|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Strange Behavior /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1345309316 Message started by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 10:01:56 |
|
Title: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 10:01:56 Since a few days whenever I start the bike, it doesn't crank for a few revolutions like usual. It just starts the instant I push the starter button. What could that be? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by Serowbot on 08/18/12 at 10:05:33 ... a good thing?... :)... |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by Dave on 08/18/12 at 11:24:10 Strange Behavior???.....I thought you were talking about me for a moment! Weather change? Maybe a switch to cooler weather is not evaporating fuel out of the float bowl as fast. If you still have the stock petcock, it might take a revolution or two of the engine to get evaporated fuel back into the float bowl....while cooler weather may let the fuel stay in the float bowl longer. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 12:25:42 Well I would call it strange, because it's like a light switch. The cylinder is firing the instant you push the button. I can't even hear the decompression solenoid banging. Could that be the problem? I mean the bike starts effortless, still is odd or not? I don't know how to describe it...It don't seem to even crank, or what you would call cranking. Like you had push started it and would fire on the first try. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by SaVaGeEaRL on 08/18/12 at 14:39:53 I know exactly what you're talking about, because mine started to do the exact same thing. I have no idea why, and it's been running the same otherwise as before for 2 months now |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 15:36:27 362C2B2E29283E375B0 wrote:
It has done that a few times before over the years, but only briefly for a few starts and ONLY after I had been on the road for a longer trip with hotter temperatures, and stopped for gas and a drink. It always went away. But this time it started doing it out of the blue in the morning when the bike was stone cold and the temperature was 61 degrees. At first I thought: "awww, that shite again", but this time it kept doing it, and it's doing it now since two weeks straight. Like you said, it"s running normal other than that, I'm just one of those inquiring minds that wants to know why, and wonders if still something is about to break or is already. The only thing neat about it is, that it reduces cranking time down to nothing and gives you the impression that this ought to be easy on the battery as well. Did you check your decomp solenoid? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 18:17:57 I suppose I found what it is: The decomp thingie isn't clacking anymore. The reason it fires up instantly is that it has instant compression and the battery and starter are strong enough to turn over the motor. I'm gonna yank the tank tomorrow and see why it isn't working. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 19:40:14 I just checked and the solenoid isn't moving. Now what? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ZAR on 08/18/12 at 19:46:02 667578726D73616D140 wrote:
Check with rfw2003 on that. He took the controller off and apart and found mucho green crud(moisture damage) in his. That caused the malfunction. He is working on making a new and better controller for the de-comp solenoid. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 19:49:55 697261330 wrote:
Check with rfw2003 on that. He took the controller off and apart and found mucho green crud(moisture damage) in his. That caused the malfunction. He is working on making a new and better controller for the de-comp solenoid. [/quote] Mabe it's just stuck. Who knows...gonna yank the tank tomorrow and see what's up. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by SaVaGeEaRL on 08/18/12 at 19:51:21 Run a test wire from the battery to the solenoid and see if it works. Mine does, but it doesn't when starting normally. And my bike will also on occasion not start at all unless I use the starter button I have wired in due to the faulty solenoid controller I have and can't get myself to pay 70 bucks for. Now you mention it though, I do believe that my instant start came about the same time as my controller died. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ZAR on 08/18/12 at 19:52:36 6D7E737966786A661F0 wrote:
Check with rfw2003 on that. He took the controller off and apart and found mucho green crud(moisture damage) in his. That caused the malfunction. He is working on making a new and better controller for the de-comp solenoid. [/quote] Mabe it's just stuck. Who knows...gonna yank the tank tomorrow and see what's up.[/quote] Ralf the controller is not waterproofed and where it sits under the tank it's a pure "water magnet" Riding in the rain or washing will certainly get it wet...and it' does not dry out easily. Won't hurt to check. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by rfw2003 on 08/18/12 at 19:57:19 That does sound like decomp controller issues. The controller has a very short time delay in it to fire the decomp solenoid right before the starter. If you test your solenoid directly and it works when you apply the 12v to it, then it's most likely the controller. It's supposed to be sealed but in reality they didn't do a very good job of it, so water does get in at times and can cause the controller to fail in various ways. At least yours so far just failed in a way it's no longer doing the decomp solenoid and not causing a "Spooky Zuki" effect :) As to the remark from Zar, Yes I'm in the process of designing and will then build a much better replacement for that over priced POS R.F. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 20:15:06 Thanks for the input guys. I'll try the battery connection test tomorrow, just hate to have to pull the dam' tank. I had this before a few times over the years and it went away again on it's own. This time it's persistent. I also noticed it only happened in summer. Mebbe it's just stuck. Oh BTW, for the controller getting wet, I wouldn't know when, because my bike never gets wet, no riding in the rain, no parking in the rain. If it was wet, I wouldn't know from what. I'll check anyway, if the battery direct connection test fails. I should be able to test the controller if it puts out any voltage when pushing the starter button right? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/18/12 at 20:23:46 Its a dang short burst,, youll need a digital meter. Heck, a test lite mite be better. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by rfw2003 on 08/18/12 at 20:29:51 5B48454F504E5C50290 wrote:
