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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> Ready Aim Fi. . /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1300743391 Message started by mick on 03/21/11 at 14:36:30 |
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Title: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by mick on 03/21/11 at 14:36:30 I went out and got all the stuff I needed to fire my kentucky rifle, another $70 on top of the $200 for the kit. I was reading slowly to make sure I got it right ,I didn't want to blow my house up.Well it came to pouring the powder down the barrel and nowhere does it say how much powder ,the best I could find on line said "100 grams" that was for any 50 cal rifle not just Kentucky,Ok I will take a chance on a 100 grams. Now can anyone tell me what a 100 grams look like ? a teaspoon ? a table spoon ? a thimble ? REmember guys I only have one face ,not cute but it's all I have, so be sure , thankyou. Mick |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by thumperclone on 03/21/11 at 14:48:17 you sure thats not 100 grains?? 100 grams is like 3 1/2 oz... |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by verslagen1 on 03/21/11 at 14:52:16 1st shot, I'd just make a spit ball to shove down there. 100 grams is ok, but I'd call it a heavy load. generally do 50 to 70 for short range stuff. You didn't get a powder measure? ;) spend another 10 to 20. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by mick on 03/21/11 at 14:53:10 504C514954415647484B4A41240 wrote:
I'm pretty sure you are right, the thing I read said 100 gr. I think 3 1/2 oz would blow me to kingdom come. so what does a 100 grains look like ? |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Chopped on 03/21/11 at 15:01:31 It all depends on what size/shape of round you use and the distance you are shooting. GR does mean Grain. Shooting black powder is fun but can be tricky. Some powders my need more grain or less depending on the quality. I would say 75gr would work great for a round ball at around 100yds. Would give you enough wallop for accuracy at that range. but shooting with ball, you get a lot of drop out of the round at distance. I could start ranting and raving about ammunition, kinetic energy, and shooting techniques. I will get off my soap box now! |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by verslagen1 on 03/21/11 at 15:02:50 100 grans = 6.5 grams = .22 ounce = .014 lb. = .001 stones ;D |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by mick on 03/21/11 at 15:47:12 Ok, I loaded her up fired ,just a sharp little crack as the cap went off,waited a minute tried again ,crack again,Mmmm . I took the nipple off ,sure enough it was blocked ,I couldn't see through it,so I ran a very small drill through it,it cleared it and made the hole about 2 thou bigger. tried again ,CLick crack,BOOM,not only that I hit my target ,a one gallon paint can,dead center. A very nice feeling. and thank you all for your help, And you Mike. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by verslagen1 on 03/21/11 at 15:56:14 Ah, don't it feel great to cause a little gobal warming? |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Ed L. on 03/21/11 at 17:09:36 Mick, Here's some load information for black powder guns http://www.investarm.it/media/pdf/manuale_avancarica_uk.pdf Investarms is the company that made the .50 cal Hawkens I've been shooting. Get a powder measure to get your load right and have fun. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by tcreeley on 03/21/11 at 17:16:27 I've got a Cabellas Hawkin rifle that I put together from a kit. It is a 45 cal and I used 70 gr. Cabellas sells a thing to measure the amount of powder. Check out their catalog. Is yours percussion or flintlock? Early I started to remind myself not to look down the barrel to see if everything was just right - especially when I was shoving the rod down the barrel pushing the ball down after the powder. The worst thing that has happened to me was when it misfired and the ball and powder were still in there. I had to put this screw attachment on the ramrod and shove it down the barrel and screw it into the lead ball to pull the ball out. I'm still here! I loved shooting it, but it's been a while now. ;) |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Russ130 on 03/21/11 at 17:43:23 Just to help clear a few things up it is 100 grains not grams which you have already figured out thank god. The most you can go is 150 and that is considered a magnum load. the lightest is probably 50 or so any less and the sabot or ball will not really fire but be more like a lob. Always treat it like it loaded no matter what. That is the number one rule in firearms and it saved my life once. Someone had left a load in a black powder for who knows how long. I put a cap on it and fired it with some wadding to see if it was clear and wouldn't you know it BOOM. Experiment with different loads and projectiles til you find the one that works best for you. For me I use 150 gr load which for some reason has almost no kick in my gun but 100 grs will knock you off your feet. I'm told it has to do with the balancing. I myself use pyrodex pellets that come in 50 gr sizes and just drop 3 of them down the barrel then my sabot which is a powerbelt. Always make sure you have your projectile tight against the load too. Put a mark on your ramrod when it is empty where the end of the barrel is then another after you load it that way you can always tell if it is loaded properly or not. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Reelthing on 03/21/11 at 18:19:54 5C58525A4559545D585C5448310 wrote:
