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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> New owner - pipes and decel popping /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1312557061 Message started by wrench13 on 08/05/11 at 08:11:00 |
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Title: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by wrench13 on 08/05/11 at 08:11:00 Just picked up a '02 Savage for my kid to learn on. I used to ride a 'truder 1400, seems like this engine is 1/2 that engine, pretty cool. Question 1) Anyone run theirs with the stock header pipe only ( sans muffler)? Looking for more loudness for safelty sake and maybe a bit more preformance. Looks like I could just take the muffler off, put in pro-pipe baffle and perhaps re-jet. Question 2) I rode her home yesterday, about 30 miles on the slab. Bike pops on decel, like its got an exhaust leak. Normal for this bike or not? If normal, what can be done to eliminate or reduce it? Thanks people! |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Serowbot on 08/05/11 at 09:42:49 If you are concerned about a little popping,... I really don't recommend going to an open pipe... I don't recommend going to an open pipe anyway... Way too loud,.. and you'll burn your exhaust valves... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/05/11 at 10:33:54 The decel popping is normal, and it will pop when you turn off the engine (on an all stock bike). At least that's what mine did (2005 LS650 all stock when I got it) and the guy at the Suzuki shop told me it was normal. Also, I'd recommend getting a license plate frame, because the vibration made mine crack and almost fall off. The previous owner of my bike thought someone stole his license plate... lol, it still had the corners attached to the bike :D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by verslagen1 on 08/05/11 at 11:19:42 6461767D707B2220130 wrote:
+1 to what Sero says performance will suffer, mpg will suffer, neighbors will suffer, the kid will suffer due to lost hearing, cops knowing where he's at every time he gets on the bike, but then so will you. ;D couple of options to make it a little louder... put a dyna muf on or drill out the stock muf. A little decel popping is normal, excessive may indicate an air leak or a dirty carb. Check the header bolts and muf clamp. Or clean the carb. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Edgar on 08/05/11 at 13:41:26 Or get a jardine |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/05/11 at 14:09:12 wrench13 says, "Looking for more loudness for safelty sake " Incredible there are still folks who subscribe to this nonsense. Hey, wrench, a short search will turn up a few threads that debunk the idea about loud pipes saving lives. The popping on decel is a common prob, and, assuming the exhaust system is tight, a few carb adjustments can fix most of that. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by BurnPgh on 08/06/11 at 22:38:31 4678736E636E63010 wrote:
Call it nonsense if you want but my real world riding experience proves the theory of "loud pipes save lives" to me. First year I had the savage i was run off the road several times, and no it wasnt due to lack of riding experience as this isnt my first bike and the likely reason i was never hurt or did damage to the bike is because i could clearly tell what the offending a-hole was about to do. I saw ahead of time and chose the ditch over the hood. Drivers often simply werent aware of me being there. I've installed a SE muffler and for the last 2 years i havent been run off the road since.(until a couple weeks ago. 16 year old who just got his liscence didnt even look my direction before whipping out of his driveway into fairly heavy traffic. I was able to swerve around him and get past with about 4 inches to spare. Needless to say I stopped the bike in the middle of the lane right in front of him and gave him a few choice words). Not only are drivers more aware of me, so are the deer. I literally watch them scatter at the sound of me from 50 yards away. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by verslagen1 on 08/06/11 at 23:36:32 +1 on what burny says and my experience replicates his to a tee. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 03:50:31 4F787F635D6A650D0 wrote:
Call it nonsense if you want but my real world riding experience proves the theory of "loud pipes save lives" to me. First year I had the savage i was run off the road several times, and no it wasnt due to lack of riding experience as this isnt my first bike and the likely reason i was never hurt or did damage to the bike is because i could clearly tell what the offending a-hole was about to do. I saw ahead of time and chose the ditch over the hood. Drivers often simply werent aware of me being there. I've installed a SE muffler and for the last 2 years i havent been run off the road since.(until a couple weeks ago. 16 year old who just got his liscence didnt even look my direction before whipping out of his driveway into fairly heavy traffic. I was able to swerve around him and get past with about 4 inches to spare. Needless to say I stopped the bike in the middle of the lane right in front of him and gave him a few choice words). Not only are drivers more aware of me, so are the deer. I literally watch them scatter at the sound of me from 50 yards away.[/quote] ok ::) |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by arteacher on 08/07/11 at 06:43:59 776473726D6066646F30010 wrote:
