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Message started by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 10:12:10

Title: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 10:12:10

Here are two new Savages that aren't motorcycles along with what fuels both of them and what fuels me (the coffee).

Everything gunnish is honest and to scale, and I won't fess about the other details until after you guess what the guns and calibers are.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF00078.JPG

This is the perspective shot that offers the delusions .....

============================

And here are the straight on shots showing same plane alignment of everything and the original Savage bolt handles which were replaced by the longer, much bigger knobbed stainless steel tactical bolt handles which aid in removal of stuck cases (try levering at a stuck case while laying horizontal on your belly in a timed event -- it ain't all that easy to do).

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF000310.JPG

And here is the over sized orange cat playing with the rounds and checking out the coffee cup to see if the cream content is to his liking or not ....

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF00067.JPG

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF001310.JPG

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/04/11 at 10:45:11

Oh my! One of them a 270??

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 10:48:17

Close, the smaller one is a 154 grain 7mm ...

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF000113.JPG

The cat is half main coon and I swear he is still growing as his rear end and rear feet seem to lead the parade and his front end and head catches up later on. I can still barely span his head with my hand to scratch his head, but that won't be true too much longer.

He still hasn't gotten his ear tufts yet, so he isn't fully mature by normal coon breed characteristics. His daddy may have been a tiger, who knows? We picked him up as a cute little bitty kitty from a neighbor whose female coon had gotten out for a romp.

My chair isn't small (nor am I) but he's about outgrown it.

This is a cat that smart dogs don't f**k around with .... they run up on him barking but reconsider when they get close and realize he's about as big as they are and he isn't even reacting to them. Then he'll lazily stretch full length and flex his claws and arch his back and they decide to leave about then. I've never seen him hisss and his yowl is something else (especially if he is inside).

Heck, his claws are now over an inch long and his fangs are over 3/4" long (last time I checked, anyway).

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/04/11 at 11:04:23

Ok, taller one looks too tall to be 30-06.... so come on, tell me...

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 11:23:30

It's not a belted magnum, does that help you any?

.... and the "coffee cup" is really a soup mug laying next to a tablespoon

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/04/11 at 11:38:15

Doesn't help. I was looking at the spoon, but I'm really just not good with ammo. I've tried to understand all the different units to measure them, but there are just too many for me. I could recognize a few of the normal sizes, but the off-the-wall stuff is just foreign to me. Why can't there just be a simple standard, like shoe sizes or something? Too many manufacturers, I guess.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by bill67 on 03/04/11 at 11:43:49

Did you shoot that cat to see if the guns work :(

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 11:52:53

No, I'm currently rubbing the cat just to see if my fingers work.

(his rumble purr seems to be working OK)

Yep, gun stuff is strange. The older stuff used to all be US/British inch based but all of the new stuff is always metric designated. Plus, a lot of EC countries have a law that says a person cannot own a military weapon (and that includes a military designated cartridge) so the stuff from Lapua for example is always strangely designated on purpose so they can sell it all over the world.

They will take a 338 bullet and stick it into a 416 Rigby case just to have something that nobody can lay claim to, then the military will pick up on it as being better ballistically than a 300 Winchester Magnum and then they start using it, then Lapua has to change something because the old round is now a military caliber.

Then you got them crazy wildcatters, who like to take large cases like the Remington Ultra Mag family and neck them up and down jest for the fun of it.

So, to play in the game requires a HEAVY 29" long bull barreled rifle just to get the rifle's weight up high enough so you can stand to shoot it.

And the tactical based game has to be played at a 5,000 yard range at a minimum if you are playing at mixed range long distance tactical, where they don't show you the wind flags until your next shot pops up and you have to laser it, dope your scope and 4 wind flags and shoot it all inside 3 minutes.

I am not a competitor (Fort Bragg has lots of real military professionals that do that part of the shooting game) but I am fascinated by the development of the long range stuff since that has all happened in the last 10 years or so and I like to go to the public shoots and watch them work it all out and send it inside 3 minutes.

I would be tickled to have me a good repeatable 600 yard rifle that could pick a deer off the far edge of a central NC soybean field with complete certainty. That used to be a fantasy to me, but is now becoming a routine commercial reality.

Give you a clue, in the Android Marketplace is the $9.99 app called SHOOTER that most of the shooters are using on their cell phones and tablets to make doping the scope a "laser it and punch it in" type calculation. Estimating the wind angles and speeds is the biggest unknown and hardest part of it any more ....

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by tcreeley on 03/04/11 at 13:04:51

I've got two of these - same look, cats I mean! Rocky + Ricky! ;)

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/04/11 at 13:14:11

Ok, but you still didn't tell me what the 2 guns in the picture are, dagnabit!!

Have you watched any of the History Channel show called "Top Shot"? I told my husband he could beat any of those guys. But I'd hate to have him gone from me long enough to try out for the show. I like watching the show thought. I was never interested in guns at all before meeting my current husband 8 years ago, so I'm learning slowly. But it is all interesting to me. And I agree the long range stuff is totally amazing!

(I have a Windows Phone 7, and hubby has an iPhone. Looked for Shooter app, but don't see it right away. iPhone probably has it.)

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 13:28:09

The two guns on the table are dual pillar bedded Savage rifles that started out stock and got modified some over a period of several years.

The smaller one (normal sized actually) is intended to be sling carried on walking hunts and the larger one has a sling so it can be toted over to a fixed vantage point where it and I will stay stationary until something walks out into a field and becomes binocular visible.

(durned if I want to carry it any further than I have to -- it's heavier than a 20 pound orange cat).

Here is an example of just such a shot ..... (BTW, these boys are much better than I will ever be)

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuQ7Kik3bNI&feature=related[/media]

Android market, app is called SHOOTER -- here is the link for review and sources for a side load.

http://sean.kndy.net/shooter/

Question: Should arrogant Washington politicians mebbe moderate their arrogance in public in light of what you just watched?

If they become objectionable enough to warrant individual pruning action, would 1) anybody even know where the shot came from and 2) since these rifles all started out as stock Savage and Remington long action rifles and all the bits and pieces are available from many internet sources could the stuff even be traced (assuming there was anything left of the bullet after going through the politician and blasting itself into dust against the concrete wall behind him).

Like I said, I'm not that good, but this stuff is becoming a friggin' televised sport now and lots of folks are pursuing it ....

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by mick on 03/04/11 at 13:45:12

you could at least put a doily under the coffee cup,or do you like rings on the table. I guess if you ask nicely we could all chip in and buy you a new chair for the cat,that ones a bit threadbare.
I won't mention the wet tea spoon.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 14:01:11

Cats are hard on chairs, it is true. Doilies don't exist in my world, sorry.

When the edge on the table gets frayed (yep, it happens