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Message started by MiCTLaN on 10/07/12 at 20:10:01

Title: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/07/12 at 20:10:01

Today my lovely gf and I took a road trip up to the montly swap meet up in Webster, FL and came back home with a shiny new (to me) Dyna exhaust for my bike. I got the exhaust with the rail-mount bracket that everyone on here seems to recommend, a clamp, and a bolt-on heat shield that I should be able to cut up into a serviceable cover for the mess once I manage to get it together... all for $12.

Once I got home I figured I would tackle the installation today, since it looks pretty straightforward and there are plenty of instructions around here on the process, unfortunately I'm running into issues and figured I would ask for advice.

The first issue I came across is that the Dyna doesn't slip all the way on (as pictured) like I've seen in other folk's photos (such as in Serowbot's post over on the Tech Documents page here http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1298689417). After getting everything together I'm getting exhaust leaks all around the connection. I'm using the same "tin can gasket" method that Serowbot mentions in that thread, and can't seem to get rid of the leaks. I'm curious if it might be because the exhaust isn't slipping on as far as mentioned in that thread.

It seems to me that the internal part of my header pipe is butting up against the lip on the inside of the Dyna, and will not but up flush aginst the raised lip on the header pipe unless I remove some of that (which I would prefer not to do). I'm doubtful that this is likely the problem with the leaks, there seems to be plenty of header going down into the slip-on.

The second issue I ran into was that the clamp wasn't working as well as I thought it should, and I realized that it was missing one of the pieces (that's what I get for a dollar, I guess), so I tried to make it up by stuffing a couple of large washers in there. With the washers on the clamp I could tighten it enough that I couldn't tighten it anymore with a wrench... afterwards I'm still getting the leaks.

I made a run tonight to all the local dollar stores and parts places to see if anyone had a serviceable clamp, but nobody had anything that looked nearly beefy enough (aside from the normal U bolt clamps available at the auto parts places, but I'm thinking those would not work well).

So... should I try a new clamp? Is the problem likely that I'm not tightening it down enough? Should I try something other than a tin can for a gasket? Should I find someone with a welder? :)

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Serowbot on 10/07/12 at 21:47:04

Thanks for the pics,.. and thanks for replying in the Rubberside... ;)...

.. a couple of people have had trouble with the muffler not sliding home...
I've never come across it myself,.. but, as you say,.. it looks far enough...
... and I see you've cut slots to allow the muff to neck down to the pipe diameter...
That clamp looks a bit feeble... I'd look to a sturdier clamp...
The one's I've been using squeeze from a full 360 degrees... they have a kinda' slip sleeve that seals across the bolt area, and good width all 'round...
I think Harley makes a pretty good one for about $10,... I find mine a dollar store in packs of two... (one is much smaller)...

Anyway,.. that's my best recommendation... and good reporting of your problem... very clear...
best luck... hope that helps... ;)...

http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt82/serowbot/rerun/pipeinstl007.jpg?t=1299005252

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/07/12 at 23:53:09

Thanks for the reply, I'll hit a couple more dollar stores tomorrow and see what I can come up with.

I've been reading some suggestions in a few other places that have been mentioning using Permatex Ultra Copper smeared in there... think that's worth a try as well?

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by HondaLavis on 10/08/12 at 00:12:59

You're HD clamp seems to be missing a piece. Where you have put the two washers, there is supposed to be a semi-circular spacer so that the nut presses evenly against that portion of the clamp. Not sure if it would make a difference in your case.

I've personally tried the Permatex Ultra Copper for the exact same issues. In my experience, it could not withstand the heat from the exhaust. After the first ride, it dried up, turned whitish-orange, and began flaking off.

Good luck with this. I'm to the point where I had to weld mine because I cut my slots too far down on the muffler. Getting a solid seal with welding is more of a pain than I thought...

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Wake51 on 10/08/12 at 01:40:52

I tried the can crush method with a brand new HD clamp. I couldn't get the thing to seal completely. I got it to seal well enough... but no matter what I did I still got a slight puff of exhaust leak. I certainly got it close enough to live with though.

Getting it on there all the way requires a little bite of grunt and turning off the muffler once its on the header. Perhaps a bit of lube of some sort that would burn off could help. As mentioned above, that clamp looks a bit off. Good luck!

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Greg on 10/08/12 at 04:45:44

I had the exact same issue of not sliding on far enough. I went to Harbor Freight and bought a cheap cut off tool and cut off the offending part. After that, any tin can and a good clamp will solve your problems.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by clearush on 10/08/12 at 04:59:19

I end up using high temp red rtv on mine with a plumbing leak repair cuff with the rubber sleeve removed. I did use a standard ubolt exhaust clamp to neck down the harley exhaust first then removed the u-bolt and put the plumbing cuff with rtv on.

but I do believe a t-bolt clamp would be preferable since by design the clamping force is much greater than I have with the band clamps on the plumbing sleeve.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by tomw on 10/08/12 at 07:05:52

Exhaust leak what a pain in the gas had a 14" homemade drag pipe with 8" or 12" can opener baffle and used a wide fence post clamp flat black paint look good but too loud at open throttle and couldn't keep it from leaking or the clamp tight used permatex red copper could not stop leak after a couple of runes or untill it got hot and dry up I don't know may be the pipe was to big or expanded to much when hot . Well went with a emg shorty and the nightmare of the leaking monster started all over again this time I got it right even though I think a 4" to 6' baffle welded inside would be better then the stock but I think I found the right stuff to stop exhaust leak or maybe a combinations of tighter exhaust and better sealent this is the stuff to use Permantex muffler & tailpipe sealer o'reilly had to order it but be careful because this stuff drys the color or mortar good luck .