It can get moisture just from humidity outta the air, the glue seal they put on it does nothing at all I found out. Wasn't even a residue of the glue on the outer part of the casing when I took mine apart. If you can reach the controller with a screwdriver or socket extension you might be able to tap it a few time to see if the relay inside of it for the decomp solenoid is just sticking. R.F. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/18/12 at 20:32:50 5F4046415C5B6A5A6A52404C07350 wrote:
I got a digital meter, but no test light. If nothing else you can use an old speaker. I have several laying around. You could just watch the membrane move, or even better, wire it to the horn! My digital meter has a built in auto hold to capture spikes. That might work too. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/18/12 at 20:41:18 or even better, wire it to the horn! That right there sounds like a pretty danged good answer.. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by Dave on 08/19/12 at 05:02:34 30243570727271420 wrote:
Should those of us that have working ones consider doing some kind of sealing of the joint next time we have the tank off? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 07:49:47 4B5F4E0B09090A390 wrote:
It can get moisture just from humidity outta the air, the glue seal they put on it does nothing at all I found out. Wasn't even a residue of the glue on the outer part of the casing when I took mine apart. If you can reach the controller with a screwdriver or socket extension you might be able to tap it a few time to see if the relay inside of it for the decomp solenoid is just sticking. R.F.[/quote] Actually if you look a little closer, that rubber cap has a little lip inside and the brass bushing the shaft runs in has a little groove on the circumference so it snaps into place. I tried tapping it with a hammer, but nothing. I put a little LPS1 on it, the stuff I clean my guns with, still nothing. I'm gonna yank the tank and go from there. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 10:00:49 Solenoid is sticking at times. Controller puts out 11.7 volts. I pulled on the cable that goes in the back and managed to get it working about 10 times in a row, then it quit again. Can't unhinged the stinking cable from the decomp lever. Got the lock nuts off, but still won't come out. Got it on TDC, but lever won't you up far enough to unhinge the cable. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/19/12 at 10:09:08 Take the solenoid mount bracket off the frame & release all tension? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 10:25:54 4E5157504D4A7B4B7B43515D16240 wrote:
That did the trick. THANKS! |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 10:27:59 Got the piece off and apart and cleaned everything. Now just laying it there and pushing the starter button makes it clack nice an neat. I lubed the cable a little too, put a little lube on the shaft and bushing. I'm gonna put it all back together now. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by rfw2003 on 08/19/12 at 10:28:27 4E75786F7E72696F747C716E1D0 wrote:
Should those of us that have working ones consider doing some kind of sealing of the joint next time we have the tank off?[/quote] It couldn't hurt. You would also want to use some dielectric grease on the plug because those terminals aren't sealed in there either, so that is another entrance point for moisture. R.F. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/19/12 at 10:39:57 4A59545E415F4D41380 wrote:
That did the trick. THANKS![/quote] Wheres that emoticon of a guy buffin his nails on his shirt? Glad I could help. If its like that goin together,, I think thats a problem,,ask some of the "Knows how to adjust the thing:" guys.. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 10:49:47 I unhinged the cable and immediately put the one lock nut against the other. So when I put it back together, there shouldn't be any adjustment. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/19/12 at 11:04:56 Point IM tryin to make is, I dont think that cable is supposed to be tight. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 13:52:18 3F2026213C3B0A3A0A32202C67550 wrote:
Got it back together. But battery was too weak to start. So i put it in first and push started it and putted along right away. I tried in second, but it works better in first. So far the solenoid is still banging. What it was is it was a little dirty, but more importantly after it gets actuated, and then releases, the round plate rests against the frame and in my case every now and then kinda gets jammed a little crooked when slapping against the frame. That gets it stuck and then it won't move. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/19/12 at 14:48:25 That gets it stuck and then it won't move. Hmmm,, wont move Ehhh? Well,, that certainly Sounds like a workable definition of STUKKK... I know Ive lost things & couldnt find them,, I miss my mind most of all,, |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 15:29:35 So far it still works. If it quits again I have another thing I can try. This thing shouldn't get affected that much by dirt as it's pretty much free in the open wind and gets dirty from dust rather quickly just from riding. What I noticed is that round plate that moves when actuated, when it retracts and rests against the frame, it touches the frame more with the outer edge rather than with the whole surface. It seems that it is mounted a little crooked. You can see the imprint of the edge in the frame where it hits. Next time I try to bend the brackets upward a little to let hit the frame with the whole surface, thus preventing from jamming. |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/19/12 at 16:39:06 Next time I try to bend the brackets upward a little to let hit the frame with the whole surface, thus preventing from jamming. You may be onto something there. If the internals are exposed to open air, I wouldnt think it should be lubed,, |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by markbacon on 08/19/12 at 17:29:50 Ummm ... I always assumed this was down to the cylinder having enough fuel vapour in it for the exhaust stoke spark to ignite and assist the intake stroke (we've got crank driven igntion rather than cam, so fires at top of both compression adn exhaust strokes). ... ? |
|
Title: Re: Strange Behavior Post by ralfyguy on 08/19/12 at 18:11:28 3C2325223F3809390931232F64560 wrote:
Well I didn't soak it in lube. I wiped everything off and just left a thin film on the shaft. I also noticed that when it didn't work, loosening the bolts made it work again. Tighten the bolts and it quit. So whatever did that, I couldn't see what made it jam when tighten the bolts. For some reason it works now. We'll see for how long. It actually is a pretty strong electric magnet and I don't know why all the sudden it gets so sensitive. Like I said, in the four years I had the bike I has done it briefly on occasion, but always cured itself. |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |