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Message started by Boule’tard on 09/02/11 at 19:42:29

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Boule’tard on 09/02/11 at 19:42:29

2D0E0604070E0E0710620 wrote:

..and I am loathe to mess with something that works good.

You got that right, I am still limping along this 11yo hardware on ArchLinux. Unlike with MS stuff, your machine does not get mysteriously slower with time.

Well I guess jspace got his answer and it is fine to go totally OT :D

Title: Re: oil level
Post by Oldfeller on 09/03/11 at 02:18:48

Yeah, when you start your thread off with whooshing a Molotov cocktail at the world ya gotta not be surprised when the tanks show up.

So you use Arch, which means you understand the Linux command line to a degree. Me, I'm a linux cripple who wants it to hold my hand and lead me along all nice like, so I use Mint. She's nice and purty and she holds my hand jest fine and she smells all minty fresh.

My semi-fried processor (fan issues) and faulty hard drive will still run Mint at full speed for everything except playing Youtube videos, so this machine is still functional as a desk PC for 95% of my uses.

Have you read about this cute little toy?

http://liliputing.com/tag/raspberry-pi

I find this intriguing, a $35 computer that as of now can do just about all my limping HP big white box can do. It comes with Debian and Ubuntu preloaded.

The ARM world will really take off soon, with much lower priced stuff available for the folks who can get away from the Microsoft/Intel mind set.

;D Somehow, the Iphone/Android generation has no issues with that.

Title: Re: oil level
Post by Boule’tard on 09/03/11 at 06:55:19

Wow.. they just get smaller and cheaper! 35 bucks? Dang. I think I paid $600 just for the motherboard and processor.

Just yesterday I saw (in the "free" section of CL) a computer a good 8 years newer than mine.. tempting.

But I think for the next one I'll spring for a newer/smaller architecture just for the power savings.

Title: Re: oil level
Post by Oldfeller on 09/03/11 at 10:35:14

I remember how shocked I was when the AMD Athelon 64 chip and motherboards started advertising that they could put more computing power on your desktop than the original Cray Supercomputer had, period.

It blew my mind. More power than NSA's best codebreaker from 10 years earlier. More power than the machines that dynamically modeled the H bomb fission implosion / fusion explosion cycle for the first time.

Heck fire boys, you got more computing power than that now in yer silly Android and Apple cell phones !!

And those stupid tablet gizmos ain't no slouches neither.

======================

Hewlet Packard, worlds largest manufacturer of PC's and Laptops has just announced they are getting out of the desktop computer business. They have sold off all stocks of HP tablets using their own custom operating system and are gonna refocus on their printer business. They will soon be running sales on all desktops still in stock.

Wend through all the public relations bullfarkle and it goes like this "Intel/Microsoft desktop machines are a thing of the past -- we are getting out NOW before we go down with the ship".

Laptops may continue as long as they remain profitable, but competition is fierce and technical innovations are coming too fast to predict any long term technology winners.

"The Cloud" means any old machine that can get you on the net is jest about as good as any other these days. A Roku box or a game box is jest as good as a Wintel Desktop box, the monitors you look at are jest a little different.

Times, they are a changin'

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by verslagen1 on 09/03/11 at 10:46:56

For me, this just won't do.
I need at my fingertips power.
3D capabilities
raw number crunching
vast amounts of ram
a reasonable amount of storage
POWER!

If not then servers will be doing it and with a room full of similar needs, it'll have to be a super computer.

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Oldfeller on 09/03/11 at 13:22:51

I used to feel that way. I bought my daughter the VERY FIRST 64 bit laptop that was ever made. It was seriously hot shite.

She was "da man" when she was in college -- she coud run Solidworks 3-d CAD on her laptop -- half the full tower desktop boxes in the lab didn't have enough ass to run it. We stuffed that laptop with all the fast memory it could possibly hold -- one full meg of systems memory.

Last time we talked computers (at Best Buy of course) we were chuckling about her old heavy hot running laptop -- and how the specs on it had been eclipsed by all the friggin' netbooks sitting over there on the display.

It is a progression thing -- Cray Supercomputer -- AMD Athelon PCs -- Super AMD 64 notebook -- friggin' netbooks -- Verslagen's cell phone

Now it is a $35 computer that gets you to Google's server farm.

Life goe on . ..... ON ! (la de da da da)

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Serowbot on 09/03/11 at 15:06:27

They got this cheap little boogersnot at Wallymart for $79.00...