I'm pretty sure you are right, the thing I read said 100 gr. I think 3 1/2 oz would blow me to kingdom come. so what does a 100 grains look like ?[/quote] looks like 100 grains of rice |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Southpaw on 03/21/11 at 18:34:58 Sounds like a great time of discovery. Enjoy the new toy, you've put a lot of hard work in it. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/21/11 at 20:45:18 Awwww, C'mooon, Mick! Wheres your sense of adventure, man??? Dump some powder down there,, wrap a lump O Lead up in a cloth & SHOVE it down that barrel. Dont let a little thing like the potential of an exploding breech knocking the side of your head off make ya wish you knew more about safely shooting a black powder rifle,,, heeeeck NO! Just dump er on in there & hope ya survive,,,, Errrrm,, NO,, go slow, be safe. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by verslagen1 on 03/21/11 at 21:33:31 And when you pack down that powder, don't put your finger on top of the ram rod. If it goes off, it'll take your finger with it. You need all you got left. You'll have to type with your middle finger and your typin's bad enough as it is. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by gerald.hughes on 03/21/11 at 21:41:41 Mick, As a Limey, you should remember that, during the Napoleonic wars, the British has muzzle loading Enfields, and that powder was packaged in paper tubes. It was pre-measured. All the soldier had to do was tear off the top of the tube with his teeth, and pour the powder down the muzzle, insert a patch and ball, and ram it home. The paper power charges were carried on a belt, much like a cartridge belt. Just thought you might like to know. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by mick on 03/21/11 at 22:16:05 Thanks again for all your help,just one more thing while I have your attention, for some reason if I am aiming at a high target the bloody cap falls off,I remember I had the same problem with a cap and ball pistol I made a few years ago, that dang cap will not stay on. I cant emagen what a deadly nuisence that would be in time of war. (a very long time ago). Any ideas folks ? And I refuse to use a hammer, Justin. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/21/11 at 22:35:35 464248405F434E4742464E522B0 wrote:
And I refuse to use a hammer, Justin. Well, Youre just no danged fun at all... Back when those guns ere daily use, everybody had trouble with the cap staying on, till they discovered Scotch brand double sided tape, Theyve dug up HUNDREDS of rolls of tape in the old war fields.. what? You dont Bu LEEVE me? |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by mick on 03/21/11 at 22:42:04 not for a minute. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Wolfman on 03/22/11 at 02:04:26 On a 45/50 cal. Hawkin or Kentucky rifle, especialy a kit gun DO NOT excede 110 GRAINS as a MAXIMUM load! Load a 150 grain magnum load in a rifle not designed for it and you stand a GOOD chance of ruining the rifle, loseing some fingers and an eye or two. MOST inlines are rated for 150 grains, MOST caplocks are only rated for 110 grains. Check your owners manual. Dont go under 50 grains as a minimum either. Pulling a bullet/ ball is a pain in the arse. Youll find around 90 grains will give you the best accuracy though it will vary 5-10 grains from rifle to rifle. Simple tips. NEVER use anything that might cause a spark in or around the muzzle. NEVER smoke while loading the rifle. ALWAYS hold the muzzle away from you and your face. NEVER place ANY part of your body over the muzzle! Even just the powder can burn or tear chunks out of your body! Its a REAL GOOD idea to wear a pair of shooting glasses while loading and shooting the rifle. This will protect your eyes from any possible flash and small parts of the percussion cap. They will fragment sometimes. To help keep the cap on give it a GENTLE squese on the sides after placeing it on the nipple. Be gentle cause if you get rough it can and WILL roll the meat back away from your finger bones. Buy and use a capper to place the caps on the nipple. NEVER let the hammer rest on the cap. Dont dry fire it either because it will flare out the top of the nipple to where you cant get a cap on. Patched round balls are good for plinking, cheap. They will do a bangup job on a deer as well cause they kind of rattle around inside tearing things up. They dont bust bone well and wont hold their accuracy well though over about 75 yards. Differnt thickness and types of patching will affect the accuracy. Buffalo bullets or other conical style will shoot more accurately and break bones better. Their more likely to do a through and through as well. Hollow points are nice for large bleeding wounds. The newer powerbelts work real well. Just dont go to too heavy a bullet and if you change bullet weights and/or powder weights your point of impact will change more then with a modern rifle. Make sure and use the right powder as well. There are four grades of pyrodex(safer then real black powder) and actual black powder(touchy). Black powder/pyrodex draws moisture like honey draws bees. Dont leave a load in the rifle or a rifle uncleaned for long or it will rust/corrode the bore. Use a good solvent or just plain soap and HOT water to clean then throughly dry the bore. Give it a nice light coat of bore butter, especialy if your ging to store it any amount of time. Dont tamp your powder in to solid, it needs a bit of air to fire right and consistant. About 3 good taps useing the weight of the ramrod works well. Try to load the rifle the same way every time, this helps accuracy. Get a mental checklist going and dont get in a hurry. Its not uncommon for someone to get excited and load a double load of powder, two bullets ect. NOT GOOD. Make sure the bullet is seated all the way down on the powder as well or it can create over pressure and blow the breech. Lil tip is load a clean gun, make sure all is in order then mark the ramrod. This way you always know your bullet is fully seated. Cap locks are fun to shoot and hunt with but you have to be extra cautious with them. They can and will bite you if your not carefull. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by mick on 03/22/11 at 08:17:53 thanks Wolfman, some good pointers their. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by verslagen1 on 03/22/11 at 08:52:11 Mick, you'll have to make the pistol now so you have something to shoot too. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Wolfman on 03/22/11 at 12:18:58 Mick, CVA or Thompson, cant remember which, makes a pistol kit called the trapper i beleive it was. Nice looking rig in a .50 cal with adjustable sights. Dueling style grip/stock. Of course now that you got a kentucky you need to make up a St Louis Hawkin in .50 or .54 cal You can actualy get the hawkin in a carbine or rifle. Nice rigs with LOTS of brass to make all shiney n such. Purty rifles that shoot real well to. I prefer the .50s myself though ive got a kentucky .45 as well. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by John_D FSO on 03/22/11 at 15:44:19 Excellent advice Wolfman. The one piece of advice I haven't noticed (or missed ::)) that may seem like common sense but bears repeating: DON'T pour from a powder horn/flask straight into your barrel. If there's an ember in the barrel that sets off the flask, congratulations, you're now holding a hand grenade in your hand! :o Depending on the construction of the container, it can be pretty messy. I've seen the aftermath of a thin-walled horn blowing up at someones side. Lots of severe burns. :( One local store that has a surprisingly good selection of muzzleloading supplies is BiMart. You can get an adjustable powder measure there real reasonable. They also carry balls/bullets, solvents, lubes, patches, the whole enchilada. As to the caps falling off, you can get different sized nipples, and different brands may also be slightly different sized. Ditto for the caps, and they also make different sizes of them as well. The one you see most in stores is CCI's #11. If those are falling off, you can try a #10; CCI and Remington both make them: http://www.dixiegunworks.com/advanced_search_result.php?s=1&keywords=percussion+cap Oh, and for those not into muzzleloading, when Wolfman was talking about bore butter, it's not the stuff you put on your toast. ;D It is actually food grade though; it's basically a vegetable based grease. |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Ed L. on 03/22/11 at 15:52:19 Wolfman, Thompson makes the Trapper pistol. It comes either as a cap lock or a flint lock. Bought myself a Thompson .50 caliber flintlock Trapper over at Buffalo Bill's in Orland three years ago. It's a real easy kit to asembly with most of the shaping and brass work already done. It makes a nice matching piece with the .50 caliber Hawkens from Cabela's. Mick the best load for my rifle is 40-50 grains of FFF black powder. Any more gives a noticable kick and just wastes powder when target shooting. Haven't tried pyrodex yet, I've been told that it doesn't work very well in flintlocks. You can get different thickness prelubed patches for round balls, they go from .005-.015 in thickness so you can go thinner if the ball is hard to ram down the barrel. Have fun |
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Title: Re: Ready Aim Fi. . Post by Wolfman on 03/23/11 at 02:11:02 Yeah i did'nt want to do an overload on info..lol An adjustable powder measure is a MUST for safety and accuracy. I like the brass style in 5 grain increments. Runs from 50 to 110 grains. Clear plastic is popular as well with shooters. Another thing is avoid the pyrodex pellets in caplocks. The rear pellet will partialy burn and spit the rest out as well as the bullet about 30 feet in front of you...lol #11 caps dont burn hot enough. Use loose BP or pyrodex. I like pyrodex better then BP myself. Slightly cleaner and safer then real black powder. My hunting load is 90 grains of pyrodex with a .50 cal 295 gr powerbelt. Either a hollow point or areotip(hollow point with a plastic tip that blows out when shot). Makes it eaiser to load, no deformed tip and still makes one he!! of a hole. DONT use a petroleum based product like regular gun oil in your bore! Its next to impossible to get out and will foul your powder. Hence the bore butter. It protects but is fairly easy to remove after storage. Run patches untill they look clean then fire off about 50 grs with only a heavy patch, no bullet. Also dont expect good accuracy out of a clean barrel. Fire off a couple of squib loads(no bullet, light powder) then run a couple of patches down the bore. THEN load and shoot for accuracy. Also if you run a patch or two every 4 or 5 shots your bullets will load a lot easier. I usualy run a damp spit patch and then a couple of dry patches every 5 shots or so. Ed, pyrodex works fine in a flintlock though you may want to use real BP for the flash pan. It WILL touch off slightly easier then pyrodex. IN the chamber though it works just fine though. Cant tell the differance. When you get serious about powder conservation and accuracy heres a tip. Grab a big white sheet and lay it out flat on the ground about 10 feet in front of where your muzzle ends. If your not getting a complete burn of the powder youll have unburnt powder show up on the sheet. Drop your powder weight 5 grains at a time untill the unburnt powder isnt showing up. Accuracy wise check your patches after their shot. Shoot 3 or 4 times then collect your patches. They wont be more then 10 or 15 feet in front of you. If their burnt through you need a thicker patch. If their just darkened and have rifleing marks your ok. You also dont NEED to use a patch for conicals, their base expands to cause a gas seal. If you do another mick and want a real old style 'blueing', use vinegar. The old timers(mountain men) would rub their barrel down with vinegar and set it in the corner. It develops a nice fine brown rust like patena on it. Let it set a few days them lightly clean it up with a very fine scratch pad or sand paper. Repeat the process untill you have the color you want. Then oil the outside down well and let it set a bit. |
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