+2. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 06:59:51 535858515D525349483C0 wrote:
+2.[/quote] you can lead a horse to water,..... Do some real research on the issue and you'll learn the fallacy. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by verslagen1 on 08/07/11 at 07:43:05 112F2439343934560 wrote:
+1 |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Routy on 08/07/11 at 07:49:16 And just how would research figure that out ?? x4 While loud exhaust scares the he!! outta me now and then, I lotsa times have heard a bike long before I saw them along side my cage, and just may have prevented me from a dead spot move over. I hate loud bikes, but I do believe they could be more safe than unsafe. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by arteacher on 08/07/11 at 07:50:46 +2 ;) |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by bill67 on 08/07/11 at 07:59:00 Put loud pipes on your car you will be much saver. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Mr. Hyde on 08/07/11 at 08:05:09 I heard a few weeks back that the Government was looking at legislating something that manufacturers would have to put on these new electric bikes to 'MAKE NOISE', so cagers could hear them coming. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Routy on 08/07/11 at 08:07:35 757E7B7B2120170 wrote:
In reverse anyway ;D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Routy on 08/07/11 at 08:11:40 47782442736E6F0A0 wrote:
A nobrainer,....even us kids knew that 60 yrs ago,......when we always run around w/ feed sack tags flappin on the spokes ! ::) |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by BurnPgh on 08/07/11 at 08:51:24 1A242F323F323F5D0 wrote:
+2.[/quote] you can lead a horse to water,..... Do some real research on the issue and you'll learn the fallacy. [/quote] Is your "real research" on "real paper" or is it more like "real rides, on real streets"? |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Serowbot on 08/07/11 at 09:44:04 People crash into fire engines and ambulances all the time,... big, brightly painted, with flashing lights, and sirens... Against an insulated car, with a 1,000 watts of stereo, and a text messaging maniac at the wheel with a sandwich and a soda... You aren't there... Loud pipes will alert everyone else, that you are there, but not the guy that hit's you... :-?... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 11:38:01 2017100C32050A620 wrote:
+2.[/quote] you can lead a horse to water,..... Do some real research on the issue and you'll learn the fallacy. [/quote] Is your "real research" on "real paper" or is it more like "real rides, on real streets"?[/quote] Nobody does research on paper anymore. While I do have something like a quarter of a million miles on motorcycles (real rides on real streets), nothing gets you to the facts like some actual research as opposed to anecdotal info about some guy’s opinion on loud pipes. I have lots of individual “learning” situations on motorcycles, but they are nowhere near an adequate sample size from which to draw firm conclusions. The beauty of the internet is that you can get real info from real research,.. and it is fairly easy to sort out the bogus “info” from anecdotal sources. -- For an example of bogus info, there are folks in various auto forums that will swear up and down it’s safer to not buckle your seatbelt because they had a cousin that burned up in a car that had a seatbelt he couldn’t unbuckle. I know a fellow that nearly had his head taken off by a helmet that got hooked on to a sprinkler system as he was sliding along the ground after being dethroned by a truck. To this day he will never strap on a helmet, … he’ll wear one while driving his $25000 Gold Wing, but he won’t strap it on. -- On the other hand you can look at very well conducted studies like the Hurt report, AMA studies and insurance company research done by real bikers that, oh by the way, also are real “studiers,” meaning folks who really do know how to conduct research. -- Whose word means more?,… some guy’s cousin with one or two scary situations drawing some off-the-wall conclusions, or someone who also has lots of real world experience PLUS he also knows how to accurately study something? Those studies, by the way, conclude that loud pipes do not, in fact, save lives. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 11:41:27 392F38253D28253E4A0 wrote:
Very well put. Add to that the idea that most of the sound from "loud pipes" goes backwards while most of the crashes involve (are caused by) folks out in front of you. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 11:48:19 I didn't want to get involved in this, but I just have to say that I've almost changed lanes ON TOP OF about a billion scooter riders because my music was louder than their scooter.. I don't care what the studies say, a louder pipe can and will save your life and it's not some "weird conclusion" by someone's cousin. Just like wearing a bright green vest makes you more visible... just common sense.. now break out your studies on how many people are color blind :D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 12:00:58 7C6B77726A2C727F6D6A28281E0 wrote:
"Don't bother me with the facts, eh?" |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 12:05:38 18262D303D303D5F0 wrote:
"Don't bother me with the facts, eh?"[/quote] The fact is simple: The louder something is, the more people will hear it. If someone is shooting at you with a gun that has a silencer on it, is that safer than them shooting at you with without a silencer? You can write up as many spreadsheets as you want to about gravity not existing, but I can still throw a ball up in the air and we can both watch it fall to the ground :D But really, that's all I have to add... If you want to run a quiet muffler that's really your decision. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Serowbot on 08/07/11 at 12:28:51 ... and my point is... the people that will hear you, are the people that are listening,... ...and those that will see you, are the ones that are looking... If you are nearly hitting scooters,... turn off your radio... What about bicyclists, and pedestrians,... deer, dogs ?... 99% of accidents are not caused by the victim's audio/visual camouflage... they are caused by the at fault drivers inattention or distraction... The best a loud pipe will do is startle them, and make them swerve or slam on the brakes... ...that's helpful... :-?... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 12:38:27 2335223F27323F24500 wrote:
So now I'm not aloud to listen to the radio (factory speakers) in my car? What's next, gonna take my horn so I can't beep at someone stopped at a green light cause they won't hear me? Pedestrians aren't usually walking in my blind spot on the road, and I have had deer that I didn't hear or see leap on to the hood of my car.. if I would have heard that deer running I could have prepared.. I have seen many bicyclists get hit riding on the road.. but then again they usually aren't driving as fast as cars and motorcycles so they aren't usually in the lane next to you or in your blind spot, they are on the SIDE of the road. I get your point though Serowbot, distracted people are the problem but LOUDNESS will un-distract them :D I have yet to almost change lanes on top of an ambulance or Harley Davidson.. Okay, I'm done with this "the earth is flat" topic :D I really hate stuff burned to my muffler... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by MrBrownTX on 08/07/11 at 12:39:43 Poor thread fell vicitm to a pointless war that no one will ever win or change anyones mind about. Wrench I hope you got the answers you were looking for. If not there are a lot of threads about what you asked. There is a lot of great info on this site. Hit the search tab at the top and dont forget to change the search date range. I also find that anytime I put a question into google about this bike it returns several threads from this site to me that is almost a faster way to search. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 13:25:12 4A554555485049535F270 wrote:
Quite correct. Baseless, strongly held opinions will overrule facts every time. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 13:37:05 I bet a megaphone will get more attention than that piece of paper with the "facts" written down on it :D Why do I keep getting suckered into this thread.. lol If you want to ride a moped with a quiet muffler at night with no lights on it and not wearing a helmet because the "facts" say it's okay too, help yourself... free point for that drunk guy texting in his F150 :D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by verslagen1 on 08/07/11 at 13:48:34 645A514C414C41230 wrote:
Quite correct. Baseless, strongly held opinions will overrule facts every time. [/quote] I got one question for you GB, if caps is equivalent to shouting, larger text is what? Talking louder? Why would you need to talk louder than every one else? So you are noticed more than anyone else? And you got the gall to say anyone who wants a louder than stock pipe so they'll be noticed more often is factless? |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 13:58:10 Okay I have 1 more thing to add to this before I start cleaning the crap off my muffler again.. Where are the statistics of accidents that were prevented because of a louder muffler or a bright green vest? I really don't know why I'm concerned with this at all because my bikes not very loud and I mostly wear black.. at least the "facts" and "research" say I'm safe :D (I hope I didn't just jinx myself) |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Serowbot on 08/07/11 at 15:35:45 The one time I got hit,.. was couple of years ago,... I was riding a Harley, twice the size of my Savage, with full factory lighting, saddlebags, windshield, and loud pipes... The guy T-boned me, dead center of his grill, running a stop sign... he told the cops, he never saw or heard me... ... he didn't even stop when he hit me, he ran me over,... no skid marks,... they winched the truck off of the bike... It really hurt,... so I take this topic kinda' personal... If you like loud pipes... run loud pipes... ... just don't expect to be seen or heard... That's all I got to say... :-?... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 21:23:15 362532332C2127252E71400 wrote:
Quite correct. Baseless, strongly held opinions will overrule facts every time. [/quote] I got one question for you GB, if caps is equivalent to shouting, larger text is what? Talking louder? Why would you need to talk louder than every one else? So you are noticed more than anyone else? And you got the gall to say anyone who wants a louder than stock pipe so they'll be noticed more often is factless?[/quote] Larger caps may be equivalent to shouting, but larger text is there for old-guy-eyes. It's simply a matter of making it easier to read. When I respond to the various posts here, I copy and paste all of it to a Word document with even larger characters so I can see it easily,... then I put it back to the original poster's size, and size 14 for me. Yeah, I have lots of gall. I've been counseled about that all my life. Oh, yeah, you started off your post saying you had one question for me,... I counted five questions. ;) ;D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by verslagen1 on 08/07/11 at 21:27:25 did you know that if you want larger text you can press and hold the ctrl button and turn the wheel on the mouse to make the text larger or smaller? |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 21:30:32 2234233E26333E25510 wrote:
Your sad story is one of the basic points in the AMA articles. Loud pipes don't do much good for peabrains who aren't paying attention. Even if someone thought it was a good idea to make a big racket all the time, that someone would be quite the fool if he expected the obnoxious noises to protect him,... to think he was never going to be dethroned just because some people notice the racket. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 21:33:01 2F3C2B2A35383E3C3768590 wrote:
Yes. I know that. It also changes the composition of the stuff on the screen (acts like a magnifying glass), which I prefer to leave alone. The Opera browser has a slider in the lower right hand corner of the screen that does the same thing. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 21:49:25 I got all that crap off my muffler... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/07/11 at 21:52:13 27302C293177292436317373450 wrote:
Good point! There aren't any studies that show any lives were saved from loud pipes. I will have to admit, though, there are also no studies that show any lives were lost from loud pipes. The Hurt report, for example, didn't address the issue other than to say there was no proof of any effect one way or the other. You also stated, "I get your point though Serowbot, distracted people are the problem but LOUDNESS will un-distract them." If you are depending on this, you are a self correcting situation. You also stated, "I have yet to almost change lanes on top of an ambulance or Harley Davidson.." It's not YOU I'm worried about. YOU have an appreciation for not running over motorcyclists. The folks we are concerned about are the SFB's who float blissfully along texting or putting on makeup or listening to ground thumping noises they call music,... those folks are the ones that will run you down,... those folks are the ones that are unlikely to be distracted by obnoxious pipes. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/07/11 at 22:07:35 This has been a good discussion, I see it both ways. Defensive driving is what they teach you to get your "M" class on your license... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by bill67 on 08/08/11 at 03:51:33 A lot of young boys have loud sub-woofers in their cars so they don't get run over. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/08/11 at 04:43:42 30273B3E26603E3321266464520 wrote:
Excellent point. Whether or not wear a loud-pipes-save-lives tattoo, you absolutely must play the "How're they going to kill me here, how're they going to kill me there?" game as a matter of survival. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/08/11 at 04:50:00 010A0F0F5554630 wrote:
Heh, heh, heh,.... They also have their cars shod with 3-foot diameter wheels with mirrors for spokes to get more attention. I'm sure the only reason they do that is so all the guys racing around on CS-1s don't accidentally crash into them. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Routy on 08/08/11 at 05:45:09 I hate ignorance, but lets pretend that loud stuff does nothing for saving lives ! So why does the law require sirens, and train whistles and horns and etc etc. ? Never mind, I hate ignorant answers. ::) |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by bill67 on 08/08/11 at 06:05:30 Routy you convinced me I'm getting a train whistle for my S40. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/08/11 at 07:00:37 727D677C606675777F7166140 wrote:
At least we agree on that. I hate ignorance too!! What could be more ignorant than riding along making a huge, publicly annoying racket, deluding yourself into thinking you were in a protective cacophony, safe from those who would attack you? The law doesn't require sirens and train whistles on my CS-1. Even so, I have obtained a pretty small airhorn setup I plan to install instead of using the OE "meep, meep" buzzer. It'll fit down low in front of the rear tire. I found a clearance sale on some small two-horn sets. ($9) I'll be using just the little horn, and I am here to tell you when the compressor puts all its air into that one little horn it is loud. I mean loud. Consider two situations: 1. You are in the left lane on a four lane 2-way street on a quiet bike with my $9 horn. You are about to overtake a ditsy kid in a rap-music-18”-subwoofer-Civic in the right lane. Without any warning, he starts to change lanes into you. 2. You are in the left lane on a four lane 2-way street on a no-baffles bike with a meepmeep horn. You are about to overtake a ditsy kid in the rap-music-18”-subwoofer-Civic in the right lane. Without any warning, he starts to change lanes into you. In both situations, the kid undoubtedly didn’t know the biker was there. Which bike will be more able to persuade the dude to stay in his lane? Would the racket-bike have been able to make the kid aware there was a bike there? |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/08/11 at 07:13:29 2A2124247E7F480 wrote:
That's not too far from what I am doing,... heh heh.. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/08/11 at 07:45:50 The earth is NOT flat! |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by verslagen1 on 08/08/11 at 08:30:21 neither, in both cases you're about to get your pants creased. In both cases you need to pull up next to ditsy, rap on his winder, pull out his ear plug and say 'hi' with your air horn or by a back fire that only a straight pipe can do. [smiley=evil.gif] |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by MrBrownTX on 08/08/11 at 12:00:09 "deluding yourself into thinking you were in a protective cacophony, safe from those who would attack you?" Does anyone really think that way? I think that assumption is the problem in this debate. I read an article about this topic the other day and it said that the awareness and reposnsiveness of the rider is your primary safety and the most important one. Reflective vests, horns, flashing headlights, loud pipes and such are secondary safety measures. They are nice and can be helpful but you must rely on Your primary safety measure yourself. Can we all get behind that, shake hands, and be happy? |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Serowbot on 08/08/11 at 12:17:45 now we're all supposed to shake our behinds and be happy?... ...okay,... ...but it's not gonna' pretty...:-? |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/08/11 at 15:25:42 5E4151415C445D474B330 wrote:
Sheeesh. You make it sound like we are mad at each other Why do we need to shake hands, and force ourselves to be happy? Some folks get misplaced feelings in these debates,,,, thinking we are fighting with each other, hating each others' guts for conflicting opinions. As my surfer nephew would say, "totally bogus, dude!" When I enter into these discussions, I visualize all of us sitting around a campfire, bbq pit, swimming pool, party boat, whatever,... lounging around with a cooler full of interesting beverages, going back and forth slamming each other with differing thoughts on these "issues" without a care in the world aside from chatting about fun stuff. The everpresent problem with us all being separated by computers is that we can't see the twinkle in someone's eye when he tosses out some comment that could be misinterpreted as an insult, when all that was intended was at worst a smart-alecky (probably funny) remark. Get a grip on the big picture here. We are really fortunate folks. We “meet” here to chat about a unique motorcycle. We all have enough time and money to afford computers and motorcycles. When one guy says loud pipes saves lives, and the other says that is a clueless concept,… them ain’t fightin’ words, that’s just us getting involved in some enjoyable issues. Anyway, I don’t feel a need to make up and be happy. I’m happy already. ;D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Boule’tard on 08/08/11 at 16:45:14 6D5358454845482A0 wrote:
+1 Good analogy. A lot of good entertainment, and information is forged in the (camp)fire of jovial challenges to our ideas. What other kum-ba-ya ya need? :D |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by wrench13 on 08/09/11 at 12:22:43 If I may get in the middle of this monkey nuts fight, and then maybe the thread can go back to the original question.... Loud pipes help people notice you, but will not prevent a-hole-itis from striking. Me and my boys all ride with the idea that the next cager will be the one to get ya. However, since ya can;t look in all directions all the time, loud pipes at least warns the not brain dead that there is a motorcyle within close proximity. Nuf said OK? Now, are these motors prone to exhaust leaks? F-ing thumpers vibrate like a paint shaker some times. |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by built2last66 on 08/09/11 at 13:29:26 They shake so much you need a license plate frame or it will crack and fall off... |
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Title: Re: New owner - pipes and decel popping Post by Gyrobob on 08/09/11 at 15:26:46 5F485451490F515C4E490B0B3D0 wrote:
They shake so much your nuts will crack and fall off... |
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