I'd be tempted, but I already got an Acer netbook...
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Sylvania-RBSYNET7WID/17048504
http://i.walmartimages.com/i/p/00/88/60/04/00/0088600400814_60X60.gif

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Boofer on 09/03/11 at 21:10:47

Just in case you don't know it, you can go to walmart.com and find about anything you need, pay online with a card and pick it up at your favorite store with NO s&h charge. They have lots of stuff that's not in the stores. My wife works for WM and we do this quite often. Just sayin'.

Title: Re: oil level
Post by Gyrobob on 09/04/11 at 05:29:16

0C2F2725262F2F2631430 wrote:

Viktor Belenko, in 1976, flew a Mig-25 to Japan,.. defecting with the most advanced Soviet weaponry of the time. On a tour later, he was watching some American kids play Atari and stated our children had more advanced technology in their toys than did his Mig-25 Foxbat.

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Oldfeller on 09/04/11 at 12:58:27

Point, he brings up a good point about gaming -- Intel stopped developing faster chips whenever 1) new stronger GPU's started taking the load of running the advanced games away from the processor 2) PS2 and game machines took over gaming (mostly).

We do have actually stronger processors now, but it is with multiple parallel processors that are actually slower (less energy wasteful cores) than the earlier fast single core 64 bit chips.

=====================

Windows 8 (if it is done right) should be able to run well on all existing hardware -- and I do mean the older stuff too.

If Windows 8 won't run well on an XP class machine then Microsoft is screwed (done gone down for the last time). People are tired of Microsoft's upgrade bullshit -- they are adding NO VALUE to anything lately by doing so.

XP class hardware is fine for Linux. Linux runs like a scalded ape on old XP class hardware, faster than XP has in a long time as a matter of fact.

(XP used to be fast, reload yours and don't patch it for a few days and just check it out for yourself)

XP class hardware can run Android, but nobody is really putting any effort into that as XP still works and is still going to be supported up through April 8th, 2014.

Microsoft has a real issue with their continuing existence if they don't pluck their heads out of their arses over the new Windows 8. They seem to be trying to make it all restrictive again, and that won't work this time.

Watch out for Chrome OS -- it is beginning to be able to handle various softwares apart from the internet connection. Windows 8 needs to beat Chrome at its own game or Microsoft is finished within 5 years.

If Google did combine more of Android with Chrome and have a self sufficient full operating system that had that million item App store's worth of cheap software to feed off of .... that's some real serious competition.

Google could do that -- Chrome and Android share a lot of the same code base. Android Ice Cream Sandwich will be the Android 4.0 that is the SAME STUFF on cell phones, tablets (and bootlegged laptops). Chrome will still be separate at that time, but for how long?

If you say "Computing device" and count all smart phones, tablets and everything else that computes -- Windows is about 60% of that combined market (and is shrinking year on year). What is dead nuts scary for Microsoft is desktops are dead (so says HP) netbooks are shrinking (see tablets) and android smart phones are the clear single largest growth market. Laptops are still doing OK, but tablet sales and super phones are hurting that as well.

Hit the ball out of the park with Windows 8 and you survive another 5 years in fairly good shape.

Shank it, and you get no second chance.

Here is the future, it has a fast dual core "state of the art low current draw" AMD chipset in it that can run anybody's OS and the machine ships without an OS loaded (no Microsoft Tax).

And get scared again Microsoft -- this Zotach all in one thingie is intended as a TV/internet/Netflix combination tool. Surf the internet on your main screen TV while soaking up your shows over the internet (quietly in the background no less) to view whenever you want to see them. Or stream them and watch them as they come in as a live stream if your ISP is fast enough to do that.

http://liliputing.com/2011/09/zotac-launches-zbox-nano-ad10-nettopo-with-an-amd-fusion-chip.html

http://liliputing.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/ad10.jpg

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Oldfeller on 09/05/11 at 12:54:52

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBvaDtshLY8&feature=player_embedded[/media]

Whut the heck wuz that? It wuz a 4 main processor core chip with 12 parallel graphics cores on the same die operating all in parallel doing something that only mainframe supported graphics workstations can do right now.

And it was doing it in a TABLET or CELL PHONE format no less.

Nvida's Tegra superchip, currently called Kal-EL
(yup, that's Kryptonian for Superman)

This chip is going to power a new generation of laptops starting next fall, running Windows 8 if Microsoft is smart enough to wipe their own butts.

Or played at their (Microsoft's) funeral on lots of Android and Linux and Mac operating systems.

BTW, where is Intel lately?

