy - FSO on 03/22/14 at 15:41:03

Title: UPDATE: ebike, building electric sidecar rig. Done
Post by Stimpy - FSO on 03/22/14 at 15:41:03

Hi everyone, long time no see, glad to see everyone and the site are doing alright.

I'm fine, working, learning, living, family, garden, you know;
still have my yamaha and the aprillia, life is good.

So... does anyone have any experience with e-bikes?

I want to motorize my homemade sidecar bike, remember?
the one I made from an old bed frame, yup that one.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1337645823/0

I have had it for over 2 years now and the thing is solid and
has needed no repairs so far, but understandably has always been a
bit on the heavy side and my limit is about 5 miles on flat terrain,
so what I want is electric assistance so I can go further & uphill,
besides I'll end up busting my knees if i don't do this.

This is what I have so far (fleabay):

- (1x) 250w/36V, brushless hub mounted on reenforced 28" front rim

- (3x) 12V, 12AH/20HR deep cycle 10 year/2000 cycle batteries

- (1x) universal 12-40V 20AH voltage (RPM) DC manual regulator,
the dimmer kind with a knob to regulate fan speeds, etc.

- (1x) digital voltage meter

I still have no controller but I think I do need one
since little did I know these things are NOT DC! but
a modern form of AC running at a frequency of 15-40k
pulses per second, however people claim they run these
things on direct DC with no issues, is this true?

So my main question is, what is up with the 3 cables from the motor?

after some poking around I found out that one is (-) and
the other 2 are (+) but the two positives are not the same;

so far I've only tested the wheel with direct 12v DC,
one (+) gives the wheel a little jolt and the other one
a strong jolt, but if I briged them, both (+), they
make my safety fuse short out.

I read somewhere one of the (+) motor terminals is 5 volts, why?

Should I give it a try with 24 or 36v direct DC
on the (+) that gives the strong jolt and just
ignore the other (+) and see if I can make my
wheel spin or just buy a controller?

Any other tips, ideas or mentionable experiences with
these things that anyone would like to share?

Thanks in advance.

http://s30.postimg.org/5fisdt6m9/180320143283.jpg

http://s15.postimg.org/no54lpjsb/180320143284.jpg

Title: Re: Help with e-bike. Building electric sidecar r
Post by ZAR on 03/22/14 at 20:18:35

Welcome back Stimpy! You have some engineering that that's above my pay grade! When you said E-bike I was thinking more along the lines of using the motor from a fishermans trolling motor. Those things are DC rated(some 24v some 36v)and designed to pull up to a 20' bass boat through the water easily. Seems they would do a nice job of hauling a bike down the road.

Luck on the project!

Title: Re: Help with e-bike. Building electric sidecar r
Post by ToesNose on 03/23/14 at 05:06:20

I think it's a great idea Stimpy, I'm sure that weighted properly the bike/sidecar is very doable on flat/moderate grades, but with two people and all that extra weight I would think any decent uphill grade is a vein buster!

Title: Re: Help with e-bike. Building electric sidecar r
Post by v-pilot on 03/23/14 at 20:57:35

Wow, that thing is cool! I just read the thread...wish I could help. If dad was still with us he could have, he was an electrical engineer. What aprilia do you have? Me...RSVR and Falco

Title: Re: Help with e-bike. Building electric sidecar r
Post by Stimpy - FSO on 03/31/14 at 02:50:29

So I ordered a controller for like $50, there is no other way,
the voltage regulator I will now use as my throttle.

What I couldn't figure out is how one can make a 3-phase electric
motor run from a single 2 wire DC source with no ground wire,
so this is where the controller comes in.

It seems these "modern" bicycle motors work with a 3-phasic
frequency generated by the controller that leaves many thousands
of micro-second gaps between the pulses and this is important
because within these gaps "free" electricity is generated by the
magnets and in theory from every 60 seconds of DC power your
e-bike need it only consumes, let's say, 45sec worth.

Someone online told me that he perfectly managed to use direct DC
on his 3-lead e-bike BUT that first of all he needed to get the bike
moving at a moderate seed and THEN switch the power on but I
still dont get it, I would first need to see the wiring diagram.

I'll keep you posted once my controller arrives and I hook it up,
have a good one everyone!

