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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payments /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1382973716 Message started by Oldfeller on 10/28/13 at 08:21:56 |
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Title: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payments Post by Oldfeller on 10/28/13 at 08:21:56 So Why Is Google Funding Its Own Competition In The Firefox OS? http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2013/01/22/so-why-is-google-funding-its-own-competition-in-the-firefox-os/ So, the financial folks at Forbes are all in a frothing mental tizzy because they just can't figure out pure open source as a business model. They have a tough time with Google, because Google seems to spend a lot of money "philanthropically" to a pure business sense point of view. They also seem to think that Google makes money almost accidentally, but then they try to figure it out according to their own "never do anything without a known pay back plan" mentality. And then they confuse the causality assbackwards trying to invent a payback plan / business model that makes mental sense to their minds.. ================== So, simply start with some completely separated facts -- "$300 million a year is paid at present, a payment for Google being the default search page on any Firefox download". Google pays you for hits on ads and hits on source pages -- that's the original Google business plan and it works the same for anybody. New separate fact: The Mozilla Foundation has used their paltry $300 million in Google revenue to fund the creation of Firefox phone OS which BTW then increases their $300 million in Google hit money some by using Google as the default search page on any Firefox download on the phones too. So, Mozilla chooses to spend their hit money to put out a competing OS that is pure HTML5 compatible and that that pays no heed to Google's Play Store or other "lock in" type Android marketplace items. So, Google isn't getting much back directly from Firefox phone other than hits on their search page (which means they sell their ads with known hits, which is paid for by the advertisers). They get their original business model's profit level off the Firefox search pages and the ads hits they provide to Google (money comes from the advertising companies). The part that Forbes will never get is that Google actively cooperates with Firefox (their competitor) because they are both are open source products. They both shop at and donate back to the same big open source grocery stores, Linaro and the Kernel Store. Heck, Firefox can ask for and get help from Google, and vice versa very easily by doing the "ask Linaro" trick. What would drive the Forbes guys totally nuts is Google also allows Sailfish and Tisen competitive OS products to actually download stuff out of their Google Play Store. Yup, Tisen and Sailfish can run all them goodie Android apps .... Because they see so much "irrational activity" Forbes and Wall Street will down rate Google's stock periodically. That's OK, it just goes right back up again .... ;) Yup, and I find it totally amazing that Mozilla Foundation can take far less money than Microsoft ACTUALLY REALLY LOSES doing dumb dumb stuff each year to create and fund the successful Firefox browsers and operating systems which are growing very rapidly in market share .... while MS still shrinks year on year on year. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Pine on 10/28/13 at 08:44:35 I wish I could recall the URL of the video I saw. It shows a kid telling his teacher in the 1980s that he wants to start a business and give away all his products. At which point the business teacher faints. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/28/13 at 09:20:13 Google & NSA = twin brothers. Its how they are getting the info on where people go. Google is spending OUR $$,, its not about a business decision, it doesnt make sense, really, does it? When things dont make sense from one direction,, try another point of view.. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 10/28/13 at 20:12:19 Google Android is being "side jacked" quite a bit lately, now that IT IS #1, the numerically predominate OS system on the planet. The Chinese for example do not like stock Google Android any more, and have cooked up versions of their own. And yes Virginia, Chinese "Android" tablets do contain spywares and trackers and back doors and who knows what else built right into the hardware itself. Cyanogen (used to be Cyanogen Mod) is now building a custom Android version for major Chinese phone bullders, as is Rockchip, the RK-3188 chipmaker company. Samsung has now moved completely away from using plain Jane vanilla Google Android, and they have started shipping a forked Android with their own home grown replacements for all the non-free Google support softwares that Google retains the sole ownership of. This is significant as Samsung sells more phones than anybody else, more