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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> eng life of s40 /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1391025282 Message started by victorbsa on 01/29/14 at 11:54:42 |
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Title: eng life of s40 Post by victorbsa on 01/29/14 at 11:54:42 I know this is not a logical question, as it depends on care oil change, etc. I always had british large single. They required frequent rebuilds and lots of fine tuning. well, one of the suzukis I bought, upon disassemble , appears to have been very neglected. the previous owner rode it with noise coming from the eng., and the cam chain broke. The eng. shows 27,000 miles on it. Could the lower end still be worth repairing the upper, or am I trowing money away? I just wonder how long some of you guys,who I can tell take very good care of your machine, are getting (mileage wiz) out of the engines. I can and have found machines near by with 7-10k on them for $15 - $18 hundred dollars. Thanks |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by verslagen1 on 01/29/14 at 11:57:30 cost is relative to where you're at. Quote:
I can get a new bike with that kind of mileage. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by Serowbot on 01/29/14 at 12:12:49 You can go 50 to 100k if you take care of them... If it was neglected,... I'd mostly be worried about the oil pump in the bottom end... Not many people here have split the cases in the bottom end... There is a modified cam-chain adjuster available in the Marketplace section of this site... (worth installing)... Stators tend to go 20 to 50k miles... pretty easy to replace under the left sidecase... I guess I'd open up the head and inspect the damage before deciding... |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by pgambr on 01/29/14 at 16:02:31 Just curious, what's a stator? :-? |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by Dave on 01/29/14 at 17:43:20 2A3D3B3738285A0 wrote:
On the left side of the engine crankshaft is the charging circuit, along with the part that sends the signal for the spark timing. The part that is connected to the crankshaft and rotates....is the rotor. The part that is connected to the cover is stationary...and is the stator. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by pgambr on 01/29/14 at 18:12:29 Thanks, I've heard the term, but didn't know. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/29/14 at 18:47:49 If the cam chain actually broke, Id call it junk. If the tensioner came apart & shot its spring into the gears, its probably toast. Ohh,, you can save it, but the $$$ & time arent worth it, Ive seen a Savage with over 90,000 miles, not KM.. & it looked like hell,, rust & scraped up, torn seat, not loved on a lot.. But, It was gettin someone to work & back, so, the important stuff musta been gettin done, Cam chain, oil changes, an occasional valve setting,, Rotella T is the cheapest good oil. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by HoustonBussa on 01/30/14 at 07:17:10 474B5841454B4E4B47455C2A0 wrote:
I've seen these bikes at $1500-1800 that hadn't blown it's load as you. described. I mean if he's going for a couple of hundred and you find a motor, all day and day. That said and done, everything I've seen and read says with the right love, they will run for quite some time. But if it was ridden hard and put away wet, the work involved would be more than the bike is worth. And depending on the year, that may be $1500. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by Dave on 01/30/14 at 08:53:12 VictorBSA: With some basic maintenance the Savage motor is reliable and durable. If you keep it filled with good oil, pay attention to the cam chain tensioner and install the Versy modified tensioner when necessary, and run good fuel through it....the bike doesn't require much else. We have one member who has not had the head, cylinder or crankcase apart and has gone more than 100,000 miles - but he has done maintenenace and replaced cam chains and some other parts. If...on the other hand you use an oil without an adequate amount of ZDDP, run the engine low on oil, run too low of an idle speed, and ignore the cam chain tensioner......you can ruin these engines pretty quickly. One problem is that they don't hold a lot of oil and they don't use much at normal speeds - but owners can be caught by surprise when they get on the interstate and run over 70mph and run low on oil before they know what happened. If you just need a ring job, cam chain tensioner upgrade, and some basic maintenance they are all affordable and doable. If you get a worn out or broken engine.......it is most often cheaper to buy a low mileage engine from a crashed bike. Used engines with 2,500 miles can go for $ 600 - $ 800 from places like Pinwall Cycles who specialize in parting out crashed bikes. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by stinger on 01/30/14 at 13:47:14 I do not know what i would sell my bike for because with 53,000 miles on it, it actually is cleaner than new. (2003). it has never leaked oil anywhere and not blowing smoke and runs quietly. It should have maybe blown up long ago because I'm still on my second cam chain and the only oil I have ever used is cheap auto oil from Wal-Mart. I do like to use Castro 50 wt oil and to be fair, I guess I use it more often than not but the cheap stuff at 50 wt seems to work well in my bike. I just change it every 1,000 to 1,500 miles. But for less than $7 for 2 qts,you can. I am getting ready to install the Vers mod but still not sure until I open it up if it is really needed as of yet. Runs too smooth and quiet. I have adjusted the valves twice in all of those miles and I just checked them and they are dead on. I would like to get at least 75,000 or more before I have to do any engine repairs. Been pretty lucky but it seems to run as strong and as quiet as the day I bought it off the show room floor. Now I have to go knock on wood! |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by WD on 01/30/14 at 22:29:27 One catastrophic engine failure at 200K+ miles on the old forum. Blew itself to pieces on the freeway in SoCal... The rest was mostly minor nonsense. Known design failures: cam chain tensioner, entire electrical system (including the ignition circuit), seat (either version), petcock, vacuum slide carburetor, and those worse than useless IRC tires. That said, mine is on its 5th or 6th major redo... I can't kill it (and I neglect it for years at a time, and occasionally race it). I can't give it away (done so twice and it found its way home). Got sick of the stock look, so it now looks like it was built in the 40s or 50s. Picked up an old set of AEE cast aluminum dog bone risers for it yesterday... rigid frame conversion to come once Voodoo corrects a few glaring flaws with their kit... |
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Title: more questions.... Post by victorbsa on 01/30/14 at 17:08:34 After all the replies to my engine life questions ,I started taking eng. apart.The cam chain,as stated broke when the guy I bought it from was driving it. It also had half a link broke in another spot. The poor guy paid $900 for the bike with 25k on it. He only rode it 2 months before it fell apart. The cam chain was also worn and chewed up on one side. The head also had marks from the chain rubbing on it some how. I had several triumph 500 singles in the 70"s so these jap over head cam engines are greek to me! I have to admit it seems far superior to any of the old english bikes I ever had. I have fallen in love with it after only riding it a couple miles.My goal is to make it as close to my old triumph (in appearance and performance ) as possible. I don't care for the rear controls RYCA offers but everything else they got is really sharp. I would like to make the foot pegs in the middle some how, as well as making the bike look like a scrambler...hi exhaust pipe and kenda dual sport tires. Does anyone got a line on different pipes for these bikes? as cool as RYCA pipes are they are very expensive ,or I'm cheap?? I also asked RYCA about making the bobber,but using the stock rear shocks instead of the ridge frame . Or making the street tracker using the stock gas tank (or even the sportster looking bobber tank) instead of there modified kit tank. They don't seem very helpful with deviating from their kits. though it would bring the price down quite a bit just using your own tank. Does anyone have a pic of the RYCA cafe or tracer with a stock or sportster tank on it? Thank you all for your replies! I learned more from you guys in a couple days than I would have ever figured out on my own. It's really nice to have a place where everyone has the same bike and ideas. One last question..If I can find a low milage eng. would a stage one cam, and a mikuni carb make a big differance in performance, with out going crazy with money? I want to keep the large single eng no matter what Thanks |
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Title: Re: more questions.... Post by engineer on 01/30/14 at 18:26:16 If you like the look of British bikes look at what this guy did. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1369527081/18 CommanderChaos had some other posts with pictures of a Savage made to look something like an old BSA. I am having trouble finding the earlier posts right now but they are there. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by Dave on 01/31/14 at 05:17:11 My recommended order of engine improvements would be, in order of cost and amount of labor required: 1) Muffler and carb jetting. 2) Cam 3) Open up donut at exhaust port a little bit. 4) Mikuni VM36 Carb 5) Wiseco and cylinder bore. The items 2, 4 and 5 can be interchanged a bit....depending on the condition of your engine and carb. If your engine has a bad carb, then adding the Mikuni instead of replacing it with a stock carb makes sense. Same for the Wiseco - if your stock rings and piston are worn then you might as will upgrade to the Wiseco. The carb alone does not make a huge difference in performance - but the engine does become a little faster to respond to throttle changes and the backfire issue behaves a little different. The Stage 1 cam work well with the stock piston and carb and the engine runs a bit better with it and the fuel mileage does not suffer much. The Wiseco is listed last not because it offers the least amount of improvement (I actually feel it might offer the most improvement) - but it is very labor intensive and does require the engine to be out of the frame, and some expensive gaskets. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/31/14 at 07:54:43 Quote:
We may have the same bike, but we dont have the same ideas,, we dont even know the same stuff,, but, get enough of us together on a problem & youre gonna get a coupla decent answers.. Now about locating an engine,,There are bike junk yards, & then theres Ebay http://www.ebay.com/sch/Motorcycle-Parts-/10063/i.html?_nkw=suzuki+savage+650 http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mPM_h7TRQprg6LmedBYhLtg.jpg |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by verslagen1 on 01/31/14 at 08:09:22 Victor hasn't said where he's at... I get the feeling he's across the pond. So bay of fleas finds aren't gonna do him no good. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by victorbsa on 02/01/14 at 10:07:38 I'm in the land of taxes NY about 6 miles from Niagara Falls. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/01/14 at 10:13:46 Id sure like to know just exactly what broke the cam chain.. as for there being a 1/2 link in it, that bothers me,, this isnt the compound on a drilling rig,,These chains arent built with splitting & adding a 1/2 link in mind. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by victorbsa on 02/01/14 at 10:31:16 I did not mean a half link was broke. Just one peice of a whole link was broke. So it was getting ready to break in another place. It also had wear on the side...like it was rubbing on something they I have yet to figure out. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/01/14 at 10:42:46 A chain runnin & rubbing is gonna make some stuff in the oil. Its gonna get in the sump,, I cant see it as anything but an engine killer,, You mite have gotten lucky enough that it didnt splash into the bottom end bearings & maybe the filter caught it all & maybe none of it is hung up in oil passages,, but Id be way concerned with the idea of putting $$$ in that engine, Was the rubbing on the side toward the piston or toward the outside? |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by victorbsa on 02/01/14 at 10:50:48 since even if just what I found is all that is wrong,(i'm sure there is much more) like some one said the parts, gaskets, hi mileage,etc., I can find a used engine for close or even less. I think I'm going to push this aside, maybe use for a training aid, and just look for the motor. |
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Title: Re: eng life of s40 Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/01/14 at 11:42:11 Yep,, Youve got a nice little something to take apart. I dunno what the cost of gaskets would be, but that engine isnt high mileage. The condition of bottom end bearings would be a concern for me, but, IF you take it apart carefully with POssibly putting it back together in mind, you just mite save it, but then, I have no idea what the cost of puting it back together would be, so, I guess if ya knew that goin in, youd have an idea about whether or not you need to be careful taking it apart,, I think pulling the stator takes a special tool, but, if the engine is junk, the time to get in just for the fun of doin it may not be a good investment,, unless you can beg or borrow any tools. |
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