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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> High idle after riding /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1313816851 Message started by snowdevil on 08/19/11 at 22:07:31 |
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Title: High idle after riding Post by snowdevil on 08/19/11 at 22:07:31 I have a 1997 LS650 that idles fine when I start it (no choke no throttle). After a 5 minute ride the idle speeds up. I adjusted the idle screw on the carb to the point where it isn't touching the throttle linkage. I have only had this bike since Sunday and have only ridden it a few times. Is this normal, should the engine idle increase after it warms up? Thanks, Brian |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/19/11 at 22:19:26 No, not normal, some increase is but till you have to back off the screw till it don't touch. 1st possible, did you push the choke in after warm up? little knob on the side of the carb. #2, possible the throttle cable got snagged on something and the ends aren't sitting in there little pockets. #3, is the petcock working normally? maybe the vac line got pulled off. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by snowdevil on 08/19/11 at 22:31:48 No, I didn't pull the choke out when I started. I checked the throttle cable as I had the carb off yesterday and they aren't hanging up. Could a pinched vac line on the petcock cause it, (im running it on prime). I havent checked that. Other than that the bike runs great. Thanks |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/19/11 at 22:42:10 check out how to attach the lines in the tech section http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1098869040 |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 03:36:46 Snowdevil, You mentioned that you are running in prime -- have you done the rest of the items recommended by Serobot .... there are some tubes and nipples that need to be plugged off. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1251932429 If your idle is still climbing a lot after doing this you have to ask the question "where is the extra gas coming from?" If your idle increase is relatively minor, that could be due to your engine warming up (the oil thins out a tiny bit when it gets hot, especially if you are using a heavy 20w50 oil) My idle increases a bit after a hard ride, everything is hot, fully expanded and worked in well after that hard ride. When the engine is cold, it's cold after all. It should have a small difference in idle speed between cold and freshly exercised hot. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/20/11 at 04:51:35 If the screw is not touching the throttle plate stop, and its idling too fast, the engine is getting air/fuel from somewhere other than by the throttle plate,......only if the throttle plate is centered in the bore and sealing correctly, I would look for a worn throttle plate shaft, or other vacuum leak, keeping in mind that any vacuum leak ahead of the carb venturi will not have fuel mixed w/ it, and will make for a rough idle, which may or may not be able to be compensated for by adjusting the idle mix screw. But on 2nd thought, if all else fails, maybe a Raptor will fix it ! ::) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by snowdevil on 08/20/11 at 05:51:32 [quote author=04272F2D2E27272E394B0 link=1313816851/0#4 date=1313836606] Snowdevil, You mentioned that you are running in prime -- have you done the rest of the items recommended by Serobot .... there are some tubes and nipples that need to be plugged off. Honestly I thought as far as the petcock went that prime was "ON" and the other was a "reserve" setting. Now I'm guessing I am wrong.... |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 06:09:16 Routy, Really, you shouldn't do that to yourself -- now that Snowdevil has read up on it a little bit he may choose to put a Raptor on his bike just to clear up the muddy water a little bit "so he can see the stumps more clearly" so to speak. And what will hurt your feelings is if he lowers the muddy water level low enough to see that he might not have any large issues past that point. Did the Raptor fix anything in his carburetor ?? -- NO, it just gave him a supply of gasoline to the carburetor that is unchanging and stable no matter what the engine intake vacuum levels or the engine speed. ::) ..... and sometimes that does help sort things out a bit Snowdevil, I done took up for you now, so you need to read all of this carefully and try to follow what is going on .... http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1251932429 If you need to ask questions, jest ask them -- you are embarking on the great carb/petcock adventure and we are all here to help you. Please keep on posting as we are interested in what you do and what finally fixes your problem. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/20/11 at 06:26:57 & the reason the screw isnt touching is because its been backed out, not because the plate isnt rotating home all the ay? |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 06:36:12 Jog, let him get his vac petcock technology & terms straightened out a bit and let him try Serobot's test method correctly, then Snowdevil can tell us something that will let us know better how to help him. Snow, you have read about whacking your float bowl a few times with a screwdriver handle -- you may want to do that just to make sure your float is free moving and is responding correctly to your gas level in your carburetor. It is a cheap & easy trick and it effectively resets your float level to "normal" when you have just freshly done it. If Serrobot's test and a couple of whacks with a screwdriver on the float bowl make your issues go away, then you will know something. If not, then you still know something, just a different something. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/20/11 at 06:47:19 7E6167607D7A4B7B4B73616D26140 wrote:
Well you could have put a smile behind that statement,.....unless by per chance you don't have a clue ? :o |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by kimchris1 on 08/20/11 at 06:48:20 Why is he running his bike on Prime, and would that have anything to do with it? kim |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/20/11 at 06:54:18 1E3D3537343D3D3423510 wrote:
OF, Tell me you/guys really think that Snow's fast idle problem could have even the slightest chance of being cause by the vac petcock ! If so, I give it up ! |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 06:55:18 Kim, he thought it was on prime but said that he had "on" and "prime" confused -- let's give him a chance to get his technology and terms straight and try Serobot's test (plus a few carb bowl whacks) and lets see what he finds out. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 07:03:46 Routy, no -- I would guess a sticking float or leaking needle from what little we know right now. That's why I am trying to get him to do Serobot's test plus a few carb bowl whacks. If he runs good, then we get him to undo the tee and the cap and see if it still keep working good. The only reason we are doing Serobot's test is to take out any potential risk of any pinholes or splits in the diaphragm that could be bypassing gas down the vac tube to "speed up the engine". You have to remove and plug the vac line and cap the intake nipple to remove this possibility. Right now all we have us a newbie who is using terms that we all understand but he isn't necessarily using them the way we expect -- "prime" being the example at hand of ??? usage. If he had prime backwards, he wasn't doing a Serobot test at all ..... |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/20/11 at 07:06:05 I really have no clue & doubt that what I suggested is the problem, but it is possible,, maybe,, so I thot Id toss it out there,, Its a great time for some learnin, tho, so,, Ill shaddup & let OF help him,, he'll be better off later.. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/20/11 at 07:08:57 524D4B4C51566757675F4D410A380 wrote:
Are you sure ;D |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/20/11 at 07:10:36 Good point,, |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by bill67 on 08/20/11 at 07:24:11 Sound to me it needs some Sea Foam ran in it. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by dasch on 08/20/11 at 07:40:23 And klotz ;) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 07:48:53 I understand why Verslagen has referred to "going quiet" in frustration, all the list's humorists have had too too durn much fun with petcock issues in the past. :-? mia culpa there too -- arrgh ...... and I also sense that the long string of things you have to do to wend through the complexities of a "carb issue" are getting too steep for a mechanical novice to get their heads around. Can we simplify this test path in any meaningful fashion? Seriously, "Throw on a Raptor & plug the port, put a jigger of Seafoam in the gas tank and whack the float bowl 3 times and call my nurse in the morning if it doesn't get any better" is what a typical proctologist would tell him to do for a first step. (after taking the call on his cell phone from the golf course of course) Sad thing is this really would fix like 90+ percent of the newbie "carb issues" that we see round here. But then Routy and Veslagen and Jog and KimChris would be asking "Well, what did you really fix?" and the answer would have to be "Well heck, the shotgun blast took out the burglar, the safe and the wall -- it stopped the problem". |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/20/11 at 08:22:22 Why don't you advise him to swap out his head bearings too. sooner or later they're gonna go bad. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 08:33:48 See? I try to play it straight and you tease me and I tease you back then you get all serious about it. :-? OK, Snow you jest listen to Serobot and Verslagen -- they are gonna walk you through it all one slow step at a time .... Don't you be listening to no silly joking proctologists, that's the rest of them (me included) -- as they have their total attention focused on poking some fun up somebody else's shorts anyway. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/20/11 at 15:39:39 Snow hasn't been back in a while, (can I blame him?) and I'm thinkin if I was a nu-b, and came here w/ the fast idle problem he has, and received 2 pages of what he received,.....I'm wonderin if I'd ever be back !.....seriously ! I know,....shame on me too. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Serowbot on 08/20/11 at 16:33:20 Could be that he was tryin' to maintain that super low, almost dying idle speed that people seem to think sounds cool... Dangerous for oil pressure, but sounding cool... I didn't suspect the petcock on this one,... but with a Savage, any carb problem is best tackled after a simple two minute petcock check, before digging deeper and causing a possible problem... ;)... |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/20/11 at 22:01:42 Serobot's test is a logical starting place for a first pass test. Remove the "noise" first (also get the newbie used to the terms we use) then analyze what remains. Most of them fix the petcock then the problems go away. (and so do they, they got their help and that's why they were here in the first place) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/21/11 at 07:53:13 3B2D3A273F2A273C480 wrote:
I agree, your pet check is good to do in any case,...if a person will take a the few minutes time to do it. But excluding any problem w/ fuel running in where it shouldn't be, any other problem can be checked by using the very simple "prime" check. If prime doesn't fix it, a raptor won't either,..simple as that. So I agree, check check check first. But any advice to raptorize it first,... just to eliminate a problem that mite happen some day ??? :o :( :-[ :-/ :'( |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/21/11 at 13:11:31 4D4258435F594A48404E592B0 wrote:
::) Now Routy, who was it that first suggested using the Raptor to fix everything? ;D I later on humorously recounted what a lazy practicing proctologist might would do if you interrupted his golf game .... but I didn't call any names -- really I didn't. But hey, if the glove fits, stick it on up there and tickle him some, he seems to need a chuckle .... ======================== OK crew, Routy says I have oldbrainfart amnesia and don't remember several newbies who have dialed in recently with "carburetor issues" that did not involve a petcock flaw of any sort. I truly don't recall any, as a matter of fact the petcock replacement has wound up fixing all that has come in lately. Routy remembers there were two though (although the names and any of the details seem to have escaped him) so I'm askin' ..... Somebody help us out and remind both of us of who these folks were, I wanna give Routy his count credit if he indeed deserves it. It has to involve a LS650 or an S40 though. (got to have some standards about this sort of funny business or it would get ridiculous) Since it's my brainfart, you have full permission to help me out all you want to. :D I'll go get my crow out of the freezer so he can thaw out some. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/21/11 at 19:14:47 Well, lets see a list of all the ones that raptorizing fixed, excluding the ones that think it mite have fixed it,......or at least helped it, and excluding the ones that will say it fixed it, only because they will never admit that they foolishly spent $30 on something that was supposed to fix their bad idle problem, or their backfiring problem or any other problem that was caused by dirt in the tank and no fuel filter,.... had nothing to do w/ the pethingy. Better yet, lets see some pictures of all those hundreds of broken diaphrams that came out of all those less than 10yr old bikes,......aw WTH,..make it 15 yr old bikes ! How many times have we heard/read,..."I turned it to prime and it didn't help any" And the ones that said it did fix it, how many of those replaced a vacuum line that was 20 yrs old, and all was well. Replace ther vacuum hose yearly ?? Quit being so cheap and buy a good vacuum hose. I mean, I know 3 bikes that are 5 yrs old, and the hose is like new yet. Don't believe me, ask Bill !! ;) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by ralfyguy on 08/21/11 at 21:46:48 I replace my vacuum hose once a year, regardless. I got three feet of 3/16" fuel hose from O'Reilly's for a couple of Dollars. Lasts me several years. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 03:05:19 And there is nothing wrong with you religiously maintaining a slowly failing vac petcock to keep it going yet another year. I quote the personally knowledgeable Serobot, 1/3 have had issues with their vac petcock, 1/3 are gonna have issues with their vac petcock and 1/3 will NEVER have issues with their vac petcocks. Serobot and I are in the first group, Ralfyguy is in the second group (he is being very careful not to get into the first group, but he smells it coming from over the future horizon ...) and I truly hope Routy stays in the third group as it would break his heart if it happened to him. ================== I guess I'll put the crow back into the freezer, he ain't thawed out completely yet so he's still good for another try later on. ;D Let's see, if Routy were to move from one group to another (and admit it) that would be a crowable event, right? |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by ralfyguy on 08/22/11 at 04:33:44 I actually bought a new stock petcork last year because the old one was hard turn. I had to use a pair pf pliers. So I disassembled it and lubed the parts, but it didn't work for long. So I replaced it with a new one. I should be good now for a few more years concerning the aging diaphragm. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/22/11 at 05:09:22 72616C6679677579000 wrote:
Now that you mentioned it, mine did turn hard for a while too,.....forget what I did to fix it. W/ my failing memory, you don't suppose I raptorized it do you ??? ;D Curious, how old was this pethingy that didn't have a broken diaphram yet ? |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/22/11 at 05:27:13 OF, I'm still waiting for anything,...... other than hearsay to prove all these broken diaphrams in 10yr old and less bikes,.....I'm even giving you 15 yrs now ! And you notice smart people are staying outta this stupid thread,..?? So why are you trying to drag them in,......need a little help do ya ? :o ;) Alls ya have to do is concede that all diaphram material has a life expectency of 10 to 20 yrs, pethingy no exception. BTW, didja ever figure out how to tell if a pethingy is really shutting off ?? Oh that must have been in one of the other pethingy threads going ? :) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 05:34:57 Routy, I thinks that we all thinks that the cracking of the diaphragm is about the dead last failure mode in the vac death symptom time line. 1) Vac line getting cracked/holey is the first item in the time line. (note: this time line assumes you fix the vac hose and keep it fixed by yearly replacement or honestly, you will never get past step #1 -- dead in the water right there) year 5-10 2) Diaphragm getting partially stiff and failing to flow enough gas at full speeds is the second item in the time line. years 7-15 3) "False reserve" indications start somewhere about here too. years 7-15 4) Getting an occasional (rare) stuck float at the ends of float bowl travel (3 raps with the screwdriver handle fixes it) starts somewhere around here too. years 7-15 5) Diaphragm getting so stiff you can't start the scoot sometimes after it dies on you comes next. years 15-25 6) Last comes diaphragm pinhole/crack death and the gush of gasoline down into the air box and the sump. years 15-25 Nobody waits until the 5th and 6th level to change it out to a Raptor (or if they are among the faithful, put in a rebuild kit or buy another $80 factory vacsucker). They get off their dead arses and do something about it. The smart ones are reading along on our as yet unproven discussions about repeated lean outs potentially hurting your engine and are jumping ship at #2 or #3. They don't want to deal with #2 or #3 and they DURN WELL KNOW #4 can potentially hurt their engine. (Verslagen too agrees that cylinder wall gasoline wash down can cause engine damage, he has said so) So, you talking like waiting until #6 is what defines petcock failure is sorta disingenuous -- not even your other ever faithful vac petcock crew members think that way any more. And nobody with a brain is gonna wait past #4 as the current consensus seems to be real engine damage can potentially start around there. First indication that #4 may be in the cards -- DO something about it. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/22/11 at 06:00:52 Of, getting desperate now ?? just grabbing for anything now in a last ditch effort ?? Lean at hi speeds,...possible Cyl washdown,...? Forget it,......any engine that is getting washed down thru a leaking diaphram is going to be laying a smoke screen, and fouling plugs ! Lets see a show of hands all the engine damage ! I wonder if Suzuski factory knows about all this engine damage ? How many Suzy dealers know about this, and are advising a raptorizing,......or would even install one if you paid for it ? Anyone w/ a brain,.....??? Mite be about time to get outta here ! |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 06:06:04 Test method to even show that a vac pethingy even is working at all on shut off that is your baby to do, not mine. You have to have an installed vac petcock to work on that test, so right now the pool of senior possible workers is a bit limited. Right now, until you do publish your "working good" test -- officially nobody knows if a vac petcock is working correctly or not. Other than that, they can refer to the time line above to spot where they are on the road to total vac petcock failure. ================= Yep, a wise person would stay out of this heated discussion, although it is resulting in some additional information that is useful. Also, if you are interested in having any input into the time line discussion I am modifying it to accommodate the good points that are raised -- Routy just made one just above and it is now incorporated in the time line. When we get all the ugly dents pounded out of it's bodywork -- likely it is going into the Tech Section appended to the very end of Serobot's Tech post -- so if you got a thought on that time line a couple of posts up please share it. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/22/11 at 06:14:24 Test idea,, Hows about a gas can & a vac pump? |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/22/11 at 07:29:54 0B141215080F3E0E3E06141853610 wrote:
Jog, Tell me, wouldn't it be easier to go out to your bike, jerk the hose off the carberator, shake it.....not over 3 times, go have a beer....or 3 max, come back, check if the hose is dry on the very end ? But then, I always did believe in the KIS method. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Boule’tard on 08/22/11 at 08:02:29 Guys, it's time for us to come out of the closet and admit our allegiance to the Raptor Party, and employment by Yamaha. Unlike Routy, no doubt a great bastion of scientific integrity and master of petcock statistics, we have shamefully cloaked ourselves behind an illusion of fixed bikes. Our forefathers envisioned a future where NO MAN would suffer the begoggling mental challenges, general mockery of our troubleshooting efforts, and lack of hand exercise that the Great Void, or Vacuum, has foisted upon us. Far too long have we stood by and watched our motorcycles falter, only to be run over, or worse, passed, by little old ladies in Lincoln town cars. Our children.. left behind, for lack of fuel! Well, no more. We will not leave them behind, sucking gas fumes out of a hose. We will not allow our elderly citizens to outrun us. We will realize our future, as I shall now wave the flag with pride, and print several T-shirts, bearing the mark of our dark society: http://i55.tinypic.com/oh91c.jpg |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 08:16:08 ;D ;D ;D ;D Boule, you gonna make me bust myself laughin' ---- I wanna shirt if you actually make any Danger here is we might actually start talking real politics -- and that would be a faster death than sucklessness. And the temptation to draw parallels between vac petcocks and current and/or past presidents might be too hard for the non-disciplined among us to resist. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/22/11 at 09:30:06 A ruptured diaphragm has caused more troubles than just a faltering engine. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/22/11 at 11:30:14 Here's a black mark for your petcock paranoid crew... http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1313419518/11#11 $ |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/22/11 at 11:56:44 OF, you're jumping around like a bleached blond. 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/22/11 at 12:07:29 From my own experience... I purchased the '96 in '05. I ran the petcock for about a year with no problems. Then needed to run it on reserve all the time. Then noticed a drop of gas in the vac line so I swapped it for an '02. Still running fine. The '88 leaked from the get go, rebuilt with kit. I use "cheap a$$" 3/16 vac line, it gets hard after a year. With multiple tank removals a year for various maitenance, it don't last long. Same with the fuel line. $ |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 13:32:16 Versy, don't you think the vac line dies first? Then if you replace it, what goes next? (I will amend the symptom list to make it clearer that you have to fix the vac line because I agree -- if you don't fix it you aren't going forward from there) Thank you for the feedback, I know this topic irritates you to no end and I appreciate it. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 14:01:32 4E5D4A4B54595F5D5609380 wrote:
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 14:07:15 Amended time line with inputs added (dates moved into text to make it clearer) 1) Vac line getting cracked/holey is the first item in the time line. (note: this time line assumes you fix the vac hose and keep it fixed by yearly replacement or honestly, you will never get past step #1) year 7-10 2) Diaphragm getting partially stiff and failing to flow enough gas at full speeds is the second item in the time line. We generally call this "stumbling at highway speeds". years 7-15 3) "False reserve" indications start somewhere about here too. years 7-15 4) Getting an occasional (rare) stuck float at the ends of float bowl travel (3 raps with the screwdriver handle fixes it) starts somewhere around here too. These generally happen when