TVs and more forms of appliances than anybody else right now. All of these custom Android modifier folks are putting in the resizable windows and other "real work" capabilities into their Android experience. Whether Google does it or not, Android will soon be a full functional OS experience capable of content creation, not just viewing/consuming. And don't forget good old Amazon, the internet sales folks who have totally forked their Kindle Fire OS completely away from its open source roots into a totally non-free closed source conglomeration of their very own bits and pieces. Ditto to a lesser degree for Barnes and Noble, who has decided to go yet another year losing money putting out slightly substandard customized Nook hardware and software. Firefox OS and Sailfish OS are actually shipping now with Tisen OS about ready to come out and go for it as well. Of these 3 new OS systems Firefox is one that is totally new, original and open source -- with no entanglements to Android at this time at all. (but this may change with the next version or two into the future) Why? Because Sailfish and Tisen both can use their own custom apps out of their own app store AND YOU CAN ALSO GET INTO THE GOOGLE PLAY STORE WITH THEM TO LOAD UP ALL THOSE 400,000,000 ANDROID APPS AND GAMES AND STUFF. Yup, Sailfish and Tisen are Android app compatible .... ======== So, put your world view glasses on and take a look around the globe ======= Remember please, that more new phones and tablets will be sold this year and next year than ever even had existed PERIOD before this past year -- the rate of "trade up" and all the brand new markets opening up to smart phones is simply HUGELY BIG, much much bigger than most folks can readily realize. Right now we have four complete A9, A12, A15 and A57 ARM generations of processors from at least a dozen suppliers, all of them running balls to the walls on all of their old original production lines and original nanometer levels located all over the world just to make enough chips to make all the new phones and tablets and smart TVs and this and thats that will be sold this year and next. More folks will compute for the very first time in the next 2 years than all of the folks who had ever computed before in the history of the world up until right now -- with all these new folks hitting in the next 24 months. And when the production numbers get rolled up for the next few years, it will be Mediatek and Rockchip holding down the first two "highest number of phone/tablet SOCs sold" slots, with Qualcomm mebbe inching one of them out or else coming in third place with Samsung coming in 4th place. Unless they can change some stuff up Allwinner isn't going to place very well in this ranking, as they are currently stuck at the 40nm lithography level right now and unless they can get down into the 16-20nm production space race they are doomed to slide yet further down into the pack. Mediatek does have a plan for a whole lot of new low nanometer chipsets, so one must assume they have invested in production space at one of the new 16-20nm foundry plants being built as we speak. Note please that Samsung is starting to use Mediatek SOCs in their own low end products rather than their own lesser processors (cost is the reason for this). ======================= Now, are ARM chipsets powerful enough to do a laptop now? Can you really do real work on an ARM device like you use to do on a PC? You take a look and you tell me. :D This dude was simply just trying to see if he could load all of his cores up 100% using stock Ubuntu on an Odroid XU development board, so he simply lit up everything he had and THEN HAD TO GO SCHEDULE A COMPLETE RECOMPILE JOB OF HIS LINUX OPERATING KERNEL JUST SO HE COULD FINALLY GET A 100% LOAD ON ALL 4 OF HIS ARM A15 CORES. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rCVEJTNHXw[/media] |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Pine on 10/29/13 at 06:35:51 56494F4855526353635B49450E3C0 wrote:
1) this is café... tread lightly 2) as an IT person for 30 years and hobbiest/student since 1979... I have watched ( with glee) the systems grow. Google, at one time was a strong opponent of what you claim. While factually, I suspect that google does supply whatever the NSA forces them too, I doubt that Google was ever happy about it. 3) NSA does not pay for data. They show up at your day, remind you that you can be made to "disappear", and give a place to drop the info they demand. They hold all the cards, and the table.. and the floor. As to new boom... I am watching it. My wife now has a Samsung, as does my son.. daughter is still iPhone, while I struggle with my dumb phone. Still I think you hit the nail squarely with the statement of the "consuming" of data. I still think the current crop and the near future of them, while techinaclly capable, will find the majority of the US users.. using them soley as "apps" containers. Ubuntu, still sends chills down the spine of the normal (Windows) user. Globally, this may not be the