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by John_D FSO on 09/06/11 at 14:23:52

Gah, too much tech speak... brain melting... :-/

Seriously though, I'm continually amazed at the decreasing physical size of electronic gadgets these days. :o

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Boule’tard on 09/06/11 at 17:41:30

77545C5E5D54545D4A380 wrote:

XP class hardware is fine for Linux. Linux runs like a scalded ape on old XP class hardware, faster than XP has in a long time as a matter of fact.

(XP used to be fast, reload yours and don't patch it for a few days and just check it out for yourself)

XP class hardware can run Android, but nobody is really putting any effort into that as XP still works and is still going to be supported up through April 8th, 2014.

Microsoft has a real issue with their continuing existence if they don't pluck their heads out of their arses over the new Windows 8. They seem to be trying to make it all restrictive again, and that won't work this time.

Watch out for Chrome OS -- it is beginning to be able to handle various softwares apart from the internet connection. Windows 8 needs to beat Chrome at its own game or Microsoft is finished within 5 years.

“XP class” haha. It's telling, that we often evaluate computers not by their gaming/graphics power, not by raw GHz or Megaflops of processing power, not by the latest shootout of ultimate badassery on Tom's Hardware.. nah.. the real benchmark is the ability to handle MS bloatware. ;D

Anyway, I'll LMAO the day Google's free OS becomes more mainstream than the latest windows. The way MS tries to shoehorn itself into every conceivable market will give us fantastic schadenfreude when they lose their OS dominance. But those creeping tentacles really help them in the long run. Notice how they took over all the “office suite” stuff and made it exclusive to their OS.. took over Lotus 1-2-3 and got everyone on Excel. Took over WordPerfect to get everyone on Word. Took over DBaseIII to get everyone on Access. All done through clever bundling and people just wanting their stuff fully compatible. So now we can't ditch windows without ditching everything we run at work.. though OpenOffice has made a valiant effort.

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/07/11 at 03:54:38

Nvida's Tegra superchip, currently called Kal-EL
(yup, that's Kryptonian for Superman)

I know, well,, knew, a guy who named his son that.. his middle name is Kal-El,,

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by mpescatori on 09/07/11 at 06:36:00

I still have, somewhere, my original DELL XPS equipped with a Pentium 133, 48MB RAM (16+32) and a whopping 1.6 GB HDD...

Makes my eyes water to look a a "whopping" 1.6 GB HDD, and at the 16GB miniSD card in my Nokia...

BUT

The day they make an OS which will run on any Core2 Duo with 1 TB RAM...
AND
on an old Pentium (not even MMX...) with 48 MB RAM...

THEY WILL HAVE FOUND THE GOOSE WHICH LAYS THE GOLDEN EGGS !!!

8-)

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Oldfeller on 09/07/11 at 16:35:55

Folks have already gotten a look at Windows 8 and are quietly requested that MS donate back their modified linux this and that source code back to the open source community as per the GNU liscense agreement that they signed.

Poor Microsoft, caught hand in cookie jar again.

Microsoft cannot reinvent the low ARM chip requirement wheel all over again fast enough, they are having to do some of what Google did, but Google was honest and Android stayed a formal Linux fork until Linux quietly gave them permission to branch off as long as source code was given back when they had finished each android dessert flavor.

And Google has released full source code on each android flavor when they are completely finished developing it (and got the next one out, generally) but Google just keeps a strong arm lock on their Android Marketplace as a means of enforcing their standards for each flavor of android.

Android 4.0 Ice Cream Sandwich will be the one and only cell phone and tablet Android Google will release -- works same same on both platforms.

It is all confusing at times, but what you do see is MS OS and Office stuff being forced to be much more hardware compatible to Android and Linux and Apple stuff, there is more hardware convergence going on all the time.

Microsoft MUST play well on general Android hardware or Microsoft fades away in 3-5 years. Microsoft asked Intel to cook up a energy efficient processor/graphics combo to effectively compete against ARM chipsets, but so far Intel hasn't gotten the tricks down pat yet.

AMD is a different story -- AMD is regenerating itself real good lately. AMD is a big convergence player and AMD supports open standards for ARM and Linux on all their current chipsets. Intel not so much but then you don't see Intel being a major player in the low end all that much right now since their best Atom chipsets suck wind compared to the current AMD offerings.

And now here comes Kal-El, an Arm super-chip with 4 processor cores and 12 (count them 12) parallel processing graphics cores. Kal-El comes with the lowest ever energy consumption of ANY cell phone chip ever (just cranks up 1 processor and 1 graphics core for most normal tasks, only cranks up additional processing or graphics cores when they are actually needed, so overall energy consumption can be very very low unless you are actually doing something strenuous.

Watch both Google and Apple soon have only one single OS software that runs on phones and tablets and soon, coming soon, thin light long lasting laptops when Google finally fuses Android and Chrome OS together.

Watch Microsoft struggle to get something on the table while it continues to try to play its crappy little games with 4 levels of Windows 8 OS variants at different and ever larger prices -- until people get sick of it and simply stop paying for it. Same machine will run a fully functional open source OS after all.

If it wasn't for MS Office keeping a wrist lock on business you'd see a lot more movement to free stuff right now.

and the Ipod/Android phone & tablet generation has even fewer mental ties to Microsoft Office because they don't really use it all that much.

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Boule’tard on 09/07/11 at 17:16:30

Why the hell would MS try to mix GNU licensed stuff into Windows when they could just use BSD like Apple does? (I have not been following lately)

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Oldfeller on 09/08/11 at 20:00:55

Hell, Oracle has a publicized internal policy that they will freely use the best of the public domain code, brand it as their own and charge their customers $$$ for maintaining it.

After all, it is free to all to use .... (Microsoft included apparently)

Why do you think Open Office forked off into Libre Office (GNU license) six months ago and Oracle and IBM now say they have "given" Open Office over to the Apache Foundation for them to license under the Apache license.

And all the distros now ship Libre Office instead.

Freedom of even the best free software can be warped into "feedom" once big business gets its hands on it.

They start by putting unique hooks on the files that are saved and a few releases later you can't even open the biatch without "their" version of the software which now has a small required "donation" to help maintain the Apache Foundation .... (which they kinda sorta control now).

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Boule’tard on 09/09/11 at 08:42:15

I don't see a problem with companies taking GPLed software and charging for tech support or writing patches and charging for that, or even charging for an copy of the FOSS they didn't even modify. All that is allowed in the GPL and I bet even Richard Stallman would approve. Red Hat has been making Linux plug-n-chug for business since forever, charging reasonable fees, and remains a respected company.

But you can't take GPLed software and lock it up in a pre-compiled black box of a product like Windows. There's language in there that says you must distribute the source code along with your binaries so that the end user can reverse engineer it if they want to.

It is pretty scummy to take OSS and tweak it just enough to make file formats incompatible or cripple it intentionally. But if they over-proprietize it like that, the source code should still be there to give the customer something to work on.

That is why I'm baffled that MS, the King of All Black Boxes, is anywhere near public licensed software, when the BSD license does not have all that "play fair and share your developments" kind of stuff.

Title: Re: ramblin' IT
Post by Oldfeller on 09/09/11 at 10:12:49

I guess the answer has to be that Microsoft needs to get into Android space, and Android is simply a Google tweeked Linux, so anything that will work with the calls and hardware are gonna have to share somebody's code and Microsoft would rather deal with the GNU foundation rather than Google?

Remember, Ipods and Ipads run a specialized ARM chip made for/by Apple, so using BSD works for Apple but it really isn't Android compatible any more. Heck, Apple doesn't want it to be compatible.

Windows 8 MUST BE ABLE TO RUN ON ANDROID EQUIPMENT or it is all over but the shouting for Microsoft.

Both Linux and BSD were Unix clones, but BSD (and Apple) is a lot closer to real Unix and Linux has drifted slightly further away, and with Android splitting off it has drifted even more further away.

Remember, if mainstream Linux likes something, if they see something neat in Android that they want, they may adopt it into the main Linux kernel tree and drift even further away from the old Unix base point.

Full ARM compatibility as ARM evolves and full Netflicks compatibility and drivers for this and drivers for that -- yup, you could see it coming up in the not too distant future -- especially once Windows 8 creates a nexus point in the next few years that Linux can adopt cleanly since Linux is the root standard, not Microsoft.

==============

Danger

Lots of independent programmers hate Microsoft with a purple passion -- if you think attacks on Windows are bad now, wait until the Linux world sees Microchoke trying to take over "their code" and ease themselves into the drivers seat.

It is gonna get bad in about 1-2 years from now when Windoz 8 comes out for ARM and the Win8 attacks begin. The attackers will know that code better than inside out, they will be the ones who wrote it AND maintain it. And the shoe will be on the other foot when key Win 8 drivers and such simply "quit working well" when the patches roll out.

:-? ..... use Microsoft's own dirty tricks against them? Poetical justice, ain't it?