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Message started by MERKURMAN on 09/15/11 at 17:01:03

Title: Front brakes need help
Post by MERKURMAN on 09/15/11 at 17:01:03

I just replaced the front brake pads on my 1988 savage with EBC brake pads. I also purged my master cylinder, line, and caliper and put new brake fluid in it. I made sure to bleed the line and caliper. Now the inboard pad is dragging on the rotor.

First has this happened to anyone? If so is it normal or could something be out of alignment or broken? I made sure I did everything according to the " HOWTO: Front Brake Pads (step-by-step) " post in the tech documents section TWICE. I'm not sure what else I can do.

Please, I will be grateful for any help or advice.
Thanks

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by arteacher on 09/15/11 at 17:12:57

One of the pads always will touch a little, because there is only one piston in this design. Lift the front wheel and spin it. you will hear the slight contact, but the wheel should spin freely. If it doesn't the sliders are dirty and will need to be cleaned.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by MERKURMAN on 09/15/11 at 17:30:16

Is it normal for the rotor to turn a blueish blackish color? It also smells like the pads are burning. If so how long will this last?

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by drums1 on 09/15/11 at 18:27:32

Not long. Sounds like the caliper may be froze up, or as arteacher said, the sliders are froze up. (where the caliper slides back and forth. ) Also, the pads themselves may not be able to move. Sometimes they fit real tight. You may need to file the edges a little where the pad contacts the caliper. A light coating of Sil-Glide brake lube on all the edges where contact is made helps prevent this from happening.

As far as the rotor turning blue---not a good thing. Overheated from brake pads dragging. Once that happens, the rotors are usually junk. Severe overheating creates hard spots, known as heat checking. Sometimes they can be machined and saved....usually not. The pads might be able to be saved, with some light sanding, until they return to their original colour. In most cases, though, the pads would need to be replaced also.

Not what you wanted to hear, I know. Next time around, make sure the wheel spins freely AFTER applying the brakes a few times. If you can feel it dragging, something ain't right. I assume you put on a few miles with it dragging---turning a rotor blue doesn't happen easily or quickly.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by MERKURMAN on 09/15/11 at 19:27:42

I just took it about 4 blocks noticed that it was dragging and parked it. The rotors are just a tint to the blue side like they were starting to overheat. I'm going to tear them down again and make sure that the slides are working and greased properly. Also I may file the pads down where they contact the caliper just to see if they may be just a little too thick. I will let you know the outcome as soon as I can get it done. Thanks for the suggestions.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by Gyrobob on 09/16/11 at 07:21:04

On a caliper that has been used for 23 years, and has probably seen less than marvelous maintenance for at least some of those years, it would be a miracle if the caliper is still smooth and shiny inside. The piston is not moving smoothly and retracting to its proper position when you let go of the brake lever. (the most likely problem on an old, well-used caliper)

There are lots of other possibilities: the caliper is not sliding smoothly over the bolts it rides on,... or the seals are sticking inside the caliper,.... or the pads are not moving relative to the caliper,.... etc.

The whole assembly has to be clean, corrosion-free, no pitting, smooth sliding surfaces, with flexible boots and seals, and very slightly lubed in order for it to work properly. It is amazing that disc brake systems like this work so well when so many things have to perform properly for it to work at all!

Bad news / good news .........
-- Bad news: You may be looking for a new caliper soon.
-- Good news: A used caliper is as good as a new one if you can verify the cylinder inside is smooth (no pitting or corrosion), and you get all new expendable parts (seals, boots, etc.) At Ron Ayers, a piston with a piston seal and dust seal is about $24.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by drums1 on 09/16/11 at 08:22:32

I have a 24 year old caliper that is working just fine. But if you want to tear yours apart before trying anything else, be my guest. Personally, I am about cost savings 1st.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/11 at 08:27:11

Clean up the pins the caliper sides on.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by Gyrobob on 09/16/11 at 08:39:01

6F7076716C6B5A6A5A62707C37050 wrote:

Clean up the pins the caliper sides on.

I agree. Do the easy stuff first. Clean the pins Justin mentions and squirt some silicon lube (the kind that dries out) in there. Similarly, clean the areas where the pad that touches the piston is supposed to slide relative to the caliper.

While you have it apart, make sure the piston is moving in and out freely.

Good luck,..

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by MERKURMAN on 09/16/11 at 11:08:59

I cleaned and greased the slides. It seem like it is working properly now. Just to check I stuck my hand down ne'er the rotor to see how hot it was got after I rode it down the block. I could still feel heat comming from the rotor but it isn't near as hot. I'm not sure if it is normal or not to have heat from the rotors after about 4 blocks or so with very minimal breaking (only got it up to about 30). If so how hot is too hot?

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by Gyrobob on 09/16/11 at 11:26:59

525E5954545D4A080D380 wrote:

Hold the bike on the sidestand and the rear wheel temporarily (front wheel not touching the ground) while somebody gives the front wheel a spin. If it spins freely (slows down slowly),.. that is good.

Then, go for a ride for 10 minutes or so at 60 or 70. Use the front brake a few times during the first few minutes of the ride, then don't use it anymore. Stop the bike without using the front brake. The rotor should be no more than barely warm. If the rotor is more than warm, you have more work to do.

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by MERKURMAN on 09/16/11 at 17:04:48

So the brakes are fixed and working as advertised. But while I was riding the engine started to bog down and fuel started pouring out of the left side bowl vent on the carb but not the right side. I know that this issue has probably been addressed many times in the past. I was wondering what the problem might be. Everything on the bike is stock. It has never been rejetted to my knowledge. I also have a stock, probably original petcock. Stock airfilter. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/11 at 18:50:09

YOu got a shotgun?

Id think the float stuck.or.some crap got in the valve,, IDK if that creates a potential for gas getting to the oil,

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by verslagen1 on 09/16/11 at 19:29:58

4A555354494E7F4F7F47555912200 wrote:

Id think the float stuck.or.some crap got in the valve,,

IDK if that creates a potential for gas getting to the oil,

+1

not while it's running

Title: Re: Front brakes need help
Post by MERKURMAN on 09/16/11 at 19:38:23

So carb job it is I guess. I was hoping I wouldn't have to do one but I guess it is just my luck.