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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
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Message started by AlphaBarney on 09/09/11 at 12:44:37

Title: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by AlphaBarney on 09/09/11 at 12:44:37

Hey all, time for the old oil change and I decided, after reading about all of the fun problems associated with it here, that I would tear off the clutch cover and inspect the cam chain tensioner. It didn't look good from what I read; the plunger was out about 16-17mm. The girl's at 6400mi. (2005 S40). 1500 from me in the past few months, the rest from the previous two owners.

My question is, I guess, what are my best options and is she still ridable in the meantime? I know I need to talk to Verslagen about getting one of his set-ups, but what about the mean time? I LOVE to ride, and can't stand just seeing her on the stand waiting to be fixed, but if safety is a concern I may have to...any advise is greatly appreciated.
~Cheers, Chris

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by Boule’tard on 09/09/11 at 13:49:25

Verslavvy on isle 5, can we get a Verslavvy on isle 5 please. :D

17mm extension is an awful lot for only 6400 miles. I would double check the measurement and make sure you are only including the cylindrical part of the plunger. If is indeed 17mm out, don't run it. That is only ~~2mm~~ oops, 5mm away from springing apart and trashing your engine.

Personally I'd replace the cam chain too, since it may have had a really hard life. But that option isn't so popular, when you can more than double the life of the chain with the modified tensioner.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by verslagen1 on 09/09/11 at 13:51:46

Now is a good time.
But it has to be fixed before 22mm
1mm = 1000 miles
You have about 5mm to get that fixed.
How long till winter for you?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by EJID on 09/09/11 at 14:29:43

An 2005 w/6400 already out that far :o

Now you have me worried!!! I am also the 3rd owner of an 2005 that had about 5000 on it when I bought it and it's up to almost 8000 and I haven't popped that cover off yet. I planned on checking it this winter and sending it off to Vers then, but now I'm really worried :( Might just have to dive in sooner than later.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by AlphaBarney on 09/09/11 at 14:35:57

http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z374/Alphabarney/ry4001.jpg
B- yep, that is just the cylinder portion of the plunger. I will replace the chain eventually, but may take the cheap road for now (Verslavy) if thats safe.

Verslagen, I'll PM you about getting a verslavy. If it could last till 8000mi that would be the next oil/filter change and would be closer to winter. I'm in Raleigh, NC so it never really gets to be "winter"...if it aint snowing, I'm gonna be riding, or at least trying.

Could this have been cause by low idle speed mixed with heavier weight oil? The PO had the idle set very low (thumpa thumpa low) and was using 20W-50. I've set the idle higher and am using a 10W40 now. Just an idea.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by EJID on 09/09/11 at 14:38:48

This is the area you measured, correct?

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk182/motobuddha/76ab1950.jpg

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by AlphaBarney on 09/09/11 at 14:42:34

Yep. Just posted a pic. Looks exactly like the one from the tech section unfortunately I was in the same spot as you. Figured I'd be good. It's a low mile 2005...PO's can be a B!$@* I'm learning...

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by Sunchasers on 09/09/11 at 14:47:43

I changed mine at 17mm while I had it apart for plug cap leak fix. I had to use the second (outtermost hole) when installing the Verslavy. Using the first hole on the Verslavy bottomed out the pin in the slot, so no gain there. Just shows how close the original was getting to popping out or wearing on the housing at minimum. I'd change it now and have the piece of mind. ;)

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by HJH on 09/09/11 at 15:28:45

Only had 4,500 miles on my tensioner and it was at 21mm when I took off the side cover. Whew! Saved by the Verslavy! New oil filter and oil, new side cover gaskets, valve adjustment, and much quieter on the road! But, since I too had to use the second hole inthe Verslavy, it will be new cam chain time when I tear into it again. A couple of years, based on the number of miles I ride per year.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/09/11 at 15:45:43

Not xactly a ringing endorsement of the bikes..

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by Oldfeller on 09/09/11 at 16:05:16

Justin, we know from the OEM cam chain mgf that Suzuki didn't buy the OEM's top of the line silent drive chain, and now they (Suzuki) are buying a substitute chain from a Chinese supplier for the current production bikes and aren't even buying the original OEM's chain any more.

Nothing on the 2000 and up bikes are lasting like the original 1987-2000 bikes lasted .... "made in China" ring any bells with anyone?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by bill67 on 09/09/11 at 16:59:35

77686E6974734272427A68642F1D0 wrote:

Not xactly a ringing endorsement of the bikes..

Bad cam tensioner,Bad chain,Bad tires,Bad seat,Bad oil leaks,Bad stability,No way to check oil level, Geared for 50mph cruise speed.Bad hoses,Bad Petcock.Bad brake squeal,Bad speedometer location,Not enough travel in suspension Other wise its a good motorcycle.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by built2last66 on 09/10/11 at 19:16:09

505B5E5E0405320 wrote:

[quote author=77686E6974734272427A68642F1D0 link=1315597477/0#9 date=1315608343]Not xactly a ringing endorsement of the bikes..

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by jjn on 09/10/11 at 22:26:13

Yeah here I was thinking of getting a new S40. I was aware of the tensioner problem. But now I hear they are using a crappy cam chain too that will wear out rediculously soon? Starting to believe I should have kept my Royal Enfield Bullet.

I think I'll pick another bike. Too bad, as I'm an old thumper rider.

Other Japanese bikes with more conventional cam chain tensioners have their problems too. Check out a forum for the Suzuki DRZ400 series, and the Kawasaki KLX250S has them too. I'm starting to appreciate the simple reliability of a pushrod engine.

jon

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by Oldfeller on 09/11/11 at 04:27:35

The world is the way it is --- bikes designed in the 80's and tested out with American and Japanese grade components may not perform or last in the 2012 models built off a Chinese vendor base.

Sorry, that's just the way it is. And it affects all makes of bikes, we just have data on ours to prove it because it and we have been around that long.

Our OEM bone stock engine is slow revving and could run push rods just fine. We rarely break 5,500 rpms in stock format. Heck, a putt putt person won't ever break 4,500 rpms.

Mod your bike though, and you can go up to 7,000 rpm and pushrods simply won't work at those RPMs.

As far as these new bikes showing very low cam chain wear mileage -- hell, we were all shocked when they started dying less than 25,000 miles about 5 years ago.

Verslagen kept a database of cam chain wear out miles and extension amounts back then, so if there is a sudden new downward shift just lately he should be able to say so, definitively.

Verslagen, Isle 3 --- data spill on Isle 3

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by Drifter on 09/11/11 at 05:24:21

The New UCE engine in the Royal Enfield has plenty of problems also, on par with chinese quality. The S40/savage has a few problems but they are easy and cheap to fix, like tires seats, bars chain adjuster, chain drive etc. that cant be said for alot of other bikes.

Every bike has flaws and short comings no mater the brand or cost, actually some of the most expensive bikes have the worst problems.
You cant fix em with a couple hundred bucks either.

Overall the S40/Savage is a great bike for the price and long term maintaince cost and reliability. A 500 Vulcan is another great bike. I have owned 50 bikes in my live good and bad only a rare few are keepers! Think about it!

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by jjn on 09/11/11 at 09:40:17

Can one buy a high quality cam chain currently in the correct length? Or do you have to buy the pos Suzuki sells?

jon

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by verslagen1 on 09/11/11 at 10:42:13

Currently, no.

We lost our contact at the mfr.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/11/11 at 14:10:09

I have one o the special order chains. I plan on selling the bike when I get it together. Ill sell the chain.. I dont even remember what it cost,,

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by Oldfeller on 09/11/11 at 14:41:35

Justin,

A stock chain cost right at $100 with shipping and your swooper dooper chain is worth at least that to some hungry hamster out there ....

Put it up on the marketplace and see what you can get for it.

AND REMEMBER who you promised your front fork woopie to (me !!) -- send me a PM and tell me how much you want for it.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/11/11 at 15:38:58

No can do,, dang thing rubbed the paint on the fender,, it has to go with it..

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by AlphaBarney on 09/11/11 at 16:32:18

Hey Verslagen,
I tried to PM you and email you about a verslavy assembly, don't know if you got 'em. My computer has been on strike recently, so perhaps not. Let me know. Thanks

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by RC on 09/11/11 at 20:29:01

Sunchasers has it just right, my 09 S40 had 8000mi and was 16.5 out when I put my verslavy on, I too had to use the second hole as the first one just about bottomed out the pin.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by serenity3743 on 09/12/11 at 08:04:43

3F3F3B550 wrote:

If I was in the market for a new bike, I would still go with the S40. Put a Verslavy in it at the first oil change and you won't have any worries about the chain.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by jjn on 09/12/11 at 12:37:18

Anyone know the price for a new tensioner/plunger? That way a guy could send it off to Mr. V. and have it ready to replace at an oil change. Or does he sell the completed units without sending him your original one?
I like the S40 concept.
Jon

Title: Re: Cam Chain Tensioner -- how bad is this?
Post by verslagen1 on 09/12/11 at 13:13:59

I have new adjusters too. See marketplace.