case. Will children in the US become "stupid" app junkies while the China and others re-enforce "real" computing skills ala Linux? |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 10/29/13 at 07:48:37 This is a real concern, the "dummbie" USA kiddies thing. UK has recognized that their public schools were teaching NOTHING USEFUL about computing technology to their kids at all, the Raspberry Pi Foundation was started to combat that phenomenon with some small success, getting some basic practical programming into the kid's educational mix. Nuts and bolts type stuff, very useful to know. What they really did succeed at was putting a little bitty Linux PC into the kids hands for them to carry home with them. And they did. At 1.75 million total devices sold at this point in time. The default Raspberry Pi operating system, Raspian, is a complete Debian OS system that allows the kid internet access, etc etc etc. so they actually took home their first PC, thanks to the public school system. Kids here in the USA are not stupid, they do have a phone on them (so Mommy can find them when she wants to) and it is amazing how far they can stretch that one single device into a relatively complete kids texting/blogging culture type thing. However, they like all Americans see Windows as "real computers" and everything else as consumption devices. Asia does not see it this way. Android, totally tuned to their own language is their OS of choice, always has been their OS of choice. Phones and tablets, and the big screen home TV for a base station. Work boxes (Windows or Linux) are owned by work and stay there .... personally owned stuff is Android all the way. =========== Speaking of Windows, Microsoft has been kinda quiet lately. Still no CEO hired .... They have put out Win 8.1 and it is making no ripples in the pond for very much ..... Microsoft has renamed all the flopped RT devices and are still trying to sell them off again, this time around with a new software set -- all the software and all the advertising this time around making no claims for anything at all for working with anything but just what is found in their own app store. Looks like MS is just treading water, finishing out all Ballmer's old screw ups and just waiting for that new CEO to come on board and offer them some new directions. (this is new, MS is just telling the truth this time) |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by verslagen1 on 10/29/13 at 09:01:44 587B7371727B7B7265170 wrote:
Having been educated in the art of computer language in my youth and not finding much application in my chosen trade except for the occasional tirade in basic... I don't find this particularly alarming. Most business uses can be accomplished with existing app's. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 10/29/13 at 09:16:20 Yes, but some of your public school basic programming language classmates went on to be programmers -- in England they realized that nobody was going into the programming field because they had never been exposed to it, ever, period. Broadcom England realized they could not hire any British programmers because there were none coming up through the schools .... thus they realized they had a serious problem. Does everybody need to be able to program? No, but you need to have enough programmers to write the apps that everybody else will run. To do this they need to be exposed to it early enough to pick it as a career path .... Thus, sometimes during their education every kid needs to be exposed to programming, at least at some small level, so the natural "programmers" can realize they like doing it. Do you remember being exposed to music while in school? Exposed to writing? Taught the scientific method that is used in developing new knowledge? Same thing, quit exposing kids to music and within 2 generations you won't have very much new music going on. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 10/29/13 at 10:07:53 http://liliputing.com/2013/10/arm-unveils-mali-t760-mali-t720-graphics.html http://cdn.liliputing.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/mali-t700-600x409.jpg Oh, what does it mean? ARM does not need to issue new CPU specs right now as they have an entire generation out there that is untapped right now awaiting 16/20nm production plants to be completed and brought on line. BUT, they can add additional power to the existing A12 and A53/A57 generations by putting out massively better/stronger GPUs with "complete in the hardware" GPU compute integration. So, instead of getting a lowly quad core A12 from Rockchip chunking away at your stuff with 4 each 1.8 ghz cores you can have (potentially) four dedicated CPU cores and 8 up to 16 GPU cores computing away at your stuff at any given time (if needed). :D Does it matter? Heck yes, it is Apple's bread and butter high performance trick -- it is how they survive using only dual core CPUs in all their products, they will tap the GPU cores when needed. Progress, she comes .... |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by verslagen1 on 10/29/13 at 11:08:40 092A2220232A2A2334460 wrote:
DO YOU PROMISE? |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 10/29/13 at 11:18:58 Yep, all you'll get is rap music. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Pine on 10/29/13 at 11:28:33 Waiting for Arteacher to chime in.... |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 10/29/13 at 16:18:39 Would you like Android with that PC monitor? http://cdn.liliputing.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/viewsonic-VSD241.jpg http://liliputing.com/2013/10/lilbits-10-29-2013-like-android-pc-monitor.html Hmmmmm .... I wonder if the monitor has upgradable software or root access available. Yup, it has a SD card and a USB drive available so it already has bootable media already on it ..... ;) The 24” (23.8” Vis.) VSD241 is a self-contained Android 4.2 Jelly Bean-based smart display which delivers blazing fast performance, courtesy of an NVIDIA® Tegra® 3 quad-core processor, making it perfect for local Android apps and cloud-based computing. Paired with a 2MP webcam with integrated microphone for video conferencing, and built-in speakers, this dual-point optical touch screen display is ideal for commercial vertical markets such as signage, point of information, and kiosks for interactive applications in enterprise, SMB, education, POS, hospitality and more.For further functionality and interactivity, the VSD241 offers connectivity options, including HDMI® for connecting a notebook or tablet, as well as two full-sized USB ports,a micro USB and a mini USB,and SD card storage. So, now we have LOW END MONITOR people realizing they had better start selling complete Android computers or "everything will go over to the tablets ASAP" and leave them without a business. Viewsonic, smart orientals |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 11/01/13 at 03:51:45 ttp://venturebeat.com/2013/10/31/android-captures-record-81-global-market-share-windows-phone-is-fastest-growing/ http://venturebeat.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/screen-shot-2013-10-31-at-11-15-11-am.png?w=544&h=549 News flash, the total world of computing grew by 45% just this past quarter. It is going to grow 2-3x next year alone. Then again in the next year. Almost all of this meteoric growth is in the phone/tablet realm. None of it is in the traditional desktop, very little (nothing much beyond replacement actually) is in the traditional laptop. As tablets grow keyboard covers and laptops grow touch screens this new class of hybrid input style units are making up a whole new class of machine that is now just being recognized. Soon sales of these hybrid "do anything" units will become more significant as the super thin laptop slowly blends into this style as well. Touch screen will be required, after all. Lump in the 22" smart monitors and 24" smart TVs (units with android built right into them) and you suddenly have a second new way to compute that didn't really exist a year ago. I think we will see new BIG touch screen "All in ones" will become more interesting for the desktop space. Samsung has also come out with mobile resize-able windows on their larger tablets. This makes 3 sources now for the resize-able Windows functionality in Android. So, right now Rockchip, Ixonos and Samsung will sell you a large tablet with resize-able movable windows. KitKat is out now. No new features at all, instead Google spent time removing a good bit of fat and slow this time around. KitKat will run well on a dual core processor and with only 512 meg of systems memory. Count on the next L version to be all trim & slim as well -- this way Android doesn't give up the new third world cheapie smart phone boom over to Firefox completely. With literally everybody in the world concentrating on cashing in on the cell phone and tablet boom that is going on it will likely be a year or so before anything really really revolutionary gets designed and built (apart from the ongoing phone / tablet wars that is). However, the successful companies riding this HUGE HUGE boom will come out at the end flush with money and strong with technical know how -- and in a position to BUY up the lesser companies for any technology they think they need that the little guy owns. Importance of Linux desktop distros in this Android future world ???? If Android successfully puts together the ease of use of traditional distro with tablet touch controls and gaming -- then Linux distros will be a tiny sliver of the tiny "other" sliver and we will all use the original OS. And IF it is coming to pass that if Google won't do it right, then Samsung and the other players have shown they can -- even if it means buying up (or creating) a Cyanogen to get what they need. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by verslagen1 on 11/01/13 at 09:37:19 77545C5E5D54545D4A380 wrote:
