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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> Inflation and what to do about it /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1326872139 Message started by Oldfeller on 01/17/12 at 23:35:39 |
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Title: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/17/12 at 23:35:39 This is a warning call to action for those who have been fence sitting on getting out of banked paper dollars and getting into metal or real estate or something "real" with at least some of your money. The American dollar has been the international monetary standard for over 50 years. Arab countries used to would not sell oil unless you paid them in dollars, Swiss franks or a darn few select other very good currencies. America and France and others have lost their AAA currency rating recently because they have been printing more money than their economies can justify. We all know the Euro is in turmoil as well. The Arabs are now trying to create a new international oil currency that is backed by oil and they want you to buy their oil using it. America's dollar and everyone else's currency will suddenly get realistically re-ranked very quickly if a new worldwide standard currency exists and is enforced by somebody who can enforce it. If any other currency becomes the international monetary standard, prices in America could double-triple overnight for oil and other imports (and everything else like food that depends on oil or imports to grow/make). Can you say "hyper-inflation" such as hit Argentina and England and Greece and France and ..... The value of your banked money will partially evaporate as it sits there and there is nothing you can do about it if you do not act VERY SOON to buy something real before your dollars devalue even more. Now, discuss it some and see where you sit compared to the rest of everybody else. Do not talk blame or politics or the thread will likely get cut/deleted. Remember, this is and has been and is continuing to happen and no politician of any stripe has the guts to stop it ---- but instead what are YOU going to do to protect yourself and your family over the next few years? Eggs hit $2.00 a dozen last week at the grocery store. Hamburger is $4.59 a pound |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by LANCER on 01/18/12 at 03:49:59 Another consideration is if possible get out of debt so your devalued dollars will hopefully at least cover the cost of basic necessities. My goal in this area is to build a "paid for" self-sufficient structure in a rural area where food can be grown, so when the economic quake hits there is a better chance of making it through the harder times...at least as long as possible. The writing is on the wall. The world is in deep kimchi; massive debt; and the only way out is to "ADJUST" the worlds monetary system. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/18/12 at 05:39:04 Finally, I no longer feel all alone. Food & water or fema camp Protecting food & water is essential Gold & silver jewellery can be hacked up buying old coins, not collector coins, just what was in circulation prior to them taking the silver out. If it takes $2.30 to buy a dime at the coin shop, ( & it did not long ago) that should be enough to tell anyone our currency is no longer worth much., It takes 23 times the money to buy what I could buy with a dime in 1964. In 71, when they went to the sandwich coins, I was working in a store. I had the chance to hold onto all kinds of those silver coins, but,, didnt. I tried, but was always too broke to keep them out of circulation. Anyway, you dont need a lot of $$$ to get started. But gettin started is a good idea. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Serowbot on 01/18/12 at 09:25:15 I'm already invested in real estate,... the value is down about 50%... Value of cash is down about the same too... Gold and silver are now over-priced.. think about why this is true -- and it will get much much worse shortly Market investments are worse than Vegas... Uhhh?.... :-?... |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Oldfeller on 01/18/12 at 12:06:47 Serowbot, we are talking about a further additional drastic degradation to what the last not-quite-full-depression did to us. This time will not be a rash of sharply falling prices for existing held assets (this is an adjustment, with the currency maintaining its value) like it was last time, it will be a hyperinflation that is based on a strongly diluted US currency. It might get as bad as a currency revaluation. IF the American dollar is not the world default currency standard, and the oil producing folks insist on getting paid in something else to buy oil, then we will have to trade diluted dollars for whatever that "oil currency" is called. Or we don't buy oil .... or fertilizer .... or plastics ..... Right now they estimate the US dollar is 25-30% diluted in currency trading right now and there are many countries with strong currencies don't want any more dollars at any currently offered price. Sorry, no sale. Keep your bonds, thank you very much. The Russians are chuckling at us right now, they have their oil and natural gas fields at full production and are a large net exporter of oil/gas energy. They like the oil/gas based currency idea just fine. We however, are in a no-win position as the Federal Reserve is still running the printing presses full speed ahead to pay for the interest our HUGE HUGE debt. The only country who can get away with shite like that at all is the one who owns the default global currency -- and they can't get away with it for very long. Such a situation tends to come to an abrupt end. Nobody wants to buy our US bonds any more. Not China, not anybody. China is starting to get rid of the US dollars that they are holding .... Danger --- danger is present that could lead to a devaluation. It has in other countries who printed far less "base-less" paper than we have. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by SurfJunkie on 01/18/12 at 13:20:34 I have the solution !!!! We will just go to war again.Its good business. Production for all things will spike sharply, and we will just simply take that countries Oil production once we destabilize their government and society. Its really the only logical solution assuming no one wants to buy US bonds or anything relating to our currency or market. Im sure the entire planet must realize by now that we are all tied together in a global market. Whatever damage they inflict upon the US by not purchasing will only hurt them and all other participating countries as a whole. We contribute far to much from a consumer perspective for ANY money hungry country to turn a blind eye. What we are really witness to is the shrinking of the "great divergence" between western civilizations and asian civilizations. Property laws, currency, technology etc. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by LostArtist on 01/18/12 at 15:33:05 yes, yes, live in fear. . . there ain't anything I can do to help this at all, I don't have the money to go out and buy gold and silver or land, so thanks for the panic attack JACK |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Oldfeller on 01/18/12 at 16:48:34 Old people like us old codgers have money tied up in 401K plans that by and large are pre-tax plans (we can't take the money out of them until we retire unless we want to give Uncle Sam 25% as an early withdrawal penalty). We have something, but are locked in by and large. What liquid savings we have needs to go into something "real" ASAP before any bottoms fall out of anything. This is all we can do right now. Is this scary to you young people? It should be -- we were young too last time we did this in what, 1972-78? Tricky Dicky, Jimmy Carter and the gas shortages? Difference is that we had a net national debt measured in tens of billions, not tens of trillions. I got out of school and couldn't get a job in my field for like the first 5-6 years after I got out of college. We exited the silver standard completely during that period and the gov collected all the silver certificates out of circulation as the silver was worth 10-20 times what the paper certificates had printed on them. Mild, compared to what may be headed our way this time. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/18/12 at 21:47:04 If you really believe the $$$ & economy & society in general is about to hit th skids, the 401 K is not gonna be worth hoot after all that. A 25% hickey for early withdrawal leaves 75% to use now, as opposed to not squat later. Thats the way I see it, YMMV,, Im glad Im not the one who has to make the call & live with the consequences. First you pay the income tax automatically withheld on the withdrawal amount (plus your current earnings for that year of course) which puts you up in the 30% level tax brackets. Then you pay your 25% penalty. Ouch .... |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by MMRanch on 01/18/12 at 22:02:31 Wow What this country needs (and will have) is a good "FALL-GUY". Property taxes will go up to the point no one will want anymore than nessary. All those countrys where the family vechile is a 125 cc motorcycle with Dad, Mom, and three kid piled on it while pulling a trailer could happen here. ( I'll be the one on the "GAS-HOG" Savage). Funny to think about but could happen. I'd like to see us driving Bio-Desiel Bikes and fueling them soybean oil. The oil producing countrys could try cooking with petro till they paid the price we want ! Things would turn-around perty quick ! ;) |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Bubba on 01/19/12 at 07:55:30 doom and gloom...not gonna happen. America is plenty strong. Worse case is, global economic collapse. Our country will still come out on top just because we have the best people. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Oldfeller on 01/19/12 at 10:23:33 Bubba, ask you wife about the price of eggs, hamburger, etc. Them printing presses keep running, these prices will continue to rise along with everything else. Bought a tire lately? Standard inflation is like putting a frog in a pan of cold water, then slowly turning the heat up. The frog likes it at first, warm = good. He just complains about it a bit later on when he starts to sweat good. By the time the heat gets turned on full and the water gets ready to boil, the frog really can't do anything about it because his legs are jelly. We are at the sweating stage now .... we can still jump out of the pan with some of what we have. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Savage_Rob on 01/19/12 at 11:39:38 I just can't help but think of the old adage about jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire. Let me preface the following by saying that I am no investment or tax professional and this is just my understanding as an interested lay person. I'm certainly an amateur on investing (though I'm not sure many of the "professional fund managers" are any better) but I think gold and precious metals are in a bubble right now. While it may be possible to capitalize on it before it bursts, you could wind up heavily underwater if you don't time it right and I just don't have faith in it personally. I fear bonds and other cash equivalents are in for a long slog before they'll be generally good investments. I'll turn 50 this year so I still have a while before I can retire and it often seems that it's getting further away all the time. I sometimes think that land might be the best investment as it seems to be the only thing they aren't making more of but the real estate world is still too unstable for my comfort and I haven't done enough research to invest anything if I came up with a surplus to invest. For the time being, I'll stick with diversified stocks and a few mutual funds and hope for the best in the longer term. This is primarily because a 401(k) or IRA has probable tax benefits that I don't otherwise get. Also, I think that after age 59 1/2, there is no penalty for withdrawal from the 401(k) or IRA other than paying normal taxes on the income. And if it was a Roth IRA, you've already paid the taxes. I'm pretty sure you can withdraw principal funds from a Roth IRA before age 59 1/2 with no penalty - just not the earnings. In short, my advice to anyone would be not to give up on the system as it is but don't give up your weapons and ammo either. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Oldfeller on 01/19/12 at 12:46:03 Frying pan and the fire --- and the bubble effect. Gold is strongly "in the bubble" right now -- silver has dropped way down from the bubble peak and has a more realistic value right not (still inflated some and will likely go back up again, but silver is more realistic right now). Land is cheap, houses are cheap. Interest is cheap. Key thing is to buy something with your dollars before they decline in value yet more. Letting it sit in the bank at 1-2% interest while it looses 10% of its purchasing value in a year is stupid. I remember the days of 10% percent inflation. After 4-5 years of it, your savings were worth 1/2 of where they started out at. Nobody saved very much money back then, either -- it took just about every penny you had just to live. Will we go back there again? I dunno -- begins to smell like it to me. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Savage_Rob on 01/19/12 at 13:03:18 183B3331323B3B3225570 wrote:
I remember that in the 70's - actually I think it got to something like 13% inflation, though unemployment was closer to 6% or 7%. It's entirely possible, especially since there are some brainiacs out there claiming higher inflation may just be the answer. I think the idea is that "things" become worth more while the value of the currency becomes less. The "classroom bubble" theory says that this decreases your debt because the value of the dollars you owe is less. My problem is that unless people have jobs and their paychecks keep pace with inflation, it's all hogwash. The bigger problem is that a lot of the policy wonks might buy into it. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by mick on 01/19/12 at 21:26:25 I live with my sister and brother in law on a 50 acre farm,we can grow enough to eat,+ chickens for meat and eggs,cow's for milk and meat. You guys get hungry go eat your silver and gold coins,or come and see us I'm sure we can spare a little food ,maybe a whole chicken for a half pound of gold. |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Wake51 on 01/20/12 at 01:39:10 Post-American World This term refers to the rest of the world catching up, not that America is slumping below, though the recent economic down turn would give that intuition. What I mean is that some currency would have to eclipse the dollar in longevity and reliability to overtake it. Bare in mind one of the common arguments is the growing Chinese economy. Ohh, very scary, it is indeed growing fast, at a faster clip than our own economy! But you must consider size, it is easier to grow 20% of something that is worth 100 dollars is easier than growing something than it is to grow something that is 2.1% of 1,000 dollars. AKA, sure the Chinese economy is growing at a faster clip, comparatively to ITSELF. We grow at a slower pace because we are comparing it to a much larger economy. Food for thought. Especially when the Chinese are inflating their currency to a dangerous degree to makes their exports so competitive. I'm not saying there is nothing to be feared, but be sure you read into the statistics and meanings behind things. Media inflates statistics and doesn't explain the meaning behind happenings to scare the audience and draw viewers. Nobody watches the 'this isn't good.. but not so bad" story compared to the 'you're about to lose all of your wealth' story. That's NOT to say many Americans have worked VERY hard for the value they currently hold, and that is degrading by some percentage points. That is very frustrating, and I'm not about to say you should accept it because the rest of the world is catching up and many are trying to live the American way of life. It's a frustrating situation, I study Political Science currently in college, and even most scholars are tossed between taking the opinion that their loyal countrymen are losing value or taking the side of the growing international world. As for the American debt, don't renew the High End Bush tax cuts, bring military contracting under control, and enact level headed paycheck taxes for Social Security and Medicaid and the debt will be back in control while being paid off in roughly 2 decades. Problem there is politicians. And problem with politicians is the system that elects them. Sorry... but if your a D or R our election system creates deadlock, and all congressmen have to vote for what favors the party, not reach agreements for what is better in the long run. None the less in the end, may we find a viable solution. I have little hope in politics with the current system, but my hopes for the current situation and certainty we will still only have 1st world problems remains confident. 8-) |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by arteacher on 01/20/12 at 07:26:20 Capitalism is stumbling and it might fall down. :-? |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by Savage_Rob on 01/20/12 at 08:08:22 This belief that the Chinese have some sort of economic juggernaut going is a myth. Of course, slave labor in prisons is quite helpful as is manually pegging your currency and stealing research instead of spending resources on your own. Also, it's been recently discovered that they have massive internal debt as well. Many of the infrastructure expansions (highways, bridges, etc.) begun in the past couple of decades are now lying incomplete and abandoned with contractors unpaid by the government for services already rendered, much less any required to complete these jobs. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/20/12 at 10:34:03 Please remember the warning about politics given up at the start of this thread. If this thread turns into a "Tall Table" it will likely go away. Capitalism still works fine, we are just suffering from a lack of jobs because we all want too many dollars per hour to work at a job. If we "went down" to the going international labor rate, we would get the jobs back, but nobody in his right mind wants to work for $4-5 an hour, right? not yet, anyway ===================== I still haven't heard any new viable options on what to do to protect your families during the "whatever the heck it is" that is eating the value of the dollar. What can you do to keep the purchasing value that currently exists in your bank account, understanding that doing nothing will net you another 25% loss in value within another couple of years? Might I suggest that you spend the money on something you need long term, like a better car, if you happen to need one? The car will be around in 10 years, which is about the time it takes to go through a full controlled inflationary cycle (assuming that is what we have going on ). The car will depreciate to nothing in 10 years, yes, so how about some land? It won't depreciate near as bad as a car will. Gold is way over valued, silver has come down from it its bubble peak, but is over valued as well. The problem with intentionally inflating the international monetary standard is it takes everybody else's currency with it. When the main players (China and the USA) do tit for tat on printing more money as they race each other to be the first one at the bottom of the cliff, then you got a world wide inflation that is bound to happen that no other single nation can do very much about. Me, I understand hamburger, eggs and tires. Within 2-3 years I won't earn enough to be able to buy them and my money in the bank won't be able to bridge my gap very well as it hasn't nearly kept up with the price rise in basic food and toilet paper. Any ideas out there? |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Serowbot on 01/20/12 at 10:53:31 Additionally, I think the current value of precious metals is being driven by paranoid investment, and not inherent value... I did invest some,.. 10 years ago, but have cashed out now... Currently a much more risky investment... Buy low, sell high... and we're on a high... :-?... If I had anything to invest right now,.. I'd invest in railroads... They are future of the shipping industry... |
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Title: Re: Buying metal with paper Post by bill67 on 01/20/12 at 10:56:58 282C262E312D20292C28203C450 wrote:
Mick do you have any of the chickens that lay the golden eggs. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/20/12 at 11:02:50 Have you considered investing in food and food production? Have you considered investing in developing economies in Latin America and the Far East? All investments are risky right now -- especially in a time of global economic upheaval and war. Foreigners are investing in the USA, thinking maybe some of their money will come back to them in the end. China is buying gold by the pallet load with their US dollars, thinking it will retain some of its purchase price, mebbe 3/4 of it long term. Silver may retain half, so it isn't as good a deal as gold, perhaps, who knows? Everybody has the same issue to deal with -- evaporation. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Boofer on 01/20/12 at 11:17:00 Oldfeller, I've been dreading this for about two years. The problem is, I got my information from Glenn Beck, so I couldn't tell anybody. What he said over and over is coming true. Since I handle all the money in my family and do most of the shopping for groceries and gas, I can say it has risen about 25% here in Ms. Milk went from $2.39 to $4.39, honey, which is my luxury item now, went from $3.50 lb to over $6.00. Cereal around $1.75/ box. Remember when it was cheap to make stew and eat on it a few days? Stew meat is $5/lb. If you're on disability and WalMart is cutting hours on your wife, and you're paying attention, it becomes evident fairly quickly that something is going on. Last year the gov't said I needed help with my medicare and prescription bills. I said I didn't, but kept getting mail saying to fill this out and that. If you don't fill their crap out, you could lose disability. Got help for a year which put us earning more, so this year their taking away about $1200. Guess what...I'll be poor enough to get it next year. Yes, we are in deep trouble in this country and YES we will survive, but you kids who were given trophies for showing up and only learned that others are responsible for you are not gonna' like it. ;D |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/20/12 at 12:42:22 Yep, we old suckers have lived through it before and remember well how badly it sucks. Beck was right, unfortunately. Have you been stock-piling dry goods, canned stuff and other long lasting food like he recommended? Pinto beans that were 89 cents, are now approaching $1.80 a 16oz bag. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/20/12 at 14:23:16 Libya, Iraq, Iran, none use the IMF, Own their own central bank, not associated with the globalists. Completely sovereign, & the Economic Hitman couldnt work his way in. Look that up, Understand.. they either sell you on debt to them or kill you,. You cant pull economics away from politics, Now, the Big Question is, how best to prepare for hard times, should you believe, as I believe, that we will see some very hard times in the near future. Now, you may ask, WHY do you believe that? Well,, Ive watched a downward spiral of the economy & the living standard of Americans. Ive seen nothing to indicate there is a reversal of direction in the near term. Given that there is a documentable decrease in the disposable income of Americans & an increase in national debt & continuing wars that expend lives & treasure & send us home sick & wounded people, I dont see anything that would indicate to me there is any reason to believe the trend is about to change. So? Whats next? More of the same, only worse. The notion that "We live in America, Land of the Free, Home of the Brave, & we dont go hungry here " isnt based in a logical, rational assessment of the situation. That is an offshoot of the "Normalcy Factor" clouding the ability to judge events. Unless & until there is a REAL change in direction, not just tweaking the edges, we are headed for calamity. The Fed is at the heart of it. Foreign policy is a huge part. Our decision makers are making decisions that negatively impact all of us & have been doing sop for decades. WHY is a political & economically answered question that is impossible to answer fully regardless, & impractical to attempt to even pull the covers part way back here, Okay, Now,m IF youre on board with thew idea that each household must prepare for hard times, then heres where I am. YOu need food & water for at least 3 months. After 3 months, competition for resources will be minimized. YOu need lead & brass & delivery systems to protect the food & water. It would be super to have something other than paper money to use for trade during any upheaval,. &, after the shakeup, if a family had some gold &/Or silver to use to trade in for the new currency, they would be immediately in the "more well off than the poor folk" group. HIt a pawn shop, buy gold jewelry that has linked chains, the links will work, as long as you can show the carat,, IOW, save the latch to the end. silver dimes & quarters , only a very few years were nickels made of anything worth having, so dodge nickels. 1982 & earlier pennies,, A quality scale mite be a good idea. Firestarting stuff, water filters, &, Flame ON! A gas mask mite not be a bad idea, either. The laws we have recently seen passed do not comfort me that my government loves me, |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/20/12 at 14:51:52 You mentioned the Arab central banking consortium -- what is the name of that currency they are pushing as the new international standard currency? Water is a toughie -- bottled water by the pallet? Or have a purification system good enough to use the drain water from the roof? I don't think it will get that bad, but some water purification tablets are cheap enough to put "into a contingency chest". |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/20/12 at 16:27:06 You mentioned the Arab central banking consortium -- what is the name of that currency they are pushing as the new international standard currency? I was pointing out thsat each country that has "needed a good invasion" has been autonomous & not on the leash of the global elite bankers. IDK anything about a proposed othoer currency, but each of the recently invaded & Iran have said they no longer want Dollars for their oil |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by ham45 on 01/21/12 at 05:27:52 This is an interesting topic, If you would like to read more about it; Mark Steyn has written a really good book about this very topic, "After America: get ready for Armageddon" and, Mark R Levin wrote one that's just as good; Ameritopia: the unmaking of America. Look them up on Amazon and read the reviews. The reviews are great entertainment in themselves, the conservatives love the books while the liberals hate them! |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Drifter on 01/21/12 at 06:11:13 Oldfeller, yea land is cheap, the taxes on that land is not cheap and the insurance is not either, ohio raised my farm tax 200% this year. I have had trouble with 3 different banks in the last 2 months, what little money i have is now burried in the back yard, no joke! I have no trust in any bank anymore!! Serowbot, yep my house is worth half, the dollar is worth half my investments are halved, Taxes on everything is up fuel and anything related to it is up......the 1% are fat and happy the middle class is getting flucked! Our countrys treasures have been pissed away on worthless wars and we are building for another one??? Fools we are!! I have a survival mentality now,we have stored food medicine ammo and other basic needs. Be prepared folks Remember those with guns will eat those without will not!! |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by lukeduck on 01/23/12 at 15:51:10 We just gotta have faith. Overheard a conversation while having coffee last week that things will all be OK as soon as the corps. get reined in and all the rich folk start paying "their fair share" of taxes. Guess the current admin. has to get another 4 years---hold it. Gotta run just heard Wal Mart is having a big sale on 357 ammo---later. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by John_D FSO on 01/24/12 at 06:45:10 726B757B7A6B7D751E0 wrote:
You're just stocking up now?! ;D With the rising prices of copper (brass) and lead over the years, I've been stocking up any time I come across a good sale. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by lukeduck on 01/24/12 at 09:33:45 Oh no, just gotta keep up, you know rotate stock. Gota good stock of 9mm, 357, 12 ga. 00 and slug, 30-06, and even a couple thousand each 22lr and mag. Really hope I'll never need any of the stuff, but got it if it's needed. Soon as the wife retires I'm hoping to get out of So Cal. Don't think this is the place to be if things fall apart. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by LostArtist on 01/24/12 at 11:04:46 should I start buying ammo even if I don't own a gun. . . or are cigarettes better for this new barter system . . . |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/24/12 at 11:56:27 Cigarettes get stale pretty quick, don't they? WWII surplus ammo still goes bang reliably, however the WW1 surplus stuff isn't so hot as they used mercury primers and they have a 20% failure rate now. The brass also has nasty green corrosion spots and has gotten more brittle accordingly -- avoid WW1 surplus and avoid corroded brass if buying bulk surplus ammo. Nobody knows how long modern primer compounds will last. A long long time supposedly. Large rifle primers, small pistol primers and some bulk surplus powder might be worth some dollars invested, after it calms down a bit the thrifty people that survive might support a local reloader barter type guy. Shame that our government doesn't want you to be having that sort of stuff around, isn' it? Now, has anybody got anything useful to say about hedging your banked money in some inflation resistant fashion? ----------- silly shite this is, we will all be dead en-mass before this sort of scenario will play out. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Bubba on 01/24/12 at 14:05:31 OF, all kidding aside. I have some but not all of my money in something called the Permanent Portfolio. Really saved my earnings when the bottom fell out of everything. It's a good long term fund. I also have some dough in IPI (potash company) not doing great right now and I lost a chunk of change cuz I bought too early after they went public but my feeling is...everyone's gotta eat and the land can only support so much before the fertilizer industry is called upon to squeeze every last bit of grain from our overutilized soil... just my 2 cents...no pun intended... :P |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Serowbot on 01/24/12 at 16:49:16 If you really believe we are going back to the middle ages,... buy salt... .. hundred weight otta' do... :-?... |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/24/12 at 19:27:10 I think we are gonna see some really nasty 10-15% level inflation, the dollar will survive but not necessarily as the international default currency like it is today. We may well see the $5-7 a gallon gas before the end of next year, mebbe, as that is the biggest currency shift point that is on the table now. When it is all over, we will be more in line with the world "nominal" wage levels and our manufacturing will begin to return to the USA, slowly. Our standard of living will be greatly reduced by that time. I don't think I will have to defend my measly stocks of pinto beans with hot lead -- but I may have to collapse in with other family members into one of the larger houses so we can afford gasoline and heating oil/gas when we are all on Uncle Sam's retirement "wages". I remember putting a wood stove into my first 2 houses -- really, it helped the monthly bills a lot it did. Wood stoves, etc may become part of our lives again. Who knows? |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Drifter on 01/25/12 at 06:34:36 Oldfeller, everything i bought and sold in the past to make good money, land houses, stocks, cds, selling motorcycles no longer works so i cant help you....or me! :( My grandma told me stories of the great depression, one day they had money in the bank the next day the doors were locked and the people and money were long gone. That could easily happen again today. Yes we have insurance on the money but if several banks do this how long will it take to get it and what happens if the fund runs dry??? You will be just like my dear old granny, really!!!!! pissed and broke! |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/25/12 at 07:26:19 Back when the Savings & Loan stuff went down, people went to jail. Maybe not the ones at the very top, but certainly some very deserving people went to jail. This time,,?? No,, I believe that the majority are allowing the "Normalcy Factor" to lull them onto simply believing things will work out. We've all seen dips & recoveries, dips & recoveries,, tho, no recovery in the last 40 years has lifted us back to the place we fell from. This time, if there IS a recovery at all, it will fail to restore us to where we were pre 2008 & if you recall, pre 2008 wasnt exactly the "easy to find a good paying job & live & have disposable income & save $$$" times of the 1960's. Again, my G/pa had a 13 stool burger joint/snack bar in a grocery store in Houston. He ran it alone & closed only on Sunday. BUt, he paid the store a bit for being there, had a 2 B/R house which he added a B/R to, had a 2 car garage built, owned horses & leased the 40 acres adjoining so he could ride & he saved enough $$ to trade up in cars & buy himslef a little country store in Humble Texas. So,, look at what a man with a good work ethic can accomplish today in comparison. The point is, look at the DIRection we are headed in economically. Take Note of it. Prepare accordingly. Now, WHY this is happening is a TT discussion, but that it IS happening is a purely economic point. Also, remember that there has yet to be a fiat currency that Did Not Fail. Consider that since 1913, when the Fed came into being, the purchasing power of the dollar has been eaten UP, but I can still but gasoline for less than 20 cents, as long as I use 2 old dimes. I can buy a fine 3 piece suit for 60 dollars, as long as I use the very same currency we had in 1920,$20 gold coins, people Carried Gold Coins in their pockets,,think about how things have changed, & not for the better. & change continues, & no one is changing the policies that are causing the changes, so, the direction WILL continue. Only One Man who is in a position to influence policy BACK toward the way things were Will do it & thats Ron Paul. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Drifter on 01/25/12 at 10:09:46 Justin, +1 I will add to that the endless money and blood we have wasted on unnecessary wars! Whats in the best interest of America should come before some little sand dune of a country in the mideast! |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Gyrobob on 01/25/12 at 10:53:59 Since no one has a crystal clear crystal ball, the most conservative thing to do investment-wise, is to put your money in a diversified mix of investments. For example, mine is 15% stock-based mut funds, 20% commodity funds, 20% muni bond funds, 20% TIPs based funds, 20% in TIPS, and the rest cash. Those percentages are approximate and are about to be rebalanced next month. This mix won't make a lot annually, but it won't lose much either if things go south. At my age, I'm much more concerned about losing what I have, than building on it. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Gyrobob on 01/25/12 at 10:57:25 093F242B39283F4D0 wrote:
We would waste a whole lot less on unnecessary wars if the lamo liberals would get out of the way of using our own energy resources. If we had access to ALL our oil in our own dirt, and offshore, we could be energy independent in 10 years, bring 90% of the troops home, and we could let the middle-easterners just nuke themselves to cinders and glass. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by ALfromN.H. on 01/25/12 at 11:16:40 If things are gonna get as bad as you guys are predicting, then I'm not sure I want to be around for all that. I'm not really ambitious enough to plan for and worry about it that much. As far as ammo goes, I think one bullet will be enough. Then they can all fight over whatever I leave behind. AL |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by LostArtist on 01/25/12 at 12:25:18 6D606E6E3A0C0 wrote:
+1 |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by bill67 on 01/25/12 at 15:27:04 0B353E232E232E4C0 wrote:
We would waste a whole lot less on unnecessary wars if the lamo liberals would get out of the way of using our own energy resources. If we had access to ALL our oil in our own dirt, and offshore, we could be energy independent in 10 years, bring 90% of the troops home, and we could let the middle-easterners just nuke themselves to cinders and glass.[/quote] What unnecessary war did Obama start. see Bill see Bill pull out the pin see Bill toss smoking grenade in a nice gentile lob motion see Bill grin while waiting for explosion & smoke .... |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by LANCER on 01/25/12 at 21:36:05 23282D2D7776410 wrote:
We would waste a whole lot less on unnecessary wars if the lamo liberals would get out of the way of using our own energy resources. If we had access to ALL our oil in our own dirt, and offshore, we could be energy independent in 10 years, bring 90% of the troops home, and we could let the middle-easterners just nuke themselves to cinders and glass.[/quote] What unnecessary war did Obama start. see Bill see Bill pull out the pin see Bill toss smoking grenade in a nice gentile lob motion see Bill grin while waiting for explosion & smoke ....[/quote] He started the CLASS WAR(FARE) Cranked it up when he started running for office last time. YEP |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by JohnBoy on 01/27/12 at 12:42:44 7E5D5557545D5D5443310 wrote:
Buy Guns and Booze...You can't go wrong and the value never drops |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Savage_Rob on 01/27/12 at 12:51:20 Hide the rum! - Captain Jack Sparrow |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by photojoe on 01/28/12 at 11:03:11 Notice how hot survival food is now? More companies are forming that sell survival gear as well. Should tell us something. I got my hours cut from full to part time from March to July 2011 when I went back to full time. Just got cut back to part time a couple of weeks ago. 25 hours as opposed to 40. I was taking home more money (even with the 40 hours) back in 1980. I only buy what's on sale in the Supermarket. I won't pay $5 for a box of cereal, $4 for a dozen eggs or $4 for a pound of apples. Standing on line in the Foodtown on Thursday with a senior ahead of me. When the cashier rang her up the old lady said "$60 for just this?" I felt for her. We have plenty of guns and ammo. In my income bracket firearms are not only affordable, but a sound investment. Not going to make money but if you buy right, they will hold their value. Per the request of the OP, I'll avoid talking politics for this topic. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/29/12 at 01:09:57 Talking politics just clouds the real top priority topic all up, as no matter who holds the White House and Congress next time the pinch is still gonna come (it is unavoidable now). The topic we have to deal with now is "given the upcoming slab of road kill we have coming on our plates, what can we do to protect our families the best we can?" So far, we have come up with getting your money out of dollars and into something real and get some durable food goods into your pantry and get yourself enough lead slinging gear to try to keep your neighbors from taking it away from you. This sounds awful bleak, I know. Denial is tempting, and it will be followed by lots of folks out there. Me, I am considering spending some "excess" banked US dollars on a newer, very high gas mileage car. I just wish the choices were better right now as CAFE standards have blocked all the European 60 mpg diesels from coming into the USA. 40 mpg is the best you can buy right now apart from the expensive fancy battery hybrids which don't make it up to 50 mpg real world. ============ 60 mpg cars are real, BTW -- being sold by the skidillions in Europe where diesel fuel is used now more that gasoline is used. Our regulatory agencies need to pull their thumbs out of their butts and allow these diesel cars into the USA so we can afford to run a car in a few years from now. http://www.hybridcars.com/environment/lusting-europe-illegal-high-mpg-cars-25323.html |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by ham45 on 01/29/12 at 04:41:36 While I was a contractor in Iraq some of the vehicles we used to drive were small compact Ford crew cab four cylinder diesel 4x4 pickups. A couple of the guys expressed their desire to own one of them in the states seeing how they were virtually indestructible and got phenomenal fuel mileage. But not to be, the trucks were not allowed into the states. They were very nice little trucks, don't recall where they were made, but it wasn't in the US I'm sure. As a matter of fact very little of the parts or material we or any of the other trades worked with was made in the US. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by WebsterMark on 01/29/12 at 06:43:02 Our national economic problems have become so large that solutions require unimaginable changes. I posted this on the TT but set aside the partisan politics for a moment with regards to how we got into position we are in and consider the consequences of this current day fact. In his State of the Union, Obama proposed a 5 year program with a $10 billion dollar savings benefit. On the surface, sounds like a great deal. Cut $10 billion dollars in spending over 5 years by phasing out certain regulations. However, the US Government borrows the equivalent of $10 billion dollars for other programs and to service the debt every 53 HOURS. By Thursday day evening a couple days after his speech on Tuesday, we had already borrowed an amount equal to what we are now slapping ourselves on the back for taking 5 years to cut! Do you really think any elected officials are going to take the steps needed to turn this ship around? We are like the cruise ship heading towards the rocks and the Captain is screwing around in his cabin. We borrow about $2 million dollars every minute. Vast numbers of our population pay no taxes. Government employment has actually increased during this recession. How can we stop the system we are in today where millions of citizen existences depend upon the handouts of Uncle Sam??? We can talk about buying guns, ammo and stocking up on food and water, but a widespread collapse of the US government and financial systems will snare us all. Someone a few pages back mentioned the speed at which the Great Depression hit and I think that’s worth remembering how quickly things can change. Here’s some questions: Are the majority of Americans in denial? Are we a tick of the clock away from widespread collapse? What really happens when the US dollar is no longer the global currency? What really happens when the US is no longer the shining city on a hill and the rest of the world turns to China for protection? If Iran shuts down the Straights, do we have the WILL to keep it open? What happens with 2 out of 5 members of the UN Security Council with veto power have a large Muslim population and the other 2 are Russia and China? You don’t think that matters? |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by LANCER on 01/29/12 at 06:43:29 Gold For Oil 28-01-2012 While no one was looking, India decided to ignore the embargo on Iran’s oil sales by buying directly with gold payments. Oil markets are stunned! This has the potential for totally collapsing the US economy and probably the entire western world economic system. Here is a DEBKAfile Exclusive Report: India is the first buyer of Iranian oil to agree to pay for its purchases in gold instead of the US dollar, debkafile’s intelligence and Iranian sources report exclusively. Those sources expect China to follow suit. India and China take about one million barrels per day, or 40 percent of Iran’s total exports of 2.5 million bpd. Both are superpowers in terms of gold assets. By trading in gold, New Delhi and Beijing enable Tehran to bypass the upcoming freeze on its central bank’s assets and the oil embargo which the European Union’s foreign ministers agreed to impose Monday, Jan. 23. The EU currently buys around 20 percent of Iran’s oil exports. The vast sums involved in these transactions are expected, furthermore, to boost the price of gold and depress the value of the dollar on world markets. (Read full article here) The last phrase is the point. If oil goes off the dollar standard, the US loses one of its most important international positions. It is another result of the failure of the US Administration to project strength. Weakness instead, has produced this crises and put us on the brink of economic chaos. http://elishavision.wordpress.com/2012/01/28/gold-for-oil/ |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/29/12 at 07:39:47 The last phrase is the point. If oil goes off the dollar standard, the US loses one of its most important international positions. It is another result of the failure of the US Administration to project strength. Weakness instead, has produced this crises and put us on the brink of economic chaos. & we invaded Iraq after they said they wanted to stop taking dollars for oil. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by mpescatori on 01/30/12 at 09:19:50 657A7C7B6661506050687A763D0F0 wrote:
So true. Iraq (Saddam Hussein) was selling oil for Euros, and others (Emirates) were getting ready to follow suit. THAT is the reason the US invaded Iraq. I Iraq and the Emirates had got the process rolling, soon Azerbaidjan and Kazakhstan would have sold their Caspian oil for Euro. Don't forget Kazakhstan and Azerbaidjan sell through Turkish pipelines, and what does Turkey want the most and hardest of all? Join the European Union. It all makes sense: - Turkey in the EU means more and more Caspian oil goes through Turkey, - all that oil is sold in Euros, - more and more Arab states sell theior oil in Euros, ... - the US Dollar plummets into oblivion. Forget 9/11, GWB invaded Iraq for the reasons posted above. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Serowbot on 01/30/12 at 09:38:40 The Euro is in just as precarious a state as the US dollar,.. maybe more... I don't see that replacing the dollar for oil trade... Both the US and European economies are sorta' in the "To big to fail" category as currencies... If either goes... the whole world will get a shake-up and have to adjust... But,... getting into tangible assets won't help, if there's no one to buy them... Unless you are willing to give an ounce of gold for a loaf of bread, or accept a couple ounces for your house... I just gotta' figure that if the sh*t really hits the fan, Europe and US will come out okay, because they still are the driving forces of the worlds economy... "Sh*t rolls downhill"... it'll be the 3rd world economies that suffer... yes, and it will be chaotic for a while here in the USA until a new currency (or more likely a re-valued existing US dollar) is established, based on gold or some very stable currency like the Swiss Kroner. During the chaos period, a "real asset" will carry value over much better than US dollars in the bank will be able to do, since dollars in the bank is what will be re-valued. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 01/30/12 at 10:57:14 Serowbot, the scary thing is that the Arabs are cutting completely to the chase now -- GOLD is what they are asking for now. This is 3-4 times worse than what I started the thread over a few weeks ago, that was fueled by the Arab's "oil based currency" idea. We have some oil, so we have some of that currency. We have some silver, too. We don't hold a lot of gold reserves and we don't mine any gold in this country to speak of. You will see gold spike to over $2,000 an ounce immediately. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by LANCER on 01/30/12 at 16:40:08 When people loose confidence in the VALUE of paper currency, whether dollars or euro's or any other, the only things of value are those that have intrinsic value, like gold, silver, precious stones...rare minerals of the earth. A few other things will have value as well, like salt or water or storable food; things that can keep you alive. These are things you can trade or barter with. That's why it takes more of any paper currency to buy them now as compared to years past. Have you wondered why 2 or 3 bags of food from the grocery store now costs about $100 now ? ? Not very long ago it was just $40. Mmmmm. Yet the Fed. gov't said there was zero inflation for 3 consecutive years. Yeah right.............. Discern the signs of the times and prepare yourself. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Savage_Rob on 01/30/12 at 19:59:19 That's because they measure inflation with food and energy excluded from the equation because they are considered too ”volatile”. Anyone interested in truly measuring inflation's effects on the cost of living for real people would know that's wholly and completely buggered but these folks don't seem interested in a complete picture. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/31/12 at 00:58:35 6755425553516B665B56340 wrote:
Ohhh, THEYRE interested in it, allrite, but they dont want YOU to see it. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by LANCER on 01/31/12 at 16:42:25 687771766B6C5D6D5D65777B30020 wrote:
Ohhh, THEYRE interested in it, allrite, but they dont want YOU to see it. [/quote] yep; it would make it too plain as to how inept they have been at actually controlling the insane costs of the Fed. gov't. Over spending by the fed, and the resulting borrowed money to pay for that over spending and associated interest costs, is the primary cause of inflation. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by bill67 on 01/31/12 at 16:53:33 True wars are to expensive we can't afford them. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/31/12 at 18:02:30 5C515E5355420207300 wrote:
Ohhh, THEYRE interested in it, allrite, but they dont want YOU to see it. [/quote] yep; it would make it too plain as to how inept they have been at actually controlling the insane costs of the Fed. gov't. Over spending by the fed, and the resulting borrowed money to pay for that over spending and associated interest costs, is the primary cause of inflation. [/quote] It would be inept if & ONly IF controlling the economy in such a manner as to offer the people a chance at a decent life & comfortable future. That, however, was never part of the plan. The very manner in which the Fed is designed makes it impossible for that to ever happen. Where we are in in a situation that was inevitable from the start, hastened by criminal elements using our military to accomplish the wants & needs of a global elite. Honestly,, how have any of US benefited by these wars? YOu Havent? REally? Well,, Me NEETHEr Hoss! BUt Look at who HAS.. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Drifter on 02/01/12 at 06:24:23 bill67, Justin, +1 Time to start nation building...right here at home! |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 02/01/12 at 19:55:51 Heaping blame on the politicians and bureaucrats is wasted effort -- what are YOU going to do about it to protect your family RIGHT NOW? We are past arguing and blaming, we are at the doing point. What are you going to DO? What actions are you going to TAKE? |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/01/12 at 21:46:19 Survivalists suggest having food for a year.. I dont see that as possible for most fo9lks., but enough to stay alive a few months isnt too much for most ,, a 25 pound bag of beans isnt much, rice isnt too much, stuff for making cornbread,, ehh, not fancy, but itll keep the cobwebs off yer butthole, Extra ignition mod=ule for the car/bike/generator.,. Generator should run on propane, Stash spare iggy parts in a safe place to keep an EMP from blowing them up. Shield anything you can, Look up Faraday cage Water,, gotsta ta have Wattah! |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by verslagen1 on 02/02/12 at 08:32:00 If it is a nuke, hopefully I'm close enough to a military base not to worry about driving around afterwards. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Oldfeller on 02/02/12 at 08:55:23 Justin, you are mixing up on your doomsday scenarios a little bit. And Verslagen is flippin' nukes at us now. (nukes, I don't worry about -- I live right next door to Fort Bragg and am well inside the primary blast radius) This one is about severe inflation based on diluted money leading to a devaluation of the dollar internationally, with the dollar no longer being the international monetary exchange medium. It is about $6-$10 a gallon gas and $4 loaves of loaf bread. And how are the baby boomers gonna do that on their SS checks? Hey, bread is over a dollar a loaf already and gas is 1/3 of the way there and that is just in the last year. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by Savage_Rob on 02/02/12 at 09:16:35 3D2E3938272A2C2E257A4B0 wrote:
If it's nukes just put me close to ground zero... I guess that's about what you were saying, and I agree. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by John_D FSO on 02/02/12 at 14:23:23 15273027212319142924460 wrote:
If it's nukes just put me close to ground zero... I guess that's about what you were saying, and I agree.[/quote] Aw, c'mon. I kinda want to trick my Saturn out Mad Max style! :D |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by bill67 on 02/02/12 at 17:34:30 In June 2008 the gasoline price hit its highest ever, over $4.00 a gallon.Does anyone remember who was the president then. |
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Title: Re: Inflation and what to do about it Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/02/12 at 18:16:07 5A7971737079797067150 wrote:
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