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Message started by DavidOfMA on 02/07/13 at 06:54:15

Title: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/07/13 at 06:54:15

Weather's been iffy enough so I'm not likely to ride for a couple more weeks and I wanted to drain the carb, only to discover that the screw is frozen. PB Blaster, gentle tapping with a screwdriver, tapping on each side to try to unseize it so far has not loosened it, and I'm wary of applying a vice grips to it for fear of shearing it off. Any suggestions on how to unfreeze this screw?

Thanks!

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by Serowbot on 02/07/13 at 08:45:55

There's not a lot of magic to getting a screw out...
Penetrating oil, a good fitting bit, and torque...

In the case of the drain screw,... if you can remove the floatbowl entirely,.. and put it on a bench, you can really get at the screw, and probably remove it cleanly...
Trying to work, upside down, on a rubber mounted carb, is a prescription for boogered screws...
;)...

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by arteacher on 02/07/13 at 09:08:30

687E69746C79746F1B0 wrote:

....also, if you take off the float bowl you can heat up the bowl and remove the screw easier. The reason why it sticks is that it is a taper.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/07/13 at 09:53:49

Thanks. I'll have to wait until the upcoming storm passes and it warms up to do this. Hopefully the screws on the float bowl are also not stuck, though I gather these are easier to remove.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by engineer on 02/07/13 at 17:29:43

I took the advice of people on this forum and bought an inexpensive impact driver from Harbor Freight before I touched the carburator. It worked great and I had no problem with any of the screws. When I reassembled the carb I used Allen head cap screws.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/07/13 at 18:10:04

Thanks. I have the impact driver. Once the storm clears and it warms up a bit, I'll try that before I try removing the float bowl, though given that the carb is rubber mounted I am doubtful the driver will loosen up the screw while the float bowl is still on the carb.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by Dave on 02/07/13 at 18:34:54

5F595454505952555F5E493B0 wrote:

I just came home and it is 55 degrees, the sky is clear.....I didn't see any storm?

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by Gyrobob on 02/08/13 at 19:22:45

If the carb bowl screws are reluctant, just take the whole carb off and set it on the bench to get to everything easily. Once you have done it once or twice it only takes about 15-20 minutes to get the carb off,... way less time than it will take to repair boogered up or sheared off carb bowl screws.

When you tried tapping the drain screw from side to side did you see it move any at all?
-- It will not move at all when frozen, but it will move a few hundredths (a barely visible amount) when it does start to break free.
-- One way to note if there is any movement is to get a Sharpie and color the screw and its surroundings completely.
-- Once that is done, if the screw moves even a teense, you'll notice the bare metal uncovered by the movement.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/08/13 at 19:51:36

Thanks for the tips on loosening frozen screws. I didn't see it move, but I'll try the Sharpie trick. But unfortunately, not for a while, as we're in the midst of a major blizzard here, and I have no garage or shop (bike's parked under a cover in the driveway). Hopefully I had enough fuel stabilizer in there the last time I went riding to keep the carb from getting too gummed up before I get a chance to ride again, else I'll have to remove it anyway to clean it and can fix all the frozen screws then.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by Digger on 02/09/13 at 17:52:15

If the drain screw is OEM, I believe that it has a modified JIS-head (or, at least, mine does.

You're best off using a JIS screwdriver to remove same.

Several years ago, when I got the OEM drain screw off of mine (see signature), I reused said screw, but treated its threads with a bit of Anti-Seize first. End of problem.

Also, don't know if this will help you, but on mine, one could even use a flat-head screwdriver to remove the drain screw. YMMV!

Good luck!

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/09/13 at 19:42:00

Yes, mine has the combined flat head / philips head drain screw. Couldn't budge it with a flat head, either. At some point I'll take the carb off and loosen everything up but right now there are 4-6' snow drifts hereabouts. I'd hoped to drain the float bowl before winter set in with a vengeance, but I appear to be too late.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by Gyrobob on 02/10/13 at 03:00:18

A common improvement is to replace all the existing machine screws (with Phillips or JIS threads) with stainless allen head screws. That way you can always get enough torque on them, especially in tight places where there might not be room for a screwdriver.

Another thing I do is to put a smudge of RTV on the threads right before reassembly.
-- It keeps the threads from deteriorating and/or rusting from galvanic (dissimilar metal) corrosion.
-- It glues the threads together a little bit,.. just enough to provide some protection against coming loose, but nowhere near enough to lock them up like real glue. Even if the fastener loosens a bit, the cured RTV keeps it from spinning off due to vibration.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/10/13 at 08:48:09

Ive found that once I moved a screw its stayed "workable" for me. Of course, I use oil & anti-sieze on things. Clean it up once its in your hands, oil it before it goes back. BUT, If youre gonna want to mess with it, you know a danged allen head would be ever so much easier to work with up under there. MInes stock, & I have no problem draining mine, but some people have a hard time working up under there.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/10/13 at 09:06:20

Thanks for all your suggestions. Storm's passed, sun's up, starting to warm up. Rain all day tomorrow, but maybe I can get to it on Tuesday.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by LouSiana on 02/10/13 at 14:26:35

The drain plug screw has a fine thread, would not be easy to find one with an allen head... About the bolts holding the bowl and the lid at the top, right! Best way to change them into stainless allen bolts if you ever get the carb from its place.

Here in Europe that drain plugs have a phillips head and 10mm hexagonal combined. So what about over there?

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/10/13 at 14:38:43

The European configuration sounds better than what is on my bike, anyway, which is a Phillips head combined with a normal screwdriver slot. The metal seems pretty soft, the head easy to strip, like so many of the screws on this carb.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/12/13 at 09:06:41

Got the drain screw loose with repeated applications of PB Blaster, tapping it side-to-side, and trying to loosen with a big flat-blade screwdriver that exactly fit the slot. It's also 25 degrees warmer, which might have helped. Squirted some more PB Blaster on the threads while I had it loose and then tightened it. It opens and closes easily now.

Stupid question, but how tight should it be? I tightened it finger tight with a large screwdriver, then torqued it slightly using my whole hand. It's about one turn tighter than the minimum it needs to be to stop the bowl from draining.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by Dave on 02/12/13 at 13:02:57

The screw just needs to be snug enough that it doesn't leak, or vibrate out. It is not holding the carb together......it is just keeping the gasoline inside. Two fingers on the screwdriver is probably enough - this carb just uses a thumb grip on the drain screw.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/12/13 at 13:08:38

Thanks. So, I've over tightened it. Maybe that's what the previous owner did, and why it froze. I'll adjust accordingly.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by hexnut on 02/12/13 at 14:24:48

I had mine loose today and it was tight. Bike is not a year old yet. I probably couldn't have got it loose with a regular Phillips head screw driver. I have an assortment of socket bits and found one that fit perfect. Broke loose easy using a 1/4 inch ratchet.

I didn't put it back nearly as tight.

Title: Re: Frozen carb drain plug screw
Post by DavidOfMA on 02/12/13 at 15:50:44

Is the drain valve mechanism all metal-to-metal, or are there rubber or plastic parts that could be damaged by overtightening?