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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> starting with out the decompression soleniod
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Message started by dirty dog on 08/02/13 at 13:07:50

Title: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by dirty dog on 08/02/13 at 13:07:50

I have a Q about starting with out the dec.soleniod I'm going to use
a tumb leaver or maybe a compression release on the handlebars
like a sr500 or old brit bike. any info would help. it's a 87 hardtail. :-?

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by Dave on 08/02/13 at 14:05:32

The thumb lever on the decompression shaft may work - but I did not have room between my cylinder head and tank and I had to mount a thumb lever on the handebar to run a cable to the decompression shaft. I found out that a thumb lever won't work....been there....done that. Your thumb is not strong enough to pull the exhaust valves open if they are closed. You might be able to make this work with a lever that is about half the size of a clutch/brake lever. My thumb lever will work to hold the valve open if the valve is already open when you pull the lever......but if that is the case it starts fine anyhow as the engine spins a full revolution before it comes up on compression and it starts fine.

So far my bike is starting without using the decompression lever almost every time. Occasionally I hit a point where the engine is on the compression stroke and the starter won't budge my Wiseco 95mm with 10:1 compression. When that happens I have to take my finger off the starter button, put the bike in 2nd gear, rock the bike backwards until it is off the compression stroke, put the bike in neutral, and then hit the starter button.

I have no idea how things would work at cold temperatures.......I don't ride when it is below 60 degrees.

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by dirty dog on 08/02/13 at 14:14:55

Thanks that helps a lot I think I'll run a small leaver on the handle bars
like the old britt bikes 8-)

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by Dave on 08/03/13 at 07:55:49

If you use a small lever, it is going to have to use soldered on cable ends. Cable ends with a set screw will not hold tight enough.

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by dirty dog on 08/03/13 at 12:18:38

Thanks

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by clearush on 08/03/13 at 19:58:46

Thumb lever on the decomp works fine. Several of us have them. But you can't the glory caps on the bike.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1338020228/7#7

But it does get very hot so using it to start a hot engine be careful not to burn yourself.

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by savagerider87 on 08/03/13 at 23:41:35

112A2730212D36302B232E31420 wrote:

dave, are those clip ons i see?? im digging the look if u dont mind me asking What did they come off from?

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by Dave on 08/04/13 at 18:27:50

Yes, those are clip ons. It is a long story and can be seen here:
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1358099938

I have a set of clip ons that I can sell you at a reduced price. They are Woodcraft and I liked them because you can bolt and unbolt them without taking off the fork tubes - but they interfered with my RM400 yokes and the TrailTech Vapor mount. They came with 7/8" bars, but I can send you some 1" bars to work with the stock 1" diameter controls. I changed everything over to pieces for 7/8" bars to lose the look of the cruiser sized controls.

Dave

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by savagerider87 on 08/04/13 at 20:35:32

i love the look of the clip ons but im torn about taking the factory bars off... I have the flat bars that are original to my bike and ive heard that there arent very many that were built with them, dont know if its true or not and i believe that 1987 was the only year for the savage to have that option. i could be wrong tho does anyone know if this is in fact true or not?

Title: Re: starting with out the decompression soleniod
Post by Gyrobob on 08/05/13 at 04:34:30

457E7364757962647F777A65160 wrote:

... Occasionally I hit a point where the engine is on the compression stroke and the starter won't budge my Wiseco 95mm with 10:1 compression. When that happens I have to take my finger off the starter button, put the bike in 2nd gear, rock the bike backwards until it is off the compression stroke, put the bike in neutral, and then hit the starter button. ...

One way to get it to push start is to get the piston just past the compression stroke, turn the ignition on, pull the "choke" out, push the bike in neutral (you only need maybe 5 mph), then hop on it and stab it into second gear right away. Don't mess with the clutch. Don't use any throttle until it starts. The slop in the driveline and the shock absorption in the rubber belt and the slow speed will keep from hurting the transmission when you stab it into second gear.

You can get it just past the compression stroke by putting the bike in 3rd or 4th, and pushing forward on the bike. It will slowly move the piston as the air in the combustion chamber leaks past the rings. RYCA bikes make this real easy with the lever-operated compression release.

It is important to have the bike just past the compression stroke (in the exhaust stroke), so it can spin over for a revolution and get up to an rpm where it will make it through the next compression stroke.

It is important to not turn the motor over backwards by pushing the bike in gear backwards or you might break some stuff inside. As Verslagen states in http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1337452721
"DON'T PUSH THE BIKE BACKWARD!!!
This engages the starter clutch, on pre90's bikes this will bust out the starter gear bosses. On a post90 bike you will hear a twang instead, that's the torque limiter doing its job."

Anyway, if the battery is truly dead and does not have enough oomph to move the compression release solenoid, trying to push start the bike with the piston on the compression stroke is impossible. The only way to have a chance is to get it just past the compression stroke so it has a chance to start turning over before it hits the next compression stroke.