SuzukiSavage.com /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Big Blue Claims Another Victim /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1374264800 Message started by Dane Allen on 07/19/13 at 13:13:20

Title: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/19/13 at 13:13:20 or - Motor City Throws A Rod. Quote: Detroit just became the largest municipal government ever to declare bankruptcy in the United States. It wasn't a surprise - except to the unions who were trying to file last-minute court cases to shut the bankruptcy filing down. Everyone knew there were big problems with the city's finances, to put it mildly. When the corrupt Democrats who ran Detroit into the ground over the past fifty years were finally swept aside, the emergency managers installed by Governor Rick Snyder asked creditors to take a 90 percent loss on their claims. They weren't terribly interested in such a deal. The media is frantically trying to spin away the effect Democrat Party dogma and one-party corruption had upon Detroit. You'll hear plenty of news reports about collapsing population - the city lost 25 percent of its residents over the past decade. But those people weren't abducted by alien flying saucers. You'll hear a lot about the auto industry's problems, but those problems were not primarily due to declining sales. No, this great city died because its ruling class of politicians and union bosses spent it into oblivion. Absurdly unsustainable pension plans created a towering mountain of unsustainable liability. The city treasury was looted for the benefit of officials and their very special friends, leaving municipal services at a Third World level. Taxes were raised, driving employers away. The auto industry collapsed under the weight of Big Labor's demands. Those who raised objections were told they were foolish to worry about the city's debt, because it would always be easy to borrow more money and crank up the tax rates to cover those staggering bills. Everyone in Detroit's power structure spent money like tomorrow would never come. Well, tomorrow is here, and the city is bankrupt. The same philosophy will destroy state governments, and then the federal government, in short order. Remember Detroit the next time you hear a left-wing hustler tell you government debt doesn't matter, except as an excuse for raising taxes. -- John Hayward Senior Writer

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by srinath on 07/19/13 at 13:56:50 Yea ... somehow people dont want to live in the arctic tundra either ... Lots of northern cities were thickly populated ... and I know why ... We invented heat a few million years before we invented A/C. NYC, boston, Minneapolis, seattle, chicago ... these should all be frucking corn, soybean and wheat fields. Not people fit at all. Anything North of the mason dixon line is populated because ... well, we had heat for a few millenia ... then came AC. You cant live without AC in Dallas TX or Alabama, or GA or SC or AZ ... So we live in arctic tundra, so we have heat, and we bear the summer cos its only 90 F. Anyway detriot is 10 X the size of NYC. Parts of it need to be razed to the ground and turned to corn fields. Yes and its serves as Dane's favorite whipping post ... Unions ... completely missing the whole export of jobs to canadia, mexico, china etc etc etc ... Cool. Srinath.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/19/13 at 14:32:16 75746F6867726E060 wrote: Yes and its serves as Dane's favorite whipping post ... Unions ... completely missing the whole export of jobs to canadia, mexico, china etc etc etc ... Cool. Srinath. Actually, it's government unions but good observation. But, to the point, it was the unions that caused the "whole export of jobs to canadia, mexico, china etc etc etc ..." through greed. Once union focus became enriching the unions at the expense of all else then the writing was on the wall and just a matter of time. Btw, Seattle is a pretty great city as are the surrounding counties and all the way up to the border.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/19/13 at 14:57:31 No, it was nafta.. AND, that was designed & pushed thru on the globalists agenda. We WILL be a 3rd world country. Thats how they plan on "leveling the playing field", we've been played,, its check mate, We have gone too close to the vortex to power our way back out, doesnt matter who sits behind the big desk, the game is over, just a matter of time now,

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Paraquat on 07/19/13 at 15:27:06 http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-TzYI7lkc808/T5cEdFN7a4I/AAAAAAAACJQ/-y-FWAFIjLg/s1600/Some%20Men%20Just%20Want%20to%20Watch%20the%20World%20Burn.jpg --Steve

