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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> need some help /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1307060905 Message started by cootersandwich on 06/02/11 at 17:28:25 |
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Title: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/02/11 at 17:28:25 my friend finally dropped her bike off (1998 650) at my house and I immediately went to town on it. pulled the carbs and tore the whole thing apart and ultra sonic cleaned them. I noticed the float was dented and bent, I told her that it needed to be replaced but for $ purposes I bent it back and put it back in to see if the motor would run anyway. So I got everything buttoned back up and she fired up, but died again. I did this several times until I caught it and gave it some throttle. It sounded pretty decent, but if I closed the throttle it would die, with or without choke. After holding the throttle at the lowest point I could without killing it for awhile I noticed that the engine itself by the exhaust was smoking a bit and shortly after it started popping. I pulled the spark plug and the gap looked a little too big so I adjusted it but the color of it was actually perfect lol. I'm about to pull the carb again and check float height but the gas isn't leaking out the airbox or anything. I let it sit for a few hours last night and tried to start it again and it wouldn't start. Petcock works properly, new gas was put in it, I put a inline fuel filter. I'm stumped anybody have an idea or place to start? I do want to make a note that at some point somebody tried to fix the head gasket because there is that silicone stuff for a seal. What would cause the bike not to idle but still run. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/02/11 at 18:46:05 no idle is most likely a clogged idle jet. what is the idle mixture screw adjusted to? smoke? what color? |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/02/11 at 19:04:08 I'm going to pull the carb apart again tonight and go over it again but, i'm pretty positive that I got everything on the carb. I couldn't find where exactly it says number of turns for the idle adjustment screw in the manual, so I went based off of what my Mikuni BS34's called for which was 3 full turns once the screw touches. I mean when I said in my earlier post that I had to hold the throttle, I mean would only stay on at 1/4 turn of the throttle. The smoke was blackish...which could be some carbon being burn't off the exhaust. Something tells me I'm running super lean. Dunno tho |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by Serowbot on 06/02/11 at 19:22:57 black smoke is rich... |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/02/11 at 19:42:59 2731263B23363B20540 wrote:
+1 And we start with 2 full turns then tune it. at 3 turns we go to the next size up. and generally at 3 turns, that screw will vibrate out. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/02/11 at 20:35:21 It's not smoking out of the exhaust its smoking from the head where the exhaust meets the head. As far as I know this is a completely stock motor, the jets are in really good shape and I shouldn't have to go up in size unless there is a problem elsewhere. Maybe idle screw adjustment from the mikuni bs34 is different. To adjust u bottom the screw out completely then back it out 2 full turns...am I correct |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/02/11 at 21:07:02 35393922332425373832213F353E560 wrote:
Info we coulda used up front, check the header bolts, if they are loose it'll leak and backfire. ignore the smoke otherwise. Quote:
yep Quote:
poke your head in there and tell what the main jet is. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by Bubba on 06/03/11 at 12:07:47 "I do want to make a note that at some point somebody tried to fix the head gasket because there is that silicone stuff for a seal. What would cause the bike not to idle but still run." If this is the head cover you're referring to then it's supposed to have RTV gasket stuff there. Have you checked the compression on it? Could be they didn't seal it well and your getting a leak there...maybe causing the smoke from the header??? Just a guess... |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/03/11 at 13:41:28 I haven't checked compression yet because I don't have the tool to do so. "Could be they didn't seal it well and your getting a leak there...maybe causing the smoke from the header???" see I was thinking this but I didn't say anything, I won't really know until I get the carb problem figured out. As far as the main jet size, I guess I'm not to sure how to tell. Would it have it's markings on the side? I noticed a couple things right away when I pulled the carb last night which might be causing the issue. #1 being the float needle was catching a little bit wasn't very smooth. #2 being float height, it didn't look right. I'm going to fix the float needle and measure the float height and see if it works. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/03/11 at 13:50:48 Clean the engine well and look for leaks. float height is easy enough if your carb has a drain nipple. attach a clear tube to it and run it up along side the carb. open the drain and set it to prime gas should come up to the bowl gasket with the bike vertical. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/09/11 at 20:51:25 Alright finally an update, its been nasty out all week. Floats are right, peacock appears to be working correctly everything seems good to go but I can't get the bike started now. I put the battery on the trickle charger for like 4 days then took it off and let sit overnight then when I tried cracking it it just drained the battery. I put my volt meter on it and it read around 12.15 then when I tried cranking it it dropped below 7 and was bouncing around 11 to 7 to 9 when I stopped it was just below 12... this to me is very odd because the battery was new a year ago and the bike hadn't ran or anything since it was installed. I filled the battery up with distilled water to the full markings. Could the battery be bad? If its nice out tomorrow ill try to jump it with my bike but for now I have the rickle charger connected. Also I have another trick charger by die-hard which has a 2 amp charger 10 amp charger and a 50 amp starter. Could the 50 amp starter be used to start the bike or would this be too much for it to handle. Also where is the fuse box I looked around but couldn't find it. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/09/11 at 21:36:15 Sounds to me that you have an issue with the starter. Volts shouldn't be jumping around like that. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/13/11 at 13:43:57 So I hooked up a jump pack to the bike after I replaced the spark plug and still wouldn't turn over. I'm currently trying to test the starter solnoid but getting at it seems to be an issue by itself does anybody have any advise as to how to get it out? |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/13/11 at 14:35:02 Set a fan up to blow on it if youre gonna mess wih it much not moving. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by WD on 06/13/11 at 16:33:43 Solenoid is nearly bullet proof. However, that 10 cent piece of $hit ignition relay that costs $61 and change is fragile. Mine ate 3 batteries last year. Charges great, discharges through that junk relay even better. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/13/11 at 16:56:56 I still haven't figured out how to remove it so I can test it with my mulimeter. I just want to rule it out. I'll have to test the ignition relay to see if that might be it. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/13/11 at 18:18:25 ok, this is strange. I had the battery on the trickle charger again for the past like 3 days, when I pulled the bike out checked the volts and the battery read 13.09 which was good so I figure I'd try to start it, and it darn near turned over the first time which was exciting, but I still couldn't get it to turn over. Checked the battery volts and it dropped to 12.30, tried it again and it dropped to 11.68 volts. I figured out that I have a problem with my portable jump pack because the volts only read 12.58 when fully charged which aparently isn't enough to turn the bike over. I have a Die Hard 12v Battery charger that has 3 different settings 2 amp trickle charge 10 amp charge 50 amp Engine Start My question is to whether or not I could try and start the bike on the engine start mode. When I connected it to the battery in Engine Start mode the Volts read 14.30.....Would that be to high for the bike? Would it damage it if I tried to start it? |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by jdeluca on 06/13/11 at 19:14:09 Pretty sure that 14.3 VDC wouldn't hurt anything in a 12 VDC system. Keep in mind that the 50 A setting just means the charger is capable of delivering up to 50 A, Doesn't mean that 50 A will be delivered the entire time it's connected... ;) In all honesty though, the 10 A setting wight be sufficient, I don't think that the starter on our thumper's would draw 10 A...but then again, I've never thrown an ammeter on my battery wires when cranking...lol Sounds like the battery might be shot if it's dropping that much with minimal rebound. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/14/11 at 13:27:56 I connected it and it reved up a little then died immediately, wouldn't start after that so I put the bike away out of disgust went back like 4 hours later and with nothing else connected but the batter o got it to rev up again and die. Also when I say it revved. Up I mean to like 500-1000 rpms. I'm about to give in and go buy a compression tester to see if the problem is mechanical or electrical. Also when u say the ignition relay what piece are u talking about because I always thought the starter relay solnoid and the ignition relay were the same thing. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/14/11 at 14:39:21 I'd say because it started, it's not electrical or compression. I'd say it's fuel. If you fill up the bowl, it should run a couple of minutes on that alone. Sounds like you got a dribble of gas and as soon as it's gone it quits. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/14/11 at 16:24:20 I've actually drained the bowls like 3 times to make sure that there's fuel getting in there, which there is. I also put the petcock on prime and let it drain for like 10 seconds to make sure the line was clear. I put an inline fuel filter in it just in case. There is 1 thing that I did which I'm almost regretting now is that I bought a bottle of Lucas Upper Cylinder and Injectors Cleaner, a fuel additive that's supposed to clean carbs the way seafoam works. This was my first time using it and I poured half the bottle in with 1.5 gallons of fuel. After thinking about it, I was able to get the bike to fire up before I put the fuel treatment in there...I'm going to test the compression because the head gasket looks fudged up to me. I'm going to put some fresh gas and drain out the stuff with the additive and see if it runs. I'm crossing my fingers |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by verslagen1 on 06/14/11 at 18:28:50 remember car tanks are much bigger, you gotta use about 1/8 of the usual dose for the savage. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/14/11 at 18:38:43 Hahaha my bad, I kinda got carried away. I took the carb off again so I can clean it again. The spark was good and I couldn't test compression because my adapters didn't fit. As for the gas, I haven't made it there yet. |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by jdeluca on 06/14/11 at 20:32:44 If it ran earlier, it's doubtful you blew a ring...I'd try replacing the gas, just put it in a 5 gallon gascan and mix it with some fresh stuff, at least that will dilute the additive almost to the point of usefullness... |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/17/11 at 13:10:09 Ok so I pulled the carb again, blasted it with carb cleaner, drained the fuel with additive in it and put some fresh gas in, brand new ngk spark plug, new fuel lines. Still can't get this POS to run. I took the airbox off so I could spray some starter fluid in there and got it to turn over several times but it would not fun on her own. a whiteish mist seemed to come shooting out of the side of the exhaust, when I was trying to start it. It happened only once. As far as the bike is concerned I know it has a leak in the head gasket somewhere and exhaust. Unfortunately if this is what is causing the bike NOT to run then there is nothing I can do for her. any final thoughts |
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Title: Re: need some help Post by cootersandwich on 06/17/11 at 19:43:58 hey guys, I sprayed a couple squirts of starter fluid in carb, and somehow got it running. I still can't get it to idle, I actually screwed the idle adjustment screw all the way in and it still won't idle. I somehow managed to take it for a short ride around the block. This thing has more problems than what it's worth, I can tell based off the way it drove that it will probably need a engine rebuild which is not in her budget. Unfortunately she has already pulled the trigger and told me she is going to sell her bike. I wanted to thank everybody for your help with this, I really appreciated it. this is a good forum and I'm sure I will be back on sometime. cheers |
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