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Gyrobob on 10/08/12 at 07:32:14

There isn't any glue/sealant/rtv/gasketmaker/etc., that will hold up very long at that joint. The only long-term solution is to find some way for all the parts to fit together precisely, and use a very heavy-duty exhaust clamp to squeeze it together hard enough to hold up to the heat and vibration.

Here's are some examples of heavy duty exhaust clamps. Even the most expensive aren't all THAT pricey.

http://www.tecexhaust.com/index.php/default/clamps.html

Devote most of your effort to get the joint to fit tightly with a lot of overlap all by itself. Then, and only then, use a powerful stainless clamp to clamp it all together.

One other reasonable option is to get everything to fit in place the way you want, and then MIG weld it all together. Make a one-piece exhaust system that will never leak or break. The only downside is that sometimes you might have to do a little more disassembly to get at some areas that used to be freed up by just removing the muffler.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/08/12 at 09:03:00

On the way to work today I stopped at every dollar store within a 10 mile radius of the ride to work and came up empty handed... I had a conversation with my dad over email and it turns out that he has a couple of NIB exhaust clamps that he purchased when he swapped the exhaust on his Harley. He's going to drop those into the mail for me today, so if I don't find anything in the meantime maybe one of those will work.

I'm a little miffed that the swap meet clamp didn't work out, it sounded really nice for the few seconds I've had it running checking for leaks. ;D

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Dave on 10/08/12 at 09:12:12

484C465149444B250 wrote:

On the way to work today I stopped at every dollar store within a 10 mile radius of the ride to work and came up empty handed ;D

I would not expect a "Dollar Store" to have a specialized clamp for a motorcycle exhaust. These are very specific clamps and even a good automobile parts supply place would not have them. The internet, eBay or a motorcycle shop are the only places you will find the kind of clamp you need.....and even then you can buy some that are made to cheaply to work well. On eBay you can find good Harley made clamps for $ 10 or so........

The clamp you have in you photo appears to be a good clamp - but it is missing the half-moon pieces that go on both sides. This will alllow the straps to flatten out when you tighten the bolt/nut and the strap will not be pulled tight.

I bought some from this fellow and they where shipped quickly, good quality, and they worked great.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HARLEY-DAVIDSON-EXHAUST-SYSTEM-MUFFLER-CLAMPS-TOURING-SOFTAIL-DYNA-XL-FATBOY-FLT-/370597774812?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item56495945dc&vxp=mtr

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Arnold on 10/08/12 at 11:15:19

Had the exact same issue the OP had. No matter how hard I would close that clamp it could not close tightly enough around the pipe, muffler always seemed loose. Yet the tin can method was too thick to fit between pipe and muffler. Got some heavy duty exhaust repair from autozone and that did the trick, wrapped around the pipe as thick as possible then slid muffler on, added another couple of turns of wrapping around the muffler where the clamp made contact and it worked like a champ. Let's see if that holds.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/08/12 at 12:38:25

I took a pair of needle-nose pliers and gently spread the tabs back a slight bit after cutting a few notches into the pipe to the same length as the two 'stock' notches that were there... doing so gave me enough leeway to get the tin in place...

Granted, I haven't corrected the leaks yet, so I'll have to see how it goes once the new clamps come in.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Arnold on 10/08/12 at 12:42:21

I think it will work, I tried a few HD clamps before I found one that could crush that pipe tight.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/09/12 at 19:23:04

Still no luck... the clamps that dad sent over were a couple of Drag Specialties clamps that were not up for the job. One of them was a two-piece model that seemed like it would work okay, so I went ahead and tried it and still had leaks. Next I dug out the hacksaw and sawed off the small section of the header pipe where the inner pipe was longer than the outer, and clamped it all back down, still leaking. I guess next I'll stop by a Harley dealer and see if I can get a clamp like the first one I had that isn't missing a piece.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/09/12 at 19:24:36

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/parts/tweekerparts/clamps-tbolt.jpg

T^ clamps

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/09/12 at 19:32:33

Yes, exactly what I'm looking for, if I can find them... if I had just ordered them online on Sunday when I first had an issue, I probably wouldn't be having trouble anymore ;D

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/09/12 at 19:36:10

I apologize for not posting sooner. I should have, seriously, I fell down on the job there & I am sorry. Call around to nut & bolt shops, IF they have them, it will be less than at the HD shop,, or call muffler shops, ask for T clamps,,

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/13/12 at 11:43:49

Was out of town for a few days for work and decided to tackle it again today. Went to a nearby Harley custom shop and dug around in their parts bin until we found a good looking clamp similar to the one in my original post... "No charge" the guy says. The day started good anyway.

Bring it home, reset the tin can gasket, slide everything into place, clamp it down as tight as it will go... still small puffs in one spot.

Drove around and visited three different auto parts stores, two cycle dealerships, two hardware stores, and two more custom shops. Nobody had any of these elusive t-clamps, or any sort of heavy clamp different from the ones that I've already tried.

I decided that maybe the one I have isn't clamping down far enough, since it's made for the original pipe diameter, so I dug up some scrap and made a shim that sits between the original exhaust flange and the new clamp... still leaking.

Gave up and decided to spread some of that Permatex Copper stuff spread on both sides of the tin can gasket. Waited a couple of hours, fired the bike up... still leaking.

Decided to order a clamp from the site Gyrobob mentioned... they wanted to charge $15 shipping on a $4 item... wow.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by MiCTLaN on 10/13/12 at 18:39:52

I think I got it. It ain't pretty, but I think it's not leaking anymore. I tried rotating the clamp around to different positions (today's clamp with the shim underneath it) and found one that seemed to do the trick.

Thanks everyone for the help, I think I'm still going to hunt down one of these t-clamps at some point in the near future, so I can get it covered with a nice chrome cover where the clamp is, but this will at least get me to Biketoberfest and back. ;D

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Badass94Cad on 10/14/12 at 20:06:13

Fastenal has the clamps. ;)

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/14/12 at 21:13:28

I thot T clamps were stock HD equipment
I can get them at the local bearing/bushing supply house.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by rfw2003 on 10/15/12 at 14:02:00

You might also check the local farm supply stores, that's where I picked mine up at.

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Gyrobob on 10/16/12 at 05:36:15

55415015171714270 wrote:

You might also check the local farm supply stores, that's where I picked mine up at.

Would Tractor Supply have them?

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by braveteacher on 10/19/12 at 03:19:38

weld that sucker on...

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by braveteacher on 10/19/12 at 03:21:46

and hope you like it...

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by misterbbq on 11/01/12 at 18:08:30

bump this thread instead of starting a new one:

how do i get the dyna to bump up against big ring on the header? i tried tapping it with a rubber mallet and just plain pushing on it, but didn't want to do anything to strenuous to it since it was still on the bike.

should i take it completely off and smack it around? the stock cutouts on the dyna don't get covered by the header tube right now and that'll be tough to overcome! ;)

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Serowbot on 11/01/12 at 18:29:33

60647E79687F6F6F7C0D0 wrote:

how do i get the dyna to bump up against big ring on the header?

I've had many that slid right up,.. but doing Gerry's just the other day, it would not go...
Just make it go as far as it does,... have some 6 or so extra slits cut, the same length as the clamp width, to allow the clamp to cinch... then use yer' tin can spacer in between...
I had a super tiny air leak,... that clogged up with carbon after a few dozen miles...
Carbon build-up seals pretty good... ;D...

PS... use the Tech advise as a guide,.. but you have to work your own unique experiences... no two jobs ever go exactly the same...
That's the difference between modding and bolt-ons...
Modding has it's own special satisfaction though...
Best luck,...
;)...

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/01/12 at 18:32:49

Dang, teach! How long you been welding? What kinda welder izzat?

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by misterbbq on 11/01/12 at 19:13:48

3523342931242932460 wrote:

[quote author=60647E79687F6F6F7C0D0 link=1349665803/15#26 date=1351818510]how do i get the dyna to bump up against big ring on the header?

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by misterbbq on 11/01/12 at 19:14:44

oh...and just so you guys know....when you go to get the harley clamp DON'T LOOK AT ANY BIKES!!! i almost didn't get out of there for fellas trying to sell me $25k bikes!! :lol:

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by Serowbot on 11/01/12 at 19:20:58

686C76716077676774050 wrote:

... now to buy some more veggies!

See,.. eatin' his veggies...
Modding is good for your health, too...
All them green vitamins coursing through your body... (of course,.. he's smearing them with BBQ sauce to get them down,.. but that's made of healthy tomato sauce , and good things, too)...
;D...

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by braveteacher on 11/02/12 at 12:59:15

the weld on the left is factory...the weld on the right is mine...pic looks better than it is...I have a cheap harbor freight $100 wire welder...not very good but does the job if you get lucky...LOL

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by misterbbq on 11/02/12 at 16:47:12

2 calls from the harley dealership today while i was out working on my bike. lol.

dyna is on i don't see/feel any exhaust leaks at the shim any more! clamp bolt isn't exactly where i'd like it as i was twisting it, tightening and testing. i call it the 3 t's of muffler install. bolted it right up to existing bracket using some stainless bolts i had laying around. nicely mounted and i used the oem heatshield to cover over the junction. looks nice if i do say so myself.

AND SOUNDS INCREDIBLE

Title: Re: Dyna muffler install issues
Post by misterbbq on 11/02/12 at 16:53:41

also....jetted up from a 145 to 150 and left the 52.5 pilot in (actually, put the 52.5 from lancer in there just because). now...once i get this freaking backrest on from the older model savage on my s40 i can go for a freaking ride.