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Starlifter on 07/19/13 at 17:14:49 Remember Detroit the next time you hear a left-wing hustler tell you government debt doesn't matter". Dane But..but...don't you remember?? While Ronald Reagan tripled the national debt and George W. Bush doubled it... D!ck Cheney famously declared in 2002,  "Government deficits don't matter". ...gosh I never knew those three guys were "left-wing hustlers". Thank goodness we have politically unbiased people here to give us the real facts.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/19/13 at 22:01:57 607F797E63645565556D7F73380A0 wrote: No, it was nafta.. AND, that was designed & pushed thru on the globalists agenda. We WILL be a 3rd world country. Thats how they plan on "leveling the playing field", we've been played,, its check mate, We have gone too close to the vortex to power our way back out, doesnt matter who sits behind the big desk, the game is over, just a matter of time now, Do you think NAFTA was in response to union abuses?

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/19/13 at 22:09:47 No, nafta was a tool cooked up by globalists to step us toward de-industrialization,

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/19/13 at 22:23:43 3C2325223F3809390931232F64560 wrote: No, nafta was a tool cooked up by globalists to step us toward de-industrialization, So, Marxists then....? The only globalist I am aware of.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Starlifter on 07/19/13 at 22:34:12 So, Marxists then....? The only globalist I am aware of. ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Serowbot on 07/19/13 at 23:19:04 It's the govn't.. the Marxists.. the lefties,..the righty's,.. the globalists... the unions,.. the aliens,... Nafta,.. the Chinese... ...(Dope slap)...   ...it's the money... The less a company can pay to make a product.... the less it will pay... When will you Righty's realize,.. it's the people you've been trained to defend, that are making you slaves.... You're too busy being grateful... that it hasn't hit you... yet... You must notice,.. that the divide between top and bottom is bigger than ever in US history... The middle,... (be afraid,.. French word) the bourgeois... is becoming non-existent... Hey,.. I had a shot at a Govn't retirement... but I lost it... I do resent that I lost it... but, I don't resent those that didn't...  That would be petty... We should all be treated as human...

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Starlifter on 07/20/13 at 12:19:26 The righty's have lost their collective minds. The have become a brainwashed cult believing whatever their masters in the ultra rightwing lunatic fringe corporate run media tell them to believe...no matter how ridiculous it is. They are the 'useful tools' that have allowed the moneyed interests to achieve their controlling objectives.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by raydawg on 07/20/13 at 12:36:19 A better question is asking yourself, instead of pointing fingers, lambasting with scorn, those you hold in contempt via your own close-mindedness (is it possible your perceptions is wrong?) and extend to all the right to view, and believe, things that fit their life style, instead? Who's a tool? We ALL are, period. You don't believe that, then no need to extend this dialog. Have a good day  :-*