What you've said before about these OS's having built in back doors has me bugged. And seeing this I would be more comfortable buying a google product. At least someone has gone thru the OS and chased out a few rats. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 11/01/13 at 09:50:27 Normal Google has the same NSA required back doors -- all American based softwares have them since the Windows 3.1 era. Chinese tablets have software and hardware back doors, as China requires access much the same as our NSA does. People slam at Google for actually SAYING this out loud, that if you compute over the internet you have NO REAL EXPECTATION of privacy. Google knows what is built into their OS at NSA's governmental requirements, and they had the balls to say so out loud. Bill Gates had enough balls and he said the same thing back in the day when it all first started. If you don't like this, go get you some Sailfish or Firefox OS -- and I bet it will still have SOMEBODY's required back door stuck in it in it that NSA will find quickly enough. Hell, what do you want to bet that the ARM chip designs don't have British back door requirements built right into the design? All government and police want to see inside your device, and they can also tap into all the internet nodes under their control as well. Brittan has cameras on light poles EVERYWHERE -- it is the most invasive, security ridden western culture I have seen so far. And ARM is British. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by verslagen1 on 11/01/13 at 12:00:02 My government... No one can do nothing about, as we all know they operate outside the law. Others, I'd hope my govmt would exclude from intrusion into my stuff because they are selfish with my data, not because of any moral reason. |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 11/01/13 at 22:36:41 Now that Rockstar Bidco (a 32 person shell company, a specially created patent troll sock puppet company created by Microsoft, Apple and Blackberry) has sued ol' Google and is seeking a "cease and desist order" on all current Android OS shipments, do you think that having Mozilla Foundation's Firefox OS out there with NO entanglements with Google AT ALL, using only open source Linux code is a pretty durn good idea? Are you surprised that the open source community has some extra strings for their bows, knowing just how nasty Apple and Microsoft really really are? That nobody saw this coming? Lawsuits like this generally take about 2-3 years to totally settle out, unless they get tossed out immediately by the sitting judge. So, this next 2-3 years is a critical period as the smart phone market will grow abruptly to QUADRUPLE OR BETTER IN SIZE during this short short period of time. You got 3 players out there that WILL NOT BE AFFECTED by the Google/Rockstar Bidco Lawsuit. These are Firefox, Sailfish and Tisen. You got players already positioned to custom fork out their own Android flavors based out of NON-USA based companies and countries. Samsung is one (but they are named in the Google/Rockstar Bidco Lawsuit as co-offenders already). You will hear more about the pure Linux phones as open source swings additional effort over to make them the very next latest greatest & best phone/tablet OS out there. This will happen ASAP if Android really does get tripped up by the Rockstar Bidco sock puppet in court. Expect to get yourself some negative feedback, you Rockstar Bidco creating jerks. Microsoft has "no-sue" agreements in place with Samsung and others and having a 32 person shell company sue somebody for you, Microsoft, is a very thin legal line to hide behind. Samsung should sue Microsoft for breach of contract, to recover all the money paid to Microsoft in that no-sue agreement. >:( |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 11/02/13 at 07:23:12 Telefonica brings Firefox OS phones to Mexico, Peru, Uruguay http://liliputing.com/2013/10/telefonica-brings-firefox-os-phones-mexico-peru-uruguay.html The FUD created by the Rockstar set of lawsuits is creating extra demand for an alternative phone OS. This slot used to be filled up by Windows phones, but the very high prices charged for such phones are precluding their use in the lower cost countries. Plus, MS is starting to stink a bit lately in the eyes of the big worldwide telecon companies. Look to see Windows take yet another decline in market share as reaction to their lawsuits and other bullshite continues. >:( |
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Title: Re: Firefox is being 100% funded from Google payme Post by Oldfeller on 11/03/13 at 12:03:23 Samsung rolls Tizen forward with a "finishing" developer phone [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TUgZBwZybU[/media] So, go sue Android all you want Apple/Microsoft/Blackberry, we will just roll our stuff over into a full open source phone based out of a NON-USA company that you CAN'T sue without suing the entire open source world. And the court you will get judged in has already ruled on people attacking open source for specious reasons -- it jest ain't a gonna happen. |
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