Anyways here is the controller I got:

http://s15.postimg.org/xjvqj8ddn/image.jpg

Title: Re: UPDATE: ebike, building electric sidecar rig.
Post by Stimpy - FSO on 06/12/14 at 13:36:11

(...just in case anyone gives a hamster's behind)

it's done!

since weeks actually, the odometer is already clocking at close to
100 miles since the electric front hub is operational.

The controller for the tri-phasic motor worked fine and after a few
test runs, some tweeking and few blown fuses i've had no problems
so far.

I did once go off the road into a bush because I took a curve too fast
but it all turned out alright except after we got home my kid told his
mom, "mom, guess what mommy, we had an accident!".

After this I stabilize the frame some with 2 more attachment points to
the bike, installed a seatbelt and a rollbar because this things now
reaches (if I pedal REALLY hard) a whopping 20mph and this might
not sound like much but remember that this contraption was once
literally a frame, a kid's metal BED frame that I found on the attic.
Not so shabby for some old forgotten scrap metal

The electronics are on the handlebars as well as inside the boot
and the batteries behind the seat next to the first aid kit :D

Anyway, take care all and here are the pics
if anyone has any questions or comments, shoot.

http://s9.postimg.org/hnsw6zrcf/03032008223.jpg
http://s28.postimg.org/hsiuzlr59/03032008224.jpg
http://s14.postimg.org/5ih3tf1ox/03032008225.jpg
http://s11.postimg.org/edoxbokwj/11062014313.jpg
http://s23.postimg.org/grtp0swa3/11062014314.jpg
http://s28.postimg.org/xwntclyul/11062014315.jpg
http://s3.postimg.org/uov17djrn/11062014316.jpg
http://s30.postimg.org/602yuzmqp/11062014317.jpg
http://s4.postimg.org/7wdob0hal/11062014318.jpg
http://s29.postimg.org/n9b4hbqw7/11062014319.jpg
http://s30.postimg.org/ur6fe168x/11062014320.jpg
http://s18.postimg.org/qgqe7zppl/11062014322.jpg
http://s15.postimg.org/u70g9r9tn/11062014324.jpg
http://s11.postimg.org/mjkrf2dar/11062014325.jpg
http://s21.postimg.org/i9ri7rlif/11062014326.jpg
http://s29.postimg.org/6ngj4ygvb/11062014330.jpg
http://s22.postimg.org/rau3ljvld/160220073371.jpg
http://s12.postimg.org/oilp8f5kt/160220073372.jpg

Title: Re: UPDATE: ebike, building electric sidecar rig.
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/12/14 at 13:43:44

I LOVE it! & 20 MPH is plenty,, Youve only got so much rubber on the road & braking capacity, Someone pull out on you & youll know 20 is plenty,, I wish you could weigh it,, & have you considered a switch on the brake lever that also flips the way it is wired & makes the hub a generator & pokes a little juice back in the battery? Probably not worth doing, youre probably able to just coast down more than hit the brakes.

Title: Re: UPDATE: ebike, building electric sidecar rig.
Post by Stimpy - FSO on 06/12/14 at 13:58:52

...mmmm, let me see, I've been lifting 5 gallon jugs of water
all my life, 2 at a time sometimes, let me go and lift it and I'll
give you my estimate but it's not that heavy, the bike is alu,
the frame hollow steel-alloy and the boot's metal sheet is as
thick a those little japanese datsuns from the 70's;
give me 5 min.

Title: Re: UPDATE: ebike, building electric sidecar rig.
Post by Stimpy - FSO on 06/12/14 at 14:32:07

My guess is that it feels as heavy as three or four 5-gallon jugs,
hard to tell, that would be about 120-150lbs.

ok, the batteries (there are 3 of them) are 11lbs each, so 33lbs
the GT beach cruiser is made of stainless steel and is also 33lbs
according to the manufacturerand, the frame was maybe 20lbs
and the boot I could lift with ease at maybe 50lbs
so far we have 136lbs

and only the magnesium side wheel is missing
that came from an old kawasaki 400, so how much
would that weigh? 20lbs?

So 156lbs + all the screws and such, there you have it,
have a great day :D

Title: Re: UPDATE: ebike, building electric sidecar rig.
Post by Pine on 06/13/14 at 11:42:12

That... is very COOL! CONGRATZ!