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/20/13 at 12:43:25 Row, thats the simplest & most obvious way to see it & the one that allows tptb to continue therir march. these grand notions are born in the minds of the B/bergers, tri-laterals & such types. then it all gets blamed on something else. the goal is/was the end result. just as our schools produce exactly what tptb want. the "unintended consequences" ? those were the goals.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Starlifter on 07/20/13 at 13:21:29 Good points from both of you.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/22/13 at 09:19:47 The Link: http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielhannan/100227375/obamanomics-is-turning-america-into-detroit-ayn-rands-starnesville-come-to-life/ In it's entirety: Look at this description of Detroit from today’s Observer: Quote: What isn’t dumped is stolen. Factories and homes have largely been stripped of anything of value, so thieves now target cars’ catalytic converters. Illiteracy runs at around 47%; half the adults in some areas are unemployed. In many neighbourhoods, the only sign of activity is a slow trudge to the liquor store. Now have a look at the uncannily prophetic description of Starnesville, a Mid-Western town in Ayn Rand’s dystopian novel, Atlas Shrugged. Starnesville had been home to the great Twentieth Century Motor Company, but declined as a result of socialism: Quote: A few houses still stood within the skeleton of what had once been an industrial town. Everything that could move, had moved away; but some human beings had remained. The empty structures were vertical rubble; they had been eaten, not by time, but by men: boards torn out at random, missing patches of roofs, holes left in gutted cellars. It looked as if blind hands had seized whatever fitted the need of the moment, with no concept of remaining in existence the next morning. The inhabited houses were scattered at random among the ruins; the smoke of their chimneys was the only movement visible in town. A shell of concrete, which had been a schoolhouse, stood on the outskirts; it looked like a skull, with the empty sockets of glassless windows, with a few strands of hair still clinging to it, in the shape of broken wires. Beyond the town, on a distant hill, stood the factory of the Twentieth Century Motor Company. Its walls, roof lines and smokestacks looked trim, impregnable like a fortress. It would have seemed intact but for a silver water tank: the water tank was tipped sidewise. They saw no trace of a road to the factory in the tangled miles of trees and hillsides. They drove to the door of the first house in sight that showed a feeble signal of rising smoke. The door was open. An old woman came shuffling out at the sound of the motor. She was bent and swollen, barefooted, dressed in a garment of flour sacking. She looked at the car without astonishment, without curiosity; it was the blank stare of a being who had lost the capacity to feel anything but exhaustion. “Can you tell me the way to the factory?” asked Rearden. The woman did not answer at once; she looked as if she would be unable to speak English. “What factory?” she asked. Rearden pointed. “That one.” “It’s closed.” Now here’s the really extraordinary thing. When Ayn Rand published those words in 1957, Detroit was, on most measures, the city with the highest per capita GDP in the United States. The real-life Starnesville, like the fictional one, decayed slowly, then collapsed quickly. I spent a couple of weeks in Detroit in 1991. The city was still functioning more or less normally, but the early signs of decomposition were visible. The man I was staying withn, a cousin of my British travelling companion, ran a bar and restaurant. He seemed to my teenage eyes to be the embodiment of the American dream: he had never been to college, but got on briskly and uncomplainingly with building a successful enterprise. Still, he was worried. He was, he told me, one of a shrinking number of taxpayers sustaining more and more dependents. Maybe now, he felt, was the time to sell up, while business was still good. He wasn’t alone. The population of Motown has fallen from two million to 700,000, and once prosperous neighbourhoods have become derelict. Seventy six thousand homes have been abandoned; estate agents are unable to shift three-bedroom houses for a dollar. The Observer, naturally, quotes a native complaining that ‘capitalism has failed us,’ but capitalism is the one thing the place desperately needs. Detroit has been under Leftist administrations for half a century. It has spent too much and borrowed too much, driving away business and becoming a tool of the government unions. Of Detroit’s $11 billion debt, $9 billion is accounted for by public sector salaries and pensions. Under the mountain of accumulated obligations, the money going into, say, the emergency services is not providing services but pensions. Result? It takes the police an hour to respond to a 911 call and two thirds of ambulances can’t be driven. This is a failure, not of the private sector, but of the state. And, even now, the state is fighting to look after its clients: a court struck down the bankruptcy application on grounds that ‘will lessen the pension benefits of public employees’. Which brings us to the scariest thing of all. Detroit could all too easily be a forerunner for the rest of the United States. As Mark Steyn puts it in the National Review: Like Detroit, America has unfunded liabilities, to the tune of $220 trillion, according to the economist Laurence Kotlikoff. Like Detroit, it’s cosseting the government class and expanding the dependency class, to the point where its bipartisan “immigration reform” actively recruits 50–60 million low-skilled chain migrants. Like Detroit, America’s governing institutions are increasingly the corrupt enforcers of a one-party state — the IRS and Eric Holder’s amusingly misnamed Department of Justice being only the most obvious examples. Like Detroit, America is bifurcating into the class of “community organizers” and the unfortunate denizens of the communities so organized. Oh dear. No wonder the president would rather talk about Trayvon Martin. If you want to see Obamanomics taken to its conclusion, look at Starnesville. And tremble.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/22/13 at 09:26:20 5741564B53464B50240 wrote: It's the govn't.. the Marxists.. the lefties,..the righty's,.. the globalists... the unions,.. the aliens,... Nafta,.. the Chinese... So, then, what is the one connecting charateristic of them all? Is it corrupt sub-goups with in these main groups or is it a weakness of character, the inability to stand up and do the right thing? What kind of person or groups of persons get together and destory a major U.S. city in that manner that was done to Chicago?

