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Message started by MMRanch on 01/23/12 at 22:05:03

Title: Harley question
Post by MMRanch on 01/23/12 at 22:05:03

I hope its ok to ask this here , there seems to be enough experenced machinics that someone might know.

OK , the Harley had to be trailered home today. (go ahead and laugh OldFeller) . Well the starter will spin the transmission but not the motor. In gear the starter will move the bike but not fast enough to push-start-it (could be voltage can't support starter and coil at same time). push-starting it is like the clutch is slipping.

Any ideas on what to look for ?

:-[

Yea I got to fix it befor I can sell it . :-/

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by verslagen1 on 01/23/12 at 22:29:22

Honda cb's have that problem too, starter drives the clutch.
usually a busted gear inside.

but being that your clutch is slipping, i'd look there.

did the harley come with the trailer? http://smileyicons.net/s/490.gif

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by Demin on 01/24/12 at 05:23:24

Definetly sounds like a clutch problem.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/24/12 at 06:29:04

We were in Jefferson, Texas, at a fun little place called Auntie Skinners. Always a few bikes out front, sometimes, quite a few. They were raffling off a High Dollar , REally nice looking, slightly customized, Harley.

It came with trailer,,,

It wasnt easy keeping the beer in my mouth out of my sinuses,

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by Oldfeller on 01/24/12 at 11:42:25

Hey, although I hunt Hurleys fer fun, MM is a good riding buddy. I didn't laugh at him in the mountains, nor will I laugh at him now.

MM, get on a hurley forum and ask them, I am sure all these unexpected hurley joys are common knowledge to the skilled long term Hurley riders there ....

I have no direct knowledge to share on this one beyond what I have seen second hand from you and your 1200cc Sportster. It seems like your starter spins the tranny and there isn't a connection any more. Clutch throw out actuating system ???

I dunno -- I am guessing.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by dasch on 01/26/12 at 03:59:05

Shouldn't starter engage the flywheel? What's clutch have to do with it? I might be missing the point...

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by T Mack 1 - FSO on 01/26/12 at 15:30:54

If I read this right, the engine does not turn over at all. If so, the primary chain setup is broken.

On Harley's, the engine crankshaft output shaft has a sprocket that drives a chain that goes to the clutch/tranny. The starter engages a gear on the clutch basket. So, if the starter will move the bike, but the engine does nothing, it's in the primary chain setup somewhere.

On LS650's the clutch basket is right over the oil sight glass. The round'ish area below where the speedo cable goes in. On the Harley's it's that big bump on the opposite side as the LS650's clutch.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by dasch on 01/27/12 at 03:38:20

wow, I never opened a Harley, strange how they engineered that part.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by Oldfeller on 01/27/12 at 18:25:48

MM, if it is the primary drive chain or nut that is gone -- do I get to count me yet another tick mark fer hurleys killed by the infamous Grandmaw sickle?

We know I had wounded the chain on that last trip to the point you ran out of adjustment and your primary gear nut had come loose on top of that
(discovered later on) ....

::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

;) advice remains the same, yer hurley has received the 5 point palm technique blow of delayed death, so for heaven's sake sell it quick before it finishes dying on you !!!

A hurley that runs is worth 2-3 times what the bike that killed it is worth, so cash in while you can !!!

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by MMRanch on 01/28/12 at 12:01:52

Oh-Yea OldFeller

You killed my Harley last summer and didn't even know it at the time !!!! :-[

Come to find out ,,,,

The starter turns the clutch on the motor side, clutch spinns the primary chain , primary spins the motor-drive-sprocket which is conected to the crankshaft by way of 6 splines. :-?

WELL .... >:(

The splines are all-but " non-exesistant" at the moment.

best I can figure .... last summer when the drive sprocket came loose it wabbled "ALL THE WAY HOME" . When I checked into it at the time I put lock-tite on the threads and torked it up so it couldn't get loose again. ;)

Now the crank spinns inside the sprocket its sposed to spin. that the bad news .... :-X

The hope is :
When Harley cut the splines in the first place they cut deeper that they had too ...
I'm cutting and fitting (JBWeld) 6 little pieces of metal (.080" thick x .210" wide) into those left-over slots after cutting the slots a little deeper.

And then SELLING THE DARN THING

If I ever have to look at the inside of a Harley piece of crap again it will be way to soon !!!!!!!!!! >:(

Maby the harley dealer will have something I'll want to trade for ... I kinda hate to "STICK" anybody else with it. :-/

Now OldFeller ....... "Doin't brag to much you know Harleys are an "EASY KILL"" . ;D

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by dasch on 01/29/12 at 01:29:09

man that's bad news. JbWelding new splines might work. But prepare yourself for rage of the new owner.
Can you get a cheap burned harley engine somewhere and swap the crankshaft?

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by T Mack 1 - FSO on 01/29/12 at 17:57:14

What type Harley is it?

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by MMRanch on 01/29/12 at 19:39:44

TMack

2004 1200 sportster

I'm having second thoughts ,,,,, mabby build some weld up on the old shaft .....

Just mad and confused at the moment. I've never known of "THE SPLINES WEAR OUT !!!!! "

what a stupid set up in the first place. My first harley (notice no more capital on harley) , at the moment I doin't have any respect for them.
:(

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by WD on 01/30/12 at 03:52:59

Harley Davidson (1905-1948 RIP) was a good machine. Your late model Honda-Yamaha- Kawasaki- Chinese sourced parts mutt bikes made since the AMF era... not so much.

Had a 93 Wide Glide that ate 4 engines and 6 transmissions, in 6 months.

Sounds like your crank was improperly heat treated. The only safe fix is a new crankshaft. The pulley splines should have failed before the shaft splines.

I've had a LOT of HDs over the years. Kick only OHV generator case big twins are decent, 1948 and older flatheads are good. 1970 and newer big twins are a waste of money. Sportsters should have been killed off at the end of the Ironhead era.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by MMRanch on 01/30/12 at 18:37:39

Well I cranked the Harley up today.

I went ahead and built up the old splines with weld then cut them back down with a dremel tool and cut off blade (s) ... its fixed as good as it was to begin with .

But I'm still getting rid of it. Allready took my shield and floorboards off it , saddlebags too . I supect OldFeller is right on this one -- get rid of it befor something else brakes .

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/31/12 at 01:09:19

It should go to a home in another state. Not to a motorcycle gang member.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by Oldfeller on 01/31/12 at 06:43:20

Most hurleys are yuppie garage wall flowers anyway -- ridden several times a year for hurley processionals called "rides for this, or ride for that". A standard hurley ride won't stress that joint very much.

Your mistake was to take one up into the mountains on a real ride where it would get rolled on and off several thousand times a day, decelerating and accelerating constantly.

I understand what you did, you were searching for that elusive "better bike" something that I did twice. I finally realized that I already owned the better bike, and the rest are gone now (and not really missed all that much to tell the truth).

So you bought yourself "a better bike", we have all gone and done it and learned our lesson. It all is part of the Savage experience.

Be sure to state on whatever paperwork you do that the bike is being sold "AS IS" and with no transfer of warranty or performance expectations. Motor shaft is supposed to be harder than the pulley, majority of wear is supposed to take place inside the pulley, not on the shaft. Crank is defective to my way of thinking.

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by MMRanch on 01/31/12 at 23:25:47

O-no

I'm not sure ya'll understand ... I spent two day welding and cutting down then welding the low spots again till it fit the matting splines as good or better than the factory had it. I supect the weld metal is better metal that the factory stuff too , Mig weld gas wire (.035").

To take the "drive sprocket" off the clutch sprocket has to come of at the same time (primary chain doin't bend sideways). I tested the metal its made out of with a file while it was out. It ain't case hardened either !!!! :-?

Just SORRY stuff !!!

How Harley ever got such a following is beyond me ??? :-/

I'm thinking of trading it in on a XL650 Honda. They have real rolling bearning for the cam to spin in ! :)

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by dasch on 02/01/12 at 08:52:47

Wow! That's a fine art work you did!! Kudos!

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by liltimmy on 02/01/12 at 09:16:34

My wife bought my thumper for me for fathers day a few years back. She would never have disappointed me with a Harley. ;D

Title: Re: Harley question
Post by MMRanch on 02/01/12 at 20:29:41

Liltimmy good for you wife ! Do you think she might give my wife a few pointers in the art of gift giving ? ;D

I tried on of the Honda XL650 on for size today ... could barely touch the ground and it the seat postion is alfull ,

I might just have to become a One Bike Person.

I probley should say "Thanks" to everbody who help me get over the "Harley Blues" !!!! Just another one of Lifes little lessons.