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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Switchable blower-supercharger ? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1316609934 Message started by mpescatori on 09/21/11 at 05:58:53 |
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Title: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by mpescatori on 09/21/11 at 05:58:53 I don't want you all to theink "he musta smoked a good'un" :D but I was leafing through the online catalogue of a UK-based company selling accessories for track-modified cars... I came across this ... 8-) http://89.206.185.119/images/ebay/jjc/coo_in-line_blower_fan_4.jpg It come in two versions, 3" blades blowing 135cfm, 4" blades blowing 235 cfm. A little math says 135 cf = 3820 liters, and 235 cf = 6650 liters. The Savage being a 650cc, at a howling ::) 6000 rpm will suck in 1950 liters. Hmmm... I'm not saying we can blow the Savage at 15-20 psi boost... :o... But a little imagination can go a long way... We can have the carb before the blower, or blow the carb directly. The first solution would have the air/fuel mixture race through the blades, so we want to ensure the electric motor of the fan is quite airtight, or... :-/ The second solution has the fan blowing air into the carb, a solution used by Maserati for the "Biturbo" of the 1980s, but they had to enclose the carbs into an airtight box in order to avoid the carb itself bleeding fuel through the various gaskets (so they say... never had a Maserati...) At $50/unit, it's food for thought ! Thoughts ? Food ? ;) |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Tom K on 09/21/11 at 07:35:01 The CFM is nice but if it can't build any pressure not sure of the boost you'd get. could be fun even if it adds only a couple pounds pressure. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by spacepirates on 09/21/11 at 07:37:47 I wonder if you could somehow tie in the speed of the fan to the throttle position, such that at idle, the fan would be off (or at a low speed) and at WOT the fan would be full on. maybe someone with some skill in electronics could rig up something like that. I'd opt for the blower to be before the carb, just for ease of installation and the idea that it wouldn't mess with the flow/dispersion of the air/fuel mixture, but i don't have any scientific reasoning behind that, just a conjecture. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by arteacher on 09/21/11 at 15:05:27 How on earth would you jet it? :-? |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/21/11 at 15:11:20 Flip the switch & pull the choke? |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by bill67 on 09/21/11 at 16:52:59 Theres no way that would work.The jetting would be the problem.Unless you used the variable jets that go back and fore in size. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by mpnoffi on 09/22/11 at 04:52:27 These things showed up on the car forums years ago. This is nothing more bull shittery. It is a marine bilge blower "marketed" as a electric turbo. Lots of folks bit on this years ago and screwed up their cars when the unit broke and sent parts flying into their air intake at WOT. Sheer fraud...check this out. http://www.wholesalemarine.com/p/RUL-240/Rule+In-Line+Bilge+Blower+For+4 If that was in a "performance car catelogue", I believe I would throw it away. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Gyrobob on 09/22/11 at 05:06:47 The best you can hope for is a few psi (maybe) of pressure increase (suction reduction) at the intake of the carb,... sort of like setting up a ram air system of some sort. It is not a positive displacement blower, so if the blower wants to pump more air than the engine at a given rpm can accept, it just spins more and pumps less,... sort of like when you put your hand over the end of a leafblower. There are two normal placements for superchargers,.. before and after the carb. Pros and cons each way. -- If you have a genuine supercharger before the carb, you have to put the carb in an airtight box so the pressure outside the carb is the same as the pressure going into the intake. If a box is not an option, a special carb is needed. With this electric blower, it would change the pressure so little you probably wouldn't need a box, just jetting changes. -- If you put the supercharger after the carb, the carb must be engineered to handle a fuel-air mix. This blower is not. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by mpescatori on 09/22/11 at 10:26:36 Gyrobob made exactly the same assumptions I made, so I'm glad I thought it out correctly. MPNoffi misunderstood me, (or maybe I didn't put things in the right perspective) the fan/blower is advertised for ventilation of the windshield to avoid misting; you won't find aircon in a track car, much less a complete dash - it was my wicked idea to fit it elseways. Well, I see I've caused some decent interest, what next? ... :D Elastic jets to change the mixture at varying altitude... :-? ;D |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by engineer on 09/23/11 at 07:40:29 The cfm rating of a fan is at zero back pressure. As the resistance increases the cubic feet per minute falls. A combustion chamber offers a lot of resistance and the output of that fan will be negligible. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Gyrobob on 09/23/11 at 08:00:08 494B404B424B475D2E0 wrote:
Being a fan and not a positive displacement pump, the output of the fan will be pretty much limited to the amount of air the engine is sucking in at any given rpm. The overall effect will be only that of reducing some of the flow restrictions of the airboxes/manifolds/etc. upstream of the carb,... sort of like the ram air system on the Hayabusa. http://www.bluemelon.com/photo/42589/1742132-T150U.jpg |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by RadRacer on 09/24/11 at 20:54:31 Ive thought about trying one of these and it has a switch to kick in fan as u open throttle http://www.electricsupercharger.com/products.html just havent gotten around to it yet |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Gyrobob on 09/25/11 at 06:23:21 697A7F697A787E691B0 wrote:
Neat idea. I wonder if it works. There would be a few things to keep in mind about their performance claims: -- 1 PSI NET BOOST (measured on the intake at wide-open throttle) Up to 15 more horsepower GUARANTEED! If they say "up to" that allows them to explain that when you get only 3 more horsepower, they can say, "Well, we said "up to" not "more than." -- 5% more horsepower through the entire RPM range! This would be really hard to document. I'd like to see their test results. -- Safely draws over 833 WATTS from the battery when activated at full-throttle! Using over 62 AMPS... This is a LOT of amps. With normal amounts of inefficiencies, it would take 2 to 3 horsepower at the alternator to drive this thing. (1 hp = 746 watts if efficiency is 100%) -- Only the e-RAM flows 800 CFM! (unrestricted air-flow) This means if you set it on a bench in free air, it'll flow 800 cfm. In an intake system, with an engine sucking in less than 800 cfm, it'll flow a lot less. I wonder what the duty-cycle is. How long can it be run at a time? Does it heat up? Can it be run continuously, or it is used for short-duration boosts like nitrous? The switch you mentioned makes it sound like an intermittent thing. I wonder why they don't show a pic of the actual blower. Does it look something like the pic in the first message of this thread? What kind of noise does it make? Still, it is an intriguing idea. If you install it, it would be cool if you could do some before and after measurements to show how effective it is. At $300 for the small size, it better be pretty effective, eh? |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/25/11 at 11:25:26 I say Balderdash & Fiddlesticks,, & Ill even toss in a Humbug,,I wouldnt touch that thing. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Gyrobob on 09/26/11 at 06:48:14 223D3B3C21261727172F3D317A480 wrote:
Balderdash & Fiddlesticks,... sounds like a British law firm. I would be inclined to not use something like this either, unless there was some way for it to use a positive displacement pump. Then at least you would get some degree of actual supercharging, rather than just a psi or so. |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Ed L. on 10/01/11 at 19:14:26 Remove the air box door. Take the right side cover and hammer the leading edge into a flared lip. Instant ram air intake going into the air box. Just run a little larger main jet than regular to compensate for the extra air flow into the air box when at speed. Think about it, it will work better than any cheap fan set up. The faster you go the more air will get forced into the airbox which will give some positive pressure at the carb. When at idle or riding slow the stock lower end jetting won't be affected. You will see the advantage only at high way speed where the extra pressure in the air box is at the max. Just a thought ;) |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Sunchasers on 10/11/11 at 19:36:58 Looks exactly like the bildge blower fan I installed on my boat this summer! ;) |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Gyrobob on 10/12/11 at 08:32:52 4B5D464C4A2F0 wrote:
Did it increase your top speed any? |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by RidgeRunner13 on 10/12/11 at 10:29:58 53455E5452370 wrote:
Way back in '92 I used the 4" version hooked with the rigid flexable drier vent hose to a drier vent 'scoop' to get a little air into my Opel GT mini-stock. In a 25 lap race, it would get over 140 degrees in the car. And we experimented with a couple of different types of flexable hose to find the rigid flex flows best. Believe me, you wouldn't get any noticable performance boost from one of these. 8-) |
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Title: Re: Switchable blower-supercharger ? Post by Sunchasers on 10/12/11 at 12:13:50 1C2229343934395B0 wrote:
Did it increase your top speed any?[/quote] Huh?? :-? |
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