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by srinath on 07/22/13 at 09:56:38 6D48474C6845454C47290 wrote: Like Detroit, America has unfunded liabilities, to the tune of $220 trillion, according to the economist Laurence Kotlikoff. Like Detroit, it’s cosseting the government class and expanding the dependency class, to the point where its bipartisan “immigration reform” actively recruits 50–60 million low-skilled chain migrants. Like Detroit, America’s governing institutions are increasingly the corrupt enforcers of a one-party state — the IRS and Eric Holder’s amusingly misnamed Department of Justice being only the most obvious examples. Like Detroit, America is bifurcating into the class of “community organizers” and the unfortunate denizens of the communities so organized. Big ... Biiiiiiiiiiggggg leap of logic there ... Let detroit print US $$$ and lets see how long its problem lasts ... US gubbamint is nothing like detroit or even you and me ... You, me, and every one else including city and state govts need to live within their means ... and if it means cutting off sewer and water lines to people living outskirts ... so be it ... The country as a whole, does not. To a large extent being a growing and spending on important and required projects should be done without regard to cost or budgets ... Wasn't it Cheney (your hero) who said Reagan (your other hero) proved that deficits dont matter ... So what matters to you apparently is that Obama seems to be building roads or high speed rail or internet infrastructure ... and that is bad. Maybe Obama should change his name to Cheney. Cool. Srinath.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/22/13 at 11:09:27 5D5C47404F5A462E0 wrote: [quote author=6D48474C6845454C47290 link=1374264800/15#15 date=1374509987] Like Detroit, America has unfunded liabilities, to the tune of $220 trillion, according to the economist Laurence Kotlikoff. Like Detroit, it’s cosseting the government class and expanding the dependency class, to the point where its bipartisan “immigration reform” actively recruits 50–60 million low-skilled chain migrants. Like Detroit, America’s governing institutions are increasingly the corrupt enforcers of a one-party state — the IRS and Eric Holder’s amusingly misnamed Department of Justice being only the most obvious examples. Like Detroit, America is bifurcating into the class of “community organizers” and the unfortunate denizens of the communities so organized. Big ... Biiiiiiiiiiggggg leap of logic there ... Let detroit print US $$$ and lets see how long its problem lasts ... US gubbamint is nothing like detroit or even you and me ... You, me, and every one else including city and state govts need to live within their means ... and if it means cutting off sewer and water lines to people living outskirts ... so be it ... The country as a whole, does not. To a large extent being a growing and spending on important and required projects should be done without regard to cost or budgets ... Wasn't it Cheney (your hero) who said Reagan (your other hero) proved that deficits dont matter ... So what matters to you apparently is that Obama seems to be building roads or high speed rail or internet infrastructure ... and that is bad. Maybe Obama should change his name to Cheney. Cool. Srinath.[/quote] Cheney is no Reagan!!! How dare you!!!  ;) Talking Debt and not deficits. With the 1%ers collecting fat union pension checks who will drive the economy? 60 million low skilled illegals? How many cities have filed for bankruptcy? Detroit is just the new biggest and when enough of these go then the counties will follow. California is gleefully running itself into the ground. With the Feds be able to print enough money that anyone will believe is worth anything to cover all the debts of all the municipalities and sates in the whole country? Any takers on which city will go next? I think San Francisco will go in the next 5 years.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by srinath on 07/22/13 at 12:06:28 77525D56725F5F565D330 wrote: Cheney is no Reagan!!! How dare you!!!  ;) He he ... 77525D56725F5F565D330 wrote: Talking Debt and not deficits. With the 1%ers collecting fat union pension checks who will drive the economy? 60 million low skilled illegals? 1%'er's collecting fat pension checks ... really ... that's what happens when you get to the top 1% huh ... Good to know. the 1%'ers are collecting fat pension checks, that's what makes them the 1%'ers and drives the cities and states etc etc under ... OK I'll keep that in mind for future ... 77525D56725F5F565D330 wrote: How many cities have filed for bankruptcy? Detroit is just the new biggest and when enough of these go then the counties will follow. California is gleefully running itself into the ground. With the Feds be able to print enough money that anyone will believe is worth anything to cover all the debts of all the municipalities and sates in the whole country? Orange country already did, so did stockton, vallejo, fairfield etc etc etc ... the basic nature of a city is flawed unless its packed like sardine cans like in NYC. 77525D56725F5F565D330 wrote: Any takers on which city will go next? I think San Francisco will go in the next 5 years. I think SFO as well as oakland, as well as a few Southern CA ones like Bell, Watts etc etc Cool. Srinath.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/22/13 at 12:22:13 Orange County was an anomaly due to someone trading securities on the market. The others, though, think of it, when a city spends the bulk of the emergency services budget on pensions and amblances don't work and oplice don't respond then there is a huge problem. And, no, the city system isn't flawed at all. Cities under liberal control for decades on end are totally flawed, however. It used to be illegal for unions to sign government workers but corruption set in and now the 1% are getting huge benefits at the expense of the rest of us.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by srinath on 07/22/13 at 12:25:29 00252A21052828212A440 wrote: It used to be illegal for unions to sign government workers but corruption set in and now the 1% are getting huge benefits at the expense of the rest of us. Yup, that was what the occupy wall street people also said ... we are the 99%, stop your pension grabbing 1% ... Cool. Srinath.

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by Dane Allen on 07/22/13 at 12:47:24 7E7F64636C79650D0 wrote: [quote author=00252A21052828212A440 link=1374264800/15#20 date=1374520933] It used to be illegal for unions to sign government workers but corruption set in and now the 1% are getting huge benefits at the expense of the rest of us. Yup, that was what the occupy wall street people also said ... we are the 99%, stop your pension grabbing 1% ... Cool. Srinath.[/quote] The occupy people were created from a bunch of disperate groups by the media to offset the wildly popular Tea Party movement. Most of those Occupyers didn't know or understand what they were talking about or why they were there. They are the epitome of the low information voter. They were the 3% complaining they weren't in the 1% while claiming to represent the 99% which is 100% b#llsh!t!! (feel free to quote me on that)

Title: Re: Big Blue Claims Another Victim Post by srinath on 07/22/13 at 12:50:48 54717E75517C7C757E100 wrote: [quote author=7E7F64636C79650D0 link=1374264800/15#21 date=1374521129][quote author=00252A21052828212A440 link=1374264800/15#20 date=1374520933] It used to be illegal for unions to sign government workers but corruption set in and now the 1% are getting huge benefits at the expense of the rest of us. Yup, that was what the occupy wall street people also said ... we are the 99%, stop your pension grabbing 1% ... Cool. Srinath.[/quote] The occupy people were created from a bunch of disperate groups by the media to offset the wildly popular Tea Party movement. Most of those Occupyers didn't know or understand what they were talking about or why they were there. They are the epitome of the low information voter. They were the 3% complaining they weren't in the 1% while claiming to represent the 99% which is 100% b#llsh!t!! (feel free to quote me on that)[/quote] Right right they were the 3%, complaining about the pension grabbing 1% ... I'll remember that. Cool. Srinath.

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