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Message started by Preach on 06/04/12 at 10:22:39

Title: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/04/12 at 10:22:39

My Daughter is thinking about getting the S40 as her first bike. It seems to weigh about the same as a 250 but with more pep.

Any concerns, such as maintenance or highway issues?

The only aftermarket seat I have found so far is from Corbin. Are they good?

She is average height and a little on the large size, not fat, but not skinny either.

Will read all I can about the bike before purchase.

Preach

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Serowbot on 06/04/12 at 10:25:23

It's not the best highway bike,.. but better than a 250...

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/04/12 at 10:32:08

7E687F627A6F62790D0 wrote:

It's not the best highway bike,.. but better than a 250...

Is that because of a low top end or what? She will be doing some highway travel and hopefully will be able to make a trip with me on my bike. Cruising at 70 or so should be fine.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Greg on 06/04/12 at 10:35:14

I have only put about 1500 miles on mine, but my opinion is I am so glad I got a Savage instead of a 250cc. I am a big guy but average height. My inseam is short though at 29". The 250cc bikes were way too short for me. And only having half the horsepower as the LS650 didn't seem like a good idea for the highway. I am very comfortable taking the "regular" highway at 55mph. Which means traveling at 60 to 65mph. Works well. Plenty of passing power left for me. The front end seems to be under control. On our main highways with a 65mph speed the minimum travel speed is 75mph. The bike is yelling at me at that point and the front feels light. I do my best to avoid these speeds. As far as comfort on the highway, I lifted the front of my seat an inch or so and it made all the difference in the world. That and a "throttle boss" allow me to ride pretty much all day.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by bojangals43 on 06/04/12 at 10:36:47

I agree with Serow. It may not be the best highway bike, as it's a little light, but it has everyhting it needs to keep up with anyone on the freeway. I use my 02' for commuting and love it but I like it even more when just cruising arouind town. Very reliable. I have a corbin seat also and would highly recommend one. Good luck to you and your daughter! I'm sure you'll both enjoy it ;)

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Pine on 06/04/12 at 11:26:50

I agree with the majority... great bike up to 65mph. At 70, the bike feels very light and "twichy"... not a fun place to me. Will it do it yes.. I got up to 80 on it. At 60 the bike is "in the zone" at 70.. not so much.

Myself= 5'7" 160lbs... so I am a small guy... something to compare to.

The bike really shines when moving about town and such. I can back the bike up .. UPHILL without to much work... try that with a 600 pounder. Very easy to deal with this bike when parking and moving it about while turned off/no power. Other pluses ( to me) very quiet at cruising speed (anything over 40). Good torque, and it is very forgiving in operation ( missed shifts, staying in gear a little long, and lugging). I like to shift early and lug the motor to a degree. Savage lets me do it. These things are much more important that being able to do 70 plus as I do them ALL THE TIME. However, if the main focus of the bike is interstate cruising .. I would look at a heavier bike.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by bill67 on 06/04/12 at 11:36:55

Not a very stable bike above 60 mph.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by bess227 on 06/04/12 at 12:21:49

Preach.

you have definitely come to the right place to find out if this will be the bike for your daughter. Welcome.

I bought this bike without really knowing what I was getting into. It was in the price range, had the torque, and it was close by. One plus is that this forum is a treasure chest of great folks and good information to help you with problems and questions.

That said, I am a bigger guy, and I echo all the statements to this point. I have over 1k miles in the saddle on mine so far, and it is perfect around town and cruising at 55 and 60.....over 60 mine starts to sing a little and anything over that to 70, the bike is able but the ride changes significantly. If she is going to do a lot of highway speeds, I would shop a heavier bike.

I feel like she would love it for "normal" everyday riding. That is what I use it for, commute is about 25 miles round trip and couldn't ask for it to be any better suited for it's daily tasks.

Safe ridin.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by teabowl13 on 06/04/12 at 12:29:51

I think it's a perfect first bike. Like you say; better than most 250's, but still light and manageable. If after a year or so on this bike, your daughter decides she needs something a little bigger for highway driving, then she can look at getting something bigger as a second bike.

Also, in the mean time, a good windscreen can make all the difference on the highway on any bike, and they can be had for $100 or so. It will make the ride more comfortable, and she will feel a lot more stable and in control without a 70mph wind in her face. Lots of reviews of different people's windscreens on this site, so search for a good recommendation here. I have a Givi on my Nighthawk which sees a good bit of highway miles and I love it!

Get her some good protective riding gear and a good full face helmet!

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by babyhog on 06/04/12 at 13:19:10

Definitely a good place for her to start. As a female, I felt most of the other bikes out there were too heavy for me, but I'm only about 115# soaking wet. I'm 5'2 with plenty of inseam for this bike, and not "afraid" of it. My husband wants me to get a bigger bike for better highway travelling, but I'm in my 5th season of riding and I still don't ride the interstate much. Feels better than any of the 250's from my Rider's course, has alot of get-up-and-GO!

As someone else said, if she wants a bigger bike later, that's fine, but from a female standpoint, this bike won't threaten her and make things more difficult than they need to be. If she's new to riding, this bike will make for a great experience, instead of a scary one!

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/04/12 at 13:33:34

6E6D6C616379000 wrote:

Thanks for your input. She is heavier than you, but I still think she could use the bike. The highway between here and college max's out at 70. It is mostly 4 lane, so she could go about 65 and let others pass her without her being a determent to traffic flow.

Most of her riding will be from her apartment to the college campus.

BTW she is 5'6" and about 200 lbs.

Preach

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by bill67 on 06/04/12 at 13:51:20

Drive it 65 mph before you buy.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by martinfilms34 on 06/04/12 at 13:57:51

at 6'2" and 210lbs I have no trouble getting the savage up to highway speeds. I'd definitely recommend it over a bigger bike for a beginner.

There have been many instances that i would've dropped the bike if it weighed more than the 380.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by BuckRYCA on 06/04/12 at 14:21:16

Last weekend I watched a guy drop his Sportster pulling into a graveled parking lot. He got his foot down, but could not recover it. The bike was too heavy.

I've owned and ridden big, heavy bikes, but now my 'big bike' is my Ryca-converted Savage weighing in at 325 lbs.

The Savage/S40/Ryca, whatever variant, is a great bike up to about 60 mph actual (the speedo reads 5-10% higher than actual). Beyond that, the motors starts to pant and the handling slowly degrades. I've had mine to 88 mph actual. It was asking me to slow down.

Unless you are a habitual, long distance tourer or a straight-line speed freak, there is no need for a big bike. Smaller bikes do better in the curves and are more forgiving overall.

Small is Beautiful.

http://mefi.us/images/fuelly/smallsig-us/120469.png (http://www.fuelly.com/driver/r1b2h/cs1)

http://mefi.us/images/fuelly/smallsig-us/120466.png (http://www.fuelly.com/driver/r1b2h/tu250x)

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Boofer on 06/04/12 at 19:35:42

Depends on what you mean by "highway" riding. I have a bad back, so consider that in my reply. I have no problem riding 4 lane, but concrete with expansion joints is not fun. My 2001 has a sweet spot for me at 67 indicated. I ride awhile and look down and there it is--67mph indicated. Shocks can be set to five levels? I believe, and some tires are harder than others. Some tires stand lower pressures better than the Metzelers I now have running around 38-40 lbs. I think the LS 650/S40 is a great bike and probably better than the KLR for commutes, especially with the lower seat heigth. Like someone said, you are in the best place you can be for answers. Keep in mind we LIKE working on our bikes, but you don't have to. Let us know where you live and we will be glad to help you get used to your new bike (changing oil, plug, etc.) Or just PM whoever you are comfortable with and we sometimes end up on the phone. I'm in North Miss, but we are literally all around the world. Welcome. :)

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/04/12 at 19:49:21

Well, she will ride on a US highway that is mostly country roads. She would not be at high speeds for long stretches as the road goes through several communities with lower speed limits.

I guess I am just wanting to make sure she is as safe as possible. I guess I am a worrying dad.

Preach

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Dave Sisk on 06/04/12 at 22:05:24

6F4D5A5E5C573F0 wrote:

I guess I am just wanting to make sure she is as safe as possible. I guess I am a worrying dad.

Preach

Nuthin' wrong with that! ;) Let her get plenty of practice before striking out on her own.

Dave

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by SuperSavage on 06/04/12 at 22:39:07

The Savage/s40 is plenty of bike for anyone starting out, and then some. The highway can be a scary and dangerous place for a novice rider. Lot's of cars, trucks, debris and speed. With all that to deal with, a light nimble scoot can be a lifesaver. Also, it isn't a chore at low speed, is forgiving and durable. And did I mention, it's affordable...

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by heroicseven on 06/05/12 at 00:39:25

This savage is my first bike and I hope to keep it for a lifetime, maybe get one of my kids on it later in life. I can do 70 comfy down the 5 here in SD no problem. Its perfect however for around town and to work. Does best around 50-60 mph.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Wolfman on 06/05/12 at 01:23:23

A 250 is a perfect beginner bike. The S40 is a perfect intermediate bike and a pretty good beginner bike if you respect it.
Lot of low end torque which makes it perfect around town and on secondary roads and highways. It will run 70 all day long on the superslab.
Master the throttle and clutch friction zone and keep in mind the 'little' 650 is what the BIG road bikes used to be not so very many years ago.

Disrespect it and the torque will snap your head back and try to roll you off if your not hanging on...lol
Excellent around town bike as it has plenty of power to get you out of jams and leave most cages behind. But not so much its a beast to handle. At 5'6" 200lbs she'll be fine on it.

I don't think twice about hitting the highway at 70. Only thing is wind will buffet you a bit more and you need to kind of plan your passing. Most of em top out around 85 or so.
Mine doesn't get buzzy until about 75 and then its not bad.

Its a bike small enough to learn on and big enough to do about anything you want to with it. And big enough to keep you interested for several years.
Biggest drawback is its about to small for a lot of two up riding.
That and a small tank. Id love a 6th gear as well.
Not a lot of aftermarket add ons.
Perfect for one up or commuting. Kinda sips at the gas if your not heavy handed. Easy maintenance and fairly easy to mod if your handy with tools.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Dave Sisk on 06/05/12 at 05:07:28

4E6B6C6A6A7D67657036343535040 wrote:

...With all that to deal with, a light nimble scoot can be a lifesaver...

Lady friend and I had that discussion about her learning to ride. Which is "better"...a small motorcycle (her's is a Suzuki GZ250) or a large scooter? She even considered trike's.

I can certainly see some benefit to starting with a scooter...lighter weight, lower center of gravity, automatic CVT transmission...easier to manage and fewer controls to think about.

The main thing that I think is bad about most scooters is that the controls are different...the rear brake is at the left hand (on most...there's at least one with a rear brake at the right foot). I think this causes you to learn a bad habit that you later have to unlearn if/when you move up to a manual motorcycle. For instnace, panic stop on a motorcycle after a riding a scooter...I think you'd have a tendency to grab the clutch and front brake, and forget about the rear brake. Of course, according to "Proficient Motorcycling", forgetting the rear brake might not be such a bad habit anyway...he says essentially forget the rear brake because locking it then unlocking it can cause a high-side flip, so I dunno.

Anyway, some of the 50cc scooters can be had used for really cheap (like in a few hundred, especially if you have a college nearby)...it might be worth picking up one temporarily.

My 9 yr old daughter asked for a kid's dirt bike after seeing me practicing on a motorcycle. ;D I got her a small electric scooter that will only go about 12 mph...I figured she can learn on that, and we'll take it from there.

Dave

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/05/12 at 06:49:42

I am going to take her to sit on a S40 this afternoon. We will see how it fits her.

Based on what most have stated here, she should be able to do alright by getting one. Her highway riding will be limited and mostly commuting to and from campus.

Thanks for the input

Preach :)

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by RidgeRacer on 06/05/12 at 07:13:20

I'm teaching my wife to ride on the Savage and one nice thing is that it has enough torque that she can get it rolling with just the clutch. Of course she will have to learn clutch / throttle coordination for starts from hills etc. But for now it is nice she can concentrate on learning the feel of the clutch without stalling the bike or dropping the clutch on a racing engine.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Dave Sisk on 06/05/12 at 08:46:42

I think the S40 is a reasonable bike to learn on. I actually encouraged the lady friend I mentioned above to just go with a GZ250 versus a big scooter to learn on. If you want to ride anything bigger than a scooter, you'll eventually HAVE to learn how to handle the clutch/manual/throttle, etc....might as well just go ahead and learn it right the first time.

I first snagged a cheap Chinese 250cc cruiser (a Roketa MC-51 Tonga)...it looked cool and had a nice exhaust sound for a 250...but that's about it. ;) The engine was rev-happy, but rattled and buzzed at higher revs like it was going to fly apart. (It didn't...if just sounded like it.) The transmission was geared very short, especially in 1st gear...even feathering the throttle could take you from stalling to lurching forward to dropping the bike. Plus, it was heavy...it weighed about 440 lbs (the same weight as an 800cc Suzuki S50!). After reading some of the book "Proficient Motorcyling", I think the steering geometry on that Chinese bike had some issues...even after moving, it always felt "twitchy" like any minor mistake and I'd end up on the ground. I sold it after about a month for what I had in it. That said, it did get me started, and I got two of my drops over with on that Chinese bike :) I don't think I'd recommend it to anyone though.

By comparison, the S40 is lighter, has much more torque, geared much taller, sits lower, and just *feels like* it wants to go straight (versus it *wants to* turn and fall over...LOL).

That said, I think a GZ250 is a better choice for my lady friend to start out on...if she drops that little 330 lb bike, she can actually pick it up. ;D It doesn't have enough torque to get her into too much trouble. I think she could probably graduate to an S40 or Savage and be happy with that for quite a while after maybe a few more months. She has a lot of basic skills still to practice and fully master (but don't most of us? I certainly do), but the biggest problem right now is her irritating cars behind us by poking along too slow...which I think is just as bad as going too fast...people get impatient and do stupid things (like a mini-van trying to pass us both on a left turn. Don't ask how I know. :o ) At some level, I think having enough torque and HP to get you out of someone's way is a good thing, given that it's delivered in a manageable and forgiving way (as it is on the S40).

Dave

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by rfw2003 on 06/05/12 at 08:57:51

I live in a small town rural area so I get a good mix of city speeds and up to 70mph as well. The Savage handles all this very well with me and no complaints so far. I'm abit heavier then your girlfriend though so the higher speed on the highways and no issues for me may have something to do with that, as I come in at around 240. Fastest I've been on her is around 85 and that was passing someone on a 2 lane in a 70mph zone. I've been out on the Super slab a few time and the big rigs don't really bother me that much either. Most of my experience in the pas was all on dirt bikes with the occasional use of my brothers street bikes. This is my first street bike of my own, and first time riding again in about 18 years. Myself I'm really impressed with the Savage and think it's a great little bike.

R.F.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Wolfman on 06/05/12 at 11:38:21

Just curious preach, but has she had any riding experience at all? Friends or family members bikes?
The MSF course would be a real good place to start and then practice practice practice.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/05/12 at 11:48:42

She is going to take the MSF course. In fact it is required here in Texas. She has no experience other than as a passenger on mine. It may be a couple of months before she gets hers anyway. School bills come first.

Preach

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Wolfman on 06/05/12 at 13:21:11

You might be better off buying her a cheap beater bike like a ninja 250,cbr 250, gz 250 or honda rebel 250 to learn on untill the school bills are taken care of. Much more forgiveing if you F up.
You can pretty much get your money back out of them when you resell as well. Then move up to the 650.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Dave Sisk on 06/05/12 at 13:49:20

I see the Ninja 250 as almost equivalent to an S40, except in a sport bike flavor. It'll top 100mph...it may be a 250, but it's certainly not in the same class as a little GZ250 or equivalent, for instance.

IMHO, of course. ;)

Dave

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by dinsdale on 06/05/12 at 14:51:34

Ninja 250 has the same HP as the S40 IIRC.

Different flavours but same concept.
Great Beginner/Intermediate bikes

I commute about 70 miles a day on mine.
I find 55-60 mph to be the sweet spot but it will get up and do 75-80 mph but it feels really fast and a little twitchy.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Preach on 06/05/12 at 17:11:57

She does not want a sports bike. She really liked the S40 she sat on today.

Preach

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by gerald.hughes on 06/05/12 at 17:30:13

Actually, I think that the perfect bike for her would be a 450 Ducati single.

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by Bubba on 06/06/12 at 09:13:52

if she liked the S40 that's the one to get...liking your bike and the way it feels is going to make her more comfortable if she's never ridden.

As far as the occassional hwy riding...you can add a fork brace to it and it will firm up the handling....not that I know...but that's what lots of folks say.

I think a brace is in the future for me but my hwy riding is limited so it's a maybe kinda thing... :)

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by teabowl13 on 06/06/12 at 09:36:15

Fork braces are also really helpful on other roads as well. I ride a lot of beaten up back country roads; we get a lot of frost heaving here in Maine, and having the brace REALLY helps with stability at all speeds. She may not find it necessary right away, but as she gets more confident, and starts going a little faster it may help.
There are also some simple and easy ways to squeeze a little more HP out of these bikes if she decides she wants a little more highway Uumph later down the road. These can be done without making a speed demon out of the bike. I suspect she's going to feel a lot more comfortable at higher speeds on the Savage than almost any 250 out there.
Besides, if she's not super comfortable going over 85MPH, That's a GOOD thing!! I've been riding for 25 years, and I'm rarely comfortable going more than 85MPH at all...

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by teabowl13 on 06/06/12 at 09:41:29

Oh, and as far as the Honda Rebel's and Ninja 250's I've priced around here; I can usually find decent, low-mileage Savages for less money, and it's a longer term bike. Why buy a bike you're going to ride for 3-6 months and then outgrow? Seems like a waste of time and effort, even if you do get your money back out of it.
These bikes have been around for a long time, and they are dirt-simple to repair and easy and cheap to find parts for when you need them, so it's no big deal if she drops it and bangs it up a bit. Most of the used ones for sale I find are ridden by women and beginner riders, and they aren't beaten on or street-raced like a lot of sport bikes, so even the older ones tend to be in pretty god shape mechanically, as long as they haven't been neglected too long or left out in the rain for years.

Good Luck! :)

Title: Re: Daughter's First Bike
Post by tizzyfit on 06/09/12 at 02:11:08

193B2C282A21490 wrote:

If the only options are the S40 or a 250, take the S40. I've owned both and there no question, the S40 out performs my Yamaha 250. As for the Corbin seat, I have one on my S40 and consider it to be a very worthwhile investment. In my humble opinion, NEITHER of these two are candidates for 65 mph+ on the freeways, particularly in medium to heavy traffic. Those conditions will increase the pucker factor by several 100 percent.