|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occupanc /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1347687808 Message started by justin_o_guy2 on 09/14/12 at 22:43:28 |
|
Title: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occupanc Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/14/12 at 22:43:28 http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occupancy-rate-in-private-prisons/ Gov’t Guarantees 90% Occupancy Rate In Private Prisons Breaking News | September 12, 2012 | 4 Comments 150 98 7Reddit0Google +0 (Kevin Johnson) At a time when states are struggling to reduce bloated prison populations and tight budgets, a private prison management company is offering to buy prisons in exchange for various considerations, including a controversial guarantee that the governments maintain a 90% occupancy rate for at least 20 years. Federal Bureau of Prisons director Harley Lappin speaks during a news conference at the Thomson Correctional Center in Thomson, Ill., in 2009. The $250 million proposal, circulated by the Nashville-based Corrections Corporation of America to prison officials in 48 states, has been blasted by some state officials who suggest such a program could pressure criminal justice officials to seek harsher sentences to maintain the contractually required occupancy rates. “You don’t want a prison system operating with the goal of maximizing profits,” says Texas state Sen. John Whitmire, a Houston Democrat and advocate for reducing prison populations through less costly diversion programs. “The only thing worse is that this seeks to take advantage of some states’ troubled financial position.” Corrections Corporation spokesman Steve Owendefended the company’s “investment initiative,” describing it as “an additional option” for cash-strapped states to consider. The proposal seeks to build upon a deal reached last fall in which the company purchased the 1,798-bed Lake Erie Correctional Institution from the state of Ohio for $72.7 million. Ohio officials lauded the September transaction, saying that private management of the facility would save a projected $3 million annually. Linda Janes, chief of staff for the Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction, said the purchase came at time when the state was facing a $8 billion shortfall. The $72.7 million prison purchase was aimed at helping to fill a $188 million deficit within the corrections agency. Ohio’s deal requires the state to maintain a 90% occupancy rate, but Janes said that provision remains in effect for 18 months — not 20 years — before it can be renegotiated. As part of the deal, Ohio pays the company a monthly fee, totaling $3.8 million per year. Roger Werholtz, former Kansas secretary of corrections, said states may be tempted by the “quick infusion of cash,” but he would recommend against such a deal. “My concern would be that our state would be obligated to maintain these (occupancy) rates and subtle pressure would be applied to make sentencing laws more severe with a clear intent to drive up the population,” Werholtz s |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/17/12 at 07:50:53 You do know that private prisons are the result of running the govt like a business dont you ... essentially a republican idea. Basically dont spend on programs that can "correct" small offenders, and when they turn into big offenders turn them into the machinery that guarantees they be kept properly imprisoned so they cost the least, and make them labor to make the maximum profit and dont do anything to help them get a job/living when they are outside. Sorry I dont see the big deal here, the smaller govt credo has that whole machinery working for it. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/17/12 at 08:36:19 I dont think prisons should be privatized, I dont think they should be For Profit & I sure as HELL dont think you grasp the magnitude of a government PROMISING an occupancy rate, Running a government LIKE a business, as in being Fiscally REsponsible, isnt the same as turning it into one. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Serowbot on 09/17/12 at 09:02:02 The biggest obstacle to de-criminalising Marijuana is a huge lobby from the for-profit prison system... They also support the severe drug and alcohol penalties... This is not because they are righteous, god fearing, concerned citizens... it's because it's 50% of their profits... "Show me one thing that government can do better than private sector"... Righty's often ask that... Prisons... ;)... |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/17/12 at 09:05:39 5A454344595E6F5F6F57454902300 wrote:
I know that - however Romney and the republicans do not. BTW I'd have excluded Romney from this, cos he always was a moderate ... However having the GOP nomination instead of returning to his moderate roots, he's taken a turn to the opposite, Ryan as VP is one, as is this gem - Any time you can move someting from the federal govt to the states, its the way to go, and if you can turn it into the private sector, even better. Sorry I think he's rapidly going in this direction. Privatize prisons, medicare, road construction etc etc etc ... sorry, Romney gets a F-. Remember it is scary and also remember if funding gets cut states - not all, some of em will turn to that option, cos well states cannot print money, so it automatically means they will need to get it as cheap as possible and make as much $ as possible, so it is a business at that point. In a way putting some of these big descisions @ the feet of the federal govt gets that cost picture out of the equation. Yea yea its horribly inefficient and there will be a huge expansion of this and that, however it does need to be done, and if you dump it onto entities that cant fund it, they will either turn hardenened criminials loose, or privatize them and squeeze the blood out of them, and find reasons to add to that list they can bleed ... you have a parking ticket, its 20 years to life for you cos we guaranteed the prison company 100,000 a year for the next 100 years. Take your pick. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/17/12 at 09:12:04 3127302D35202D36420 wrote:
Highway, railway, shipping channel, irrigation and water management, space exploration, criminal justice (yes prisons) and a lot more can only be done by the federal govt. Its not that way just in the US, it is that way in every country where any of those exist. In many countries ground transportation like buses and trains, power generation and transmission, mining as well as many others are owned by the feds. The feds just need to keep out of the creative and cutting edge fields except as a regulatory body, like we dont want them making movies or doing nuclear research, but we do need them to rate a movie so kids dont get to watch porn, and you dont explode a rod of U 238 mixed with Polonium in your driveway and turn your whole zip code into ash and your whole state green glow in the dark. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Serowbot on 09/17/12 at 09:16:31 ... and Healthcare... |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/17/12 at 09:28:54 6E786F726A7F72691D0 wrote:
Only if the framework of Insurance co -> doctor direct payments. Kill that and go to a pay the doctor @ the time of treatment and file it as a reimbursable claim, and it can be tossed to the private sector. It will IMHO do the most to lower costs especially long term costs ... BTW if it is medicaid, they still take in the reimbursements and reimburse the patients. Doctor offices are rife with paper pushers. All administrative costs due to having to bill insurance etc etc a certain way and what not. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Serowbot on 09/17/12 at 10:03:37 Yup... get rid of the for-profit, do nothin', middleman... Save 1/3 right off the top... plus lower office admin costs... Probably raise that savings to 50%... Then, guaranteed payment for all patients, lowers costs even more... ...and everyone contributes... Also,.. providers will be busy enough with legitimate care, they won't need to order so much unnecessary procedures to pad their bills... ;D... |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/17/12 at 10:30:24 And if you decide you were basically healthy and didn't have a gaggle of sick kids and weren't gonna bother getting insurance, or like I had @ one time, have a doctor you're a mechanic for (though he was an eye doctor not a complete doctor) you can opt to just pay for it, @30-40 bucks a doc visit, you could well opt to lose the 1500/mo medical insurance behemoth off your back in exchange for a $20 co pay ... done. I sound like a conservative dont I ... yes I am a true conservative, however the republican party isn't conservative, they are vultures who want big corporations and rich people to feed on the efforts of the poor and working ... If you gonna deregulate, completely deregulate ... dont deregulate in favor of a few big corporations and let them cannibalise the rest of us. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Serowbot on 09/17/12 at 10:34:55 If conservatives thought like you,.. I'd probably be voting for them... |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/17/12 at 13:01:59 6274637E66737E65110 wrote:
I am tight fisted as they come ... you know how copper wire was invented ? 2 Indians found the same penny on the road ... Anyway if someone is giving me $ and paying me 3.5% to use their $$$ and repay them with what I can churn out in my printer and give back whenever I feel like it ... guess what, I would take as much as they give me and build my self a 100,000 sq ft monster house on a mountain overlooking the ocean in a tropical paradise ... They are republican, not conservative. Blue dog democrats are more conservative than republicans ... republicans are conservative only when it comes to how hard they thump the bible ... social only ... fiscally they want to say they are conservative while giving away huge sums of $ to rich people under the guise of calling them "Job creators". Here is some of the major truths in the world of "Job creation" No one needs a tax break to create a job ... if the job makes them $ they will "create it" My employer - big bank needs me to push these buttons cos if I dont they will lose 10-100 X what they pay me. They can get a different monkey to push the same button, yes, however they cant get someone off the street ... that would mean they lose between 10-100% of their likely profit ... ergo they hire the best monkey for the job - me. None of the new age job creators are businessmen, CEO's and corp executives are employees ... we can replace them wiht a monkey and likely lose less than their salary ... cos you see a "talented monkey" can make more $$$ than a corrupt idiot clueless CEO. So you pay a monkey 30-40 banana's a day, you're out less than 50 bones a day. Most - somewhere like 85% of businesses create how many jobs ? 1 exactly 1, themselves. You start abusiness, you work in it, end of story, dont see WTF you need other than a demand and a service/idea/item/talent you can provide to others. End of story. Business owners aren't waiting for republicans to give them a big check to do something. Most big checks are going to employees - CEO's and the like. I'd like to see a cap - a multiple of the employees, and no accounting tricks like hire a 1000 temps through an agency, pay them minimum wage and not count em in your payroll and say you're just making 100 times your average worker salary of 50k. Bogus crap like that has to be weeded out. 1000 temps @ mnimum wage do need to be counted in, your average drops to 25k and you're making 200 x the average, you need to be taxed @ a stiffer rate. Something like that. I think the whole nation needs to be unionised, or atleast regulated in the aspect that these disparities are brought into the open. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Serowbot on 09/17/12 at 13:45:27 Since we're on a random rant... Oil prices are no longer supply/demand... speculators are manipulating the market, and taking a cut... regulate/nationalize/federalize/socialize/ somethin'ize that market... oil is a national security issue... ... and,.. to me... the solution isn't "smaller government",... but, less wasteful government... Cut the crap. I don't mind paying for results, and services,... and needed things like infrastructure... America should have the best transportation system in the world,.. same with healthcare,.. We're the biggest, richest, bestest.... All we have is most waste and corruption... Reign in the lobbyist's somehow,.. and get corporate money out of elections... Corporations are not people... Lobbyists,.. aren't either... ;D... |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/18/12 at 00:02:48 You DO understand what it means to have a contract with the state To Keep Occupancy at 90%, right? & Our Tax $$$$ still supports them,, all the while they Use the prisoners to compete with industry,. I swear, you guys are NOT grasping this. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/18/12 at 09:17:36 5442554850454853270 wrote:
This is what I have to say on that topic - no such thing ... we cant get more efficient govt, we cant get smarter govt and we certainly cant get less wasteful govt by legislation. No politician can get any better govt. Its like stopping time. Hell no. Smaller govt is less efficient govt. Say you fire everyone in govt. Send em all home. Guess what, the buildings are still there, we have to pay for them (cos we do have payments on most of em, you can turn off everything ... that is $$$ flying out your pocket with 0 return. Romney cant lay claim to "smarter govt" just like Obama cant lay claim to say stopping time. Bigger govt is usually more efficient. Too big = wasteful too, but you need all the engineering etc etc staff to complete the entire road in a reasonable stretch of time. You cant build one over 20 years like they did to 485 in charlotte. Want a road like that, survey and stake it say 3-6 months. Build the road through the open stretches, 2-3 years. Build exits and entry points 2-3 years. Done. By the time 485 is done in charlotte there are parts of 485 so congested it is time to expand it, and it cant be cos that segment is full of strip malls and subdivisions. Smaller govt is possible, smarter, more efficient, better is not, atleast not by making it smaller. Most of the recent expansion in govt as the TEA sees it is simply due to aging of the population and people collecting SS and medicaid/care, the 2 wars 1/2 way round the world, expansion of food stamp eligibility all of which were Bushies Idea, and Obama is just following on the obligations made by the govt. The TEA/Right want to re-neg on the obligations by the govt to people and blame Obama for it. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/18/12 at 22:24:21 Maybe this will do it. How do you guys feel about the government promising to keep jails filled to at least 90% occupancy? What happens if it falls below that? They just have to create a conviction? Yes, thats what it means, |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Starlifter on 09/19/12 at 20:48:46 Sure, that's why the cops are going nuts again like they did in the 60'd. They have their marching orders. Participate in peaceful demonstrations like "occupy" and they will use plants to incite trouble. The cops will move in with teargas and tazers and bang, you're doing time. Smoke a joint in Texas and you might go to prison for 30 years. The privatization of prisons, social security, the military, or any other facet of the American system of governance and you have more billions flowing into the pockets of the corporatists, and the erosion of freedoms for the general populace. Want you're country back? Kick the repugs the hell out of office and never give them an inch until the repub party is consigned into the trashcan of history. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/20/12 at 12:33:57 4A555354494E7F4F7F47555912200 wrote:
|
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by srinath on 09/20/12 at 13:19:45 091610170A0D3C0C3C04161A51630 wrote:
[/quote] Grasp it well we do young grass hopper. We are just talking about why ... the whole drive to privatise everything ... yea govt employees sit around BS'ing all the time and waste our $$$, however the act of squeezing every ounce out of everything in sight is no alternative. There are some aspects of modern life that have to be run by the govt like I've said before. Every country on the planet has these things run by the state ...if it exists ... Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Paraquat on 09/20/12 at 16:22:04 We should get a beer some time, Starlifter. --Steve |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Starlifter on 09/20/12 at 19:03:39 Yes my friend, we surly should. :D |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/21/12 at 01:41:22 Id have a surly beer with ya., >:( |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by mpescatori on 09/21/12 at 02:45:48 6472657860757863170 wrote:
ARMY, POLICE AND COURTS OF LAW. Once those three go private, you are a citizen no longer, but a subject. It's the difference between being a land-owner of a serf of the field. A Man or a plebe. It's not nice, trust me. I know, we've been having that ever since the fall of the Empire until a few decades ago... :P |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Paraquat on 09/21/12 at 06:14:17 5A454344595E6F5F6F57454902300 wrote:
A beer's a beer. --Steve |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Starlifter on 09/21/12 at 06:35:56 "Surly" Meh, typo there..."surly" well I know a lot of folks like that..beer, not so much. ;) |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Pine on 09/21/12 at 12:19:18 With regards to the original post (prisions being bought and required to be kept at 90% occ). So much BS on the BS-o-meter with the idea that more people would be shuffled in or kept longer on such a notion. What would happen is that county and state run prisions would have to work like a resevoir.. and it would be thier populations that would fluctuate versus the large central prison. Currently, ( at least here) prisons WANT a higher pop when there is money made by doing so and when there isnt.. they just start letting people out (which in turns get the money flowing back in). All the contractor is seeking to avoid is that state woud not be allowed withhold prisoners when the money is good and flood the prison when its not. To be sure, the state would be taking the hit for empty cells not the contractor. This is pretty basic stuff. Need a model? Just look at the schools, same concept. hold on.. then Serowbot chimed in with... Yup... get rid of the for-profit, do nothin', middleman... Save 1/3 right off the top... plus lower office admin costs... Probably raise that savings to 50%... Then, guaranteed payment for all patients, lowers costs even more... ...and everyone contributes... Also,.. providers will be busy enough with legitimate care, they won't need to order so much unnecessary procedures to pad their bills... First.. I do not pose that only for-profit models work in all cases.. so bear that in mind: In a for profit system investors can invest on the front end to build the infrastrucure that allows a lower cost of a longer period of time. Remove the profit and that infrstructure still needs to be created/maintained.. that means taxpayers pay it. And 100% of the patients does not mean 100% of the taxpayers.. so no.. by design a not-for-profit system will cost some a WHOLE bunch .. and others very little. No doubt there are middlemen that make a fortune on health care.. 1/3.. doubtful. Maybe 5%. Office admin costs.. will skyrocket.. already have. Zero savings there... more costs to come. Why? when profits cant be used to define how to allocate resources.. paperwork must be used. everyone gets covered... the healthcare sysetm always gets paid... but NO .. not everyone is contributing.. in fact Very few will directly contribute as it wont "seem fair" so taxes and fees will be put about to generate the income as best it can. Now your 50% is 5% and no one is contributing.. I know! lets print more money!! QE 297,452 ??? The last problem with non-profit is that it works best with stable/static systems. So as long as your happy with drugs that are 50 years old and procedures that are 50 years old.. GREAT. Zero profit means zero need for risk to change either. Wrap some mouldy bread on your wound... it worked in 1840! a bigger government can never be MORE effcient. More government can never be MORE efficient. The government is what it is... efficient is not one of those things. But it certainly has its place. My preference would be for MOST things to be handled at the state level or lower. There is no good reason for someone 3000 miles away having ANYTHING to do with my healthcare. Again, I am not saying current system is great, or even good... hell it sucks. But, being blind to what removing for-profit means can lead to some pretty sucky systems as well. And to me DISTANCE make the difference... Greedy middle man corp or robot brain federal worker.. If I cant walk over and slap the the crap out of them for being stupid... the system aint right. AND THAT is the current idea for BOTH systems... too much distance. sauve Pine |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Trippah on 09/21/12 at 20:07:45 I don't remember giving the right to imprison me to a corporation..only to a government. of course, in fact it's been done before (Pinkertons in Kentucky) etc ad nausium. The reason to privatize is simply to reduce pension costs, health insurance costs and oversight. Its a redistribution wealth (Witch the elephants decry) only with the top management and shareholders increasing their share of the pie, the workers getting less. If this sounds familiar, it should. ;D ;D |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by Paraquat on 10/08/12 at 09:14:25 http://https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/546359_4358985824519_1853382426_n.jpg --Steve |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by heroicseven on 10/08/12 at 09:59:18 Sounds like a bad plan. |
|
Title: Re: http://govtslaves.info/govt-guarantees-90-occu Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/08/12 at 20:27:35 4B6D766F6F7E771F0 wrote:
The OWNERSHIP of the Prison Is NOT the point. Pay ATTENTION HERE When the State GUARANTEES 90% FILLED PRISONS,, what does that mean? It MEANS they Promise they WILL Arrest, Prosecute & CONVICT enough people to KEEP the Prisons FULL.. GET IT????>?> |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |