|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> so much cam chain info, but i need opinions /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1360810827 Message started by nick3501 on 02/13/13 at 19:00:27 |
|
Title: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/13/13 at 19:00:27 ok so my 97 has 30,000km on it. No idea if the chain/tensioner has ever been looked at so its time to take a look. If the tensioner is beyond its limits, whats my next step? From what I read the chain should still be OK but the tensioner may need replaced. I am assuming nothing can be adjusted with the stock setup. Should I look into just getting a modified tensioner or just go to a suzuki dealer and order a new tensioner and chain? |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by Digger on 02/13/13 at 19:25:43 If it were me, and I planned on keeping the bike for a while, I'd order a Verslavy and wait until I had it in my hands before pulling the clutch cover. And, after pulling said cover, no matter how the old tensioner looked, I'd pop the Verslavy in there and be done with it...... Is it making any noise yet? Good luck! |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by ZAR on 02/13/13 at 19:34:37 Nick as you've already figured out,you will need to replace the chain and the tensioner as a set if you go stock again. That is a bit pricey and wastes what may be a chain with plenty more miles left on it. If you go with a Versy modified tensioner you not only can use the full life of your chain but the tensioner should last through another new chain too. Go back to our main page,then go to the Marketplace,click on Verslagens Place,when the pics come up click on the red "Verslavy Cam Chain Adjuster" just above the first picture. That takes you to Versys page for info on the modified adjuster,including price options and ordering,along with parts for the adjuster too. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by Cavi Mike on 02/13/13 at 19:38:38 Read the "Important Topics" at the top of this forum - especially the "Things every Savage newb should know." You'll find exactly the information you need. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/13/13 at 20:17:13 ok, I think I'm going to open it up and measure my adjuster, who knows, maybe its in good shape ready to go another summer (wishful thinking i know), i read about 20mm is the max extension allowed before things become ugly if things are gettin' worn then ill contact verslavy about one of his magical devices ;D |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/13/13 at 20:24:03 another thing, is there any warning? I seen the chart posted here; http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1192027390/0 says most people experienced some noise when they inspected it. as of last time I drove the bike in November, there was no unusual noises to report. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by verslagen1 on 02/13/13 at 21:18:54 The only warning you get is the death rattle. When you've let it go too far and the plungers out 22mm. It starts tapping on the case right by your ankle on the right side. you can feel it with your hand just behind the oil filter cover and on top. That's if you're lucky, it can go up and down too and miss the case entirely. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by oldNslow on 02/14/13 at 09:44:11 When you open it up and measure the plunger extension please let us know what the measurement is. I'm really curious what it is on an engine with that many miles on it. I wouldn't be suprised if you discover you already have a modified adjuster in there. "Course its also possible the chain got replaced before you got the bike. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by verslagen1 on 02/14/13 at 10:27:37 30,000 km is 19,000 miles for an average rider (average 25mile per ride minimum) you can expect that it going to be nearly 18mm out. short avg rides = shorter life longer avg rides = extended life |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by Bubba on 02/14/13 at 11:06:57 If I recall...and that's sayin' a lot...mine was out 18mm with 12,000 miles...I had a verslavy in hand and sent my old one back to versy for my brothers bike. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/14/13 at 11:24:24 The cost of being wrong is high enough to justify having a look. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by oldNslow on 02/14/13 at 11:24:50 verslagen1 wrote Quote:
I need to start payin' attention. I misread nick's post. I thought his bike had 30,000 Miles on it. :( |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by 1st2know on 02/14/13 at 12:53:38 Here's what I did with this winters rack time, knowing that the tensioner was >17mm: I ordered: - a cam chain - clutch disc - clutch springs - clutch cover gasket - circlip for the tensioner (because I'm paranoid) Once those shipped with a tracking number I: - drained the oil - pulled off the head cover. - pulled the clutch cover. - removed the tensioner - lubed the clutch cable. - sent tensioner on a vacation to the "verslagen resort and spa" :) (wait for 1st parts order...) - removed the clutch basket - pulled the gear from the main shaft. (righty-loosy, lefty-tighty) - pulled the cam - replaced the cam chain - replaced clutch disc and springs. - check and double check torques. - quadruple checked cam timing. - re-seal head plug - re-torque head. (by now, the verslavy has arrived, more beautiful than ever) - re-install verslavied tensioner using the original hole. It's nice having a backup. This weekend I'll be double checking everything before I sew her back up. The new cam chain and clutch are arguably excessive, but I always try to get as much done with winter rack time and I also try to make use of the wait time for the parts moving across the continent. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/15/13 at 21:23:13 I hope ya sent all your "Bad" clutch parts to Old Feller,,coff,, coff |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/18/13 at 12:50:07 well...it was sitting t 19.5mm with 34,215km on the clock (~21000 miles)..contacting verslagen1 now :) |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by Oldfeller on 02/18/13 at 20:21:27 Nick, we don't wear out our clutch plates. We have 3 lengths of push rods to work through before we have to replace the plates, and so far nobody has ever progressed really to the point they had to replace their plates. When you get done, please PM me for my address so you can donate your old fiber plates to my fiber plate collection -- I keep all the fiber plates that are replaced by folks like you (and your springs and whatever else clutchlike that you have left over when you are done fixing up your bike). I am easily amused and it is a hobby. I keep all the used but still good clutch parts generated here on the list. Or you can keep them, in case of some vague disaster that happens out in the future. But PLEASE DO order a full set of 3 push rods of all the different lengths. Versy, you threatened to get some HSS dowel pins in the lengths we needed for pushrods -- did you ever do it? Do we have the lengths needed? Research in Tech says 1.75", 1.79", and 1.83" inches are the stock rod lengths. I can't verify this because they are only listed in the loose leaf Suzuki Factory Service Book that only a few of us have. I have hand built a couple of rods for my bike that were longer than the stock range out of M2 round lathe bit stock, so I know some of us could use some rods that are longer than the stock range. My fiddlin' about with rods over the years has taught me that hardened steel dowel pins are NOT heat resistant hard nor tough enough for the task (they get heat softened at the eccentric due to simple friction and rapidly wear away). High Speed Steel is a minimum durability and if you want full tough rods go up to M2 lathe tool bit steel. The HSS and M2 can get up to dull red before beginning to lose hardness -- and that doesn't really ever happen as the friction is temporary and it gets quenched back to engine ambient by the oil flying around every where before it ever gets red hot. Case hardened normal steel dowel pins CAN get friction heated up to a light purple draw, and being drawn multiple multiple multiple times over the months they eventually soften to the point rapid wear can take place inside the eccentric cup. And the rod gets short and the chrome lever rises up accordingly. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by RidgeRunner13 on 02/18/13 at 21:05:04 OF, Those are the correct lengths. My SSM is from 12/95 so these numbers may have been superceded, but here are the part numbers in the book. 23111-24B00-445=44.5mm (1.75") 23111-24B00-455=45.5mm (1.79") 23111-24B00-465=46.5mm (1.83") HTH. 8-) |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by verslagen1 on 02/18/13 at 21:06:44 I haven't had it apart to check for wear yet. full hard tool steel guide pins, just grind them to length. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/19/13 at 08:43:50 My clutch isn't getting replaced, at least not now. So you say much like the cam tensioner there is more use able life in the clutch by changing the pushrod? Are these rods stock parts or modified by someone? Verslagen1, did you get my email? I sent it with a bad WiFi connection so not 100% sure you actually got it.. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by hexnut on 02/19/13 at 08:52:06 :( |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by verslagen1 on 02/19/13 at 09:09:33 3D3A303860666362530 wrote:
think so, and think I made a reply, not sure, mind is going in too many directions. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/19/13 at 09:49:09 Sounds like me..lots on the go....I'll let you know if nothing shows up. Email can be slow like that unfortunately. edit: Nope havn't got anything yet, not in the spam folder either. What would the total be for a verslavvy tensioner shipped to ontario, canada? I can send you the money once I know the e-mail for your paypal. thanks! |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by Digger on 02/19/13 at 18:48:45 7350585A595050594E3C0 wrote:
From my Suzuki FSM, good up through the '09 models: http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee201/Digger109/LS650/ClutchPushrods-FSME.jpg IHTH! |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/19/13 at 19:51:20 I'm usually pretty careful with these things, but I found a little piece on the shop floor from removing the clutch cover, its a small grey cylinder and i am not sure if it came off the bike or just random floor junk from a previous project. Anyone familiar with the part or where it might go? also, regrding the clutch...i feel mine is at the end of its adjustment, it seems it starts to slip by just bearly pulling on the lever, im sure it will need attention this season. I assume a longer push-rod is what I need and not a shorter one, correct? |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 02/19/13 at 20:10:23 scratch that...I found the source of the part, it was a pin for the cover. lesson learned, almost swept it up in the trash :o |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/20/13 at 10:00:39 I learned to sweep up before any new job. Anything that hits the floor is more easily found. Anything on the floor Must be from this job. An old towel on the floor under the job grabs parts that fall so they dont run away. I do that especially on things Im unsure of "What kinda tiny bits & pieces are IN there". I learned these things after years of Not preparing & suffering painful consequences. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by nick3501 on 04/09/13 at 20:51:49 http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b160/harmankardon35/P7310001.jpg thanks verslagen1, got it in today. Expect the original in the mail, sent it out a few days ago. that 10mm bolt was seized pretty tight on mine, but the air ratchet took care of it. I also re-used the circlip, once I got it all together i thought "darn why didn't i replace a $1 clip" ;D oh well it looked in good shape change it next time. is there a torque spec for that 10mm bolt? Considering how tight it was to break free I figured I'd ask, I just tightened with a small wrench and called it a day, hopefully it can't come loose. |
|
Title: Re: so much cam chain info, but i need opinions Post by verslagen1 on 04/09/13 at 21:29:28 I put it in with about 15-20 ftlbs, haven't had them come out yet. :o think they are originally put in with locktite. |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |