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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> Why rear wheel drive on police cars? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1323844485 Message started by Boofer on 12/13/11 at 22:34:44 |
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Title: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by Boofer on 12/13/11 at 22:34:44 Since the old Crown Vic is retiring after idling for years at everthing from wrecks to Christmas Parades, it looks like the Charger may get the nod in some places. I've driven RWD and FWD cars for years and understand the handling differences, but I never really understood why oversteer is preferable to understeer. Any ideas? |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by sjaskow on 12/14/11 at 09:28:48 I don't think handling has much to do with it. Most of the time police departments want body on frame for their cars since they can take a beating better than unibody. Since the big body on frame cards tend to be RWD, that'd be why there are more RWD versus FWD used in the past. This is changing with the death of the big American sedan. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by MotoBuddha on 12/14/11 at 10:52:53 Most of the LEOs around here use FWD Impalas. You'd think there would be enough demand for cop cars that at least one manufacturer would offer a designed-from-the-ground-up vehicle. Rugged, powerful, roomy. There could also be a taxi version. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by arteacher on 12/14/11 at 13:51:11 Most of the taxi's around here are retired police cars. They are cheap, already set up for propane, and easy to work on. The plant that produced Crown Vic's, and police specials is just outside of London and put a lot of people out of work when it closed it's doors. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by engineer on 12/14/11 at 14:19:59 The Crown Vic is a great car in many respects. As pointed out it could take a beating and was fairly cheap to repair because it had a frame. Also the engine and transmission were easily accessible for repairs or replacement. It had a lot of mass which is a nice thing to have in a collision with another car and it can push around smaller cars. The V8 engines had decent power and the chassis is big enough to accept all the police accessories such as beefed up cooling systems with ease. It is also very durable and with regular maintenance could go many miles. And due to the ease of working on the engine they were often kept running when other vehicles would have been scrapped. Police departments put a lot of money into a car with the special lights, radios, cages, and whatever so they like them to last as long as possible. Rear wheel drive cars are generally considered to be better handling cars but the Crown Vic itself doesn't excel in handling and is terrible in the snow. But it is wide and has little tendancy to roll over. Rear wheel drive cars in general don't roll over as quickly as front wheel drive vehicles. I am amazed at how well the police get around in them. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by Jerry Eichenberger on 12/15/11 at 12:42:17 Oversteer is preferrable because it's easily controllable with throttle. As a former race driver in the amateur ranks, I can drift a RWD esaily, but not so in a FWD. Have you ever seen a FWD race car? None exist that I know of. RWD is also simpler - engine thru clutch or torque converter, straight to transmission, then thru a drive shaft to differential. FWD is mechanically more complex, combining transmission and differential into one unit. Hence, it's less reliable, and more expensive to repair when needed. I won't have a FWD car for my personal car, and until they quit offering manuals, I don't have an automatic transmission either. I prefer to control the car rather than having it float along on its own accord. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by RidgeRunner13 on 12/15/11 at 13:31:48 Jerry, there are many oval tracks that have mini stock or thunder stock or some other name they dreamed up that run front wheel drive cars. Some mix 4 cyl. front & rear wheel drives in the same class. I ran a class at Corpus Christi Speedway that had both. Originally it was called mini-stocks, & later was changed to Texas Thunders. From late '91-96 I ran an Opel GT with a 1.9 bored to 2.0L. From 2004-07 I ran a Mustang GT with a 2.3L. Both engines turned over 8k, The Opel with mostly stock parts, except for the J&E pistons & Zero Gap rings. The 2.3L has many expensive parts in it. This class was about 1/2 second slower that the super street class, dominated by 350 camaros, when I started. With the rules we had then, about 1/3 the cost to run. Front wheel drives have been very successful in this class. If you go to U-tube & search pappygt13 I have several clips there. They now have a class calles Frontrunners, limited to Stock 4 cyl. automatic cars. It is an entry level class requireing very few modifications other than a roll cage & racing seat. A link to forum divisions for many Texas tracks can be found at http://www.lonestarspeedzone.com/ 8-) |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by drums1 on 12/15/11 at 17:36:39 I personally think it has to do with not only cost of repairs, but how much of a beating it can take before needing repairs. Having worked on cars for 23 years, I can say that older rear wheel drive cars have a much beefier front suspension. Occasionally, on a rear wheel drive car, you might need a ball joint or a tie rod end or a set of shocks replaced, but that's about it. On front wheel drive cars, you got ball joints, tie rods, axles, struts, strut mounts.....and the ball joints and tie rods are made cheaper and smaller than they used to be. They break easier, yet cost more. Struts nowadays cost 4-5 times what a set of shocks costs. Axles--$200 a pop or more. Not to mention the cost and labor involved when changing wheel bearing assemblies, which take a real pounding on police cars. And front wheel drive cars nowadays seem to be mostly mid size. Gotta have room to haul them criminals around, and enough power under the hood to catch them. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by SuperSavage on 12/16/11 at 22:51:21 Starsky & Hutch, and Baretta drove rear wheelers. If it was good enough for them, it's good enough for all..."Don't go to bed with a price on your head..." ;D |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by JohnBoy on 12/17/11 at 00:49:16 Around here the LTDs are being replaced with mid size SUVs. The cops love them stating that they can see better and carry more. Most are RWD fords |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by runwyrlph on 12/17/11 at 09:29:57 my first car when i got my license in 1991 was a partially wrecked '83 bonneville (rear wheel drive) . it was FUN stomping the gas as I pulled into our dirt road, spinning out dust and gravel! kinda sad our kids will never get to have that kind of fun! |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by mpescatori on 12/18/11 at 06:37:45 For what it's worth (I well know I'm on the other side of the Ocean) FWD Vs. RWD is a bit like the "slabsides vs. wheelgun" debate among LEOs. Most Police Agencies here in Europe either go with BMW 325 (because they're compact, fast and reliable) or will but whatever the national industry has to offer (i.e. the French will buy Peugeot or Renault, the Italians will buy Alfa Romeo, many others have Toyotas built in the UK) http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ_EAiJi2RUil7WuuPFJSj0zu6Sc5kU_cnXZzinUQHNpNxnM-MbkQ Early Police Alfa Romeo Giulia, 1600cc, 130bhp, RWD http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT-60DaDDeKwtpbybYqi2wsIFXGwHbVzPaqPi1W885EqqCO8Ci5zg Alfa Romeo 156, 2000cc, 155bhp. FWD http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQgf9An_iOtZPkjWzhqm4iPhOnVaWoPP2C2X6FQXpjEnylBySJ Alfa Romeo 159, 2400cc Turbodiesel, 210 bhp, FWD Pug, Renny, Alfa all offer 200bhp+ cars in FWD only, with a 6-speed manual. Come to think of it, Skoda offer a 4x4 sedan built on a modified Audi floorpan. The point is nobody will design and manufacture a car for Police purposes only, so the Police buy what's avaliable on the market. In general terms, FWD may appear to be more complicated, the truth is it's all concentrated on the front axle. The rear axle is there for support and nothing else. RWD will give oversteer and allow for "Dukes of Hazzard" U-turns, but in tight, twisty environments FWD is more manoeuverable and more forgiving. A high speed chase in the rain ? Give me FWD any time. Last, "fishtailing" the fugitive is against the rules by European legislation, you can't ram the fugitive's car unless you are trying to avoid something much, much more lethal. on the other hand, we don't "chase at 40mph", we chase, hunt down and stop, period. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by verslagen1 on 12/18/11 at 09:27:03 25382D3B2B293C273A21480 wrote:
You mean PIT maneuver. "fishtailing" is generally a back and forth maneuver done by yourself. |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/18/11 at 09:43:55 The pit & ramming are for from equal. A pit can be done with almost no damage at all., Both cars will drive away from a properly done pit, |
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Title: Re: Why rear wheel drive on police cars? Post by Serowbot on 12/18/11 at 09:50:38 6D7274736E6958685860727E35070 wrote:
Where's the fun in that?... :-?... |
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