the bike "runs out of gas" on the open road when you still have like a half of a tank of gas. years 7-15 5) Diaphragm getting so stiff you can't start the scoot sometimes after it dies on you. years 15-25 6) Last comes diaphragm pinhole/crack death and the gush of gasoline down into the air box and the sump. years 15-25 |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/22/11 at 14:21:16 I plead insanity due to work |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 14:27:14 And I think I understand something else that I didn't before -- because of the age of the bikes when you bought them you jumped right into the thick of things (into the more advanced problems). |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Serowbot on 08/22/11 at 14:31:04 Anybody consider running a clear vac hose?... Wonder what a leaky vac line looks like?... :-?... |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by EJID on 08/22/11 at 14:35:23 6472657860757863170 wrote:
Run both a clear Vac hose and Fuel line on a stock petc0ck. No problems yet (knock on wood). Had the tank off over the weekend and noticed both lines that are now 2yrs old are stiff, so I will replace them next chance I get. I've been considering the Raptor changeover for some time now, but have yet to have any of the symptoms on my garage kept 2005 so I haven't bothered yet. Tick, tick, tick, just waiting :-? |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 14:35:30 Considering you may be courting engine damage at that stage of things I wouldn't want to spend time taking Youtube videos of gas drooling down your clear vac tube ..... |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Routy on 08/22/11 at 16:03:26 Of, why don't you give it up. You're beaten,...you even sound like a beaten man,....just grabbin for straws anymore. You accuse me of not backing up what I say. Well I don't have to ! I am defending OEM saftey equipment on our motorcycles, and I have no reason not to. You're saying it's all junk,....well,....if you ask me, I think you are the one that is obligated to back up your reasons for condeming perfectly good equipment. You seem to know it all,......well lets be backin up you're talk ! You can't do it,.....w/ anything credible that is ! All you have done is get all the gullables here all paranoid that anything that happens to their bike just has to some how be caused by the pethingy. If you don't know any better, I feel for you,.....but some how I think you're smarter than what you have shown in these pet threads. You don't have to "poor Routy" me,.....I'm doing just fine, and so is my s-40 BTW,......really, I have never had a better running motorcycle in my 50 yrs of riding. So, tellya what, go pedal your paranoia on some more nubies that will listen, and don't worry about me beating you down any farther,......cuz I'm outta these pet threads ! I have got a life ! |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by ralfyguy on 08/22/11 at 16:45:35 333C263D212734363E3027550 wrote:
It was the stock petcork on my '06 S40. I took it apart, cleaned and lubed everything, but seems the lube didn't stay long. It was fine for a few days, then got hard to turn again. It was still doable, but hurt the fingers and I was afraid it would break off and take some finger meat with it, slamming against the then nice and sharp fractured surfaces. It was still doing fine otherwise, because after I replaced it there was no difference in the way the bike ran at all. The diaphragm didn't appear to be stiff at all. Didn't feel aged, but I have no comparison to a new one of course. On a side note, so far I never had any running problems with stumble at high speeds or anything like that. The only thing I've noticed is, that I'm having to switch to reserve after 1.8 gallons, but that was the same with the old and the new petcork. I could swear when I got the bike it was around 2 gallons. I have no idea why. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 16:51:04 Routy, please don't go .... without you there is no opposing viewpoint being expressed and little progress gets made. I'm sorry you think that vac petcocks have nothing wrong with them, but I think Serobot has the right of it, you have a relatively new bike and nothing is wrong with yours yet. Verslagen is different, he bought old bikes that already were pretty advanced in their symptoms, so he has a different viewpoint that is based upon that. His bikes all drooled out the vac tube at one point in time and he had to fix them by rebuild or by swap out (on his first bike, was this pre-Raptor, but Bobo mods and "running in prime" existed?). I bought mine used, but with only 480 miles on the ticker (hubby bought it for his wife so they could tool around together but she got pregnant and never rode again). So, I had the opportunity to go through the whole chain of symptoms. And you my friend shall be blessed with the same opportunities that I had -- given enough miles and time. When your time comes, you will pick your best course based on what is known then .... you do have rebuild kits identified now thanks to Verslagen's good work. :) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by verslagen1 on 08/22/11 at 16:54:35 486B6361626B6B6275070 wrote:
Blaming a stuck float cause you allow the bowl to empty is pretty sad. sure you may not want to go in there and clean out the rough spot that causes it to stick. just a sorry excuse IMHO. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 16:58:05 Yup, but you have to admit it is quick/free/easy way to find out what sort of aggravation your vac petcock has just handed you. It is easy to suggest to a newbie that they carry a big screwdriver in their saddle bag until they finally resolve all their petcock issues -- ain't so easy to teach them how to do fine filing work inside a carburetor without screwing things up any) Now, when the Raptor went in and the fuel level quit going up & down due to starvation (float stayed in the middle like it is supposed to) the float sticking stuff stopped completely. And I didn't allow the bowl to go empty, I was "running out of gas" with over a half tank of gas in there by that point in time and having the dickens of a time getting gas back into the bowl when it stopped me by the roadside (prime didn't seem to be working very well either by then, why I cannot say -- don't know) My petcock was having me off pretty good by then .... ====================== List modifications made -- Versy are the dates all pretty much in the ball park with what you saw on your two older bikes? The older symptoms have a pretty broad time span, but they are based on the earliest latest anyone said that they saw them. Amended symptom time line with inputs added (dates moved into text to make it clearer) 1) Vac line getting cracked/holey is the first item in the time line. (note: this time line assumes you fix the vac hose and keep it fixed by yearly replacement or honestly, you may suffer some of the symptoms shown below just because your vac hose is leaking and won't hold suction) year 7-10 2) Diaphragm getting partially stiff and failing to flow enough gas at full speeds is the second item in the time line. We generally call this "stumbling at highway speeds". years 7-15 3) "False reserve" indications start somewhere about here too. years 7-15 4) Getting an occasional (rare) stuck float at the ends of float bowl travel (3 raps with the screwdriver handle fixes it) starts somewhere around here too. These generally happen when the bike "runs out of gas" on the open road when you still have like a half of a tank of gas. years 7-15 5) Diaphragm getting so stiff you can't start the scoot sometimes after it dies on you. years 15-25 6) Last comes diaphragm pinhole/crack death and the drool of gasoline down the vac line into the air box and the sump. years 15-25 |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by snowdevil on 08/22/11 at 17:29:51 The intent of this post was to ask for help about high idle, not to instigate a fight over "my kid can beat up your kid". To those who posted about checking the throttle cable,vac lines, tapping on the carb, etc, THANK YOU! I also posted that this bike is new to me, I don't know everything about it or claim to. Let say I know NOTHING about this bike. Please give me an explanation of the OEM petc-ock setting. I have 2 dirtbikes and a four wheeler whose petc-ock use ON,OFF,RES only. What the heck is PRIME? Secondly there are 2 settings on the choke, I'm use to choke ON/OFF please explain this. Sometimes people just want to know what time it is, not how to build a clock. ;) |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Oldfeller on 08/22/11 at 17:35:05 Prime is a fuel pathway that bypasses the vacuum actuation portion of the OEM petcock. It also bypasses the reserve gas function, so if you run in prime you gotta watch your gas level or mileage so you don't run it bone dry and leave yourself stranded. We really don't have a choke like you normally think about it, we have a fuel enrichment circuit that can add (stage 1, first click out) a little bit of gas or (stage 2, second click out) a large amount of gas. Choke pushed in all the way is how you are supposed to leave it when running .... owner manual and shop manuals here .... http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1138554254 |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by bill67 on 08/22/11 at 17:52:27 7B746E75696F7C7E76786F1D0 wrote:
Routy do you realize you have a motorcycle tire on your S40 and Suzuki should have put a car tire on it. |
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Title: Re: High idle after riding Post by Serowbot on 08/22/11 at 17:56:19 Sorry Snow,... You should normally run in the "ON" position... "Prime",... is used if your bike has been sitting for weeks or more, and may have an empty floatbowl, or after doing carb work, to refill the bowl... Also, use "Prime" to drain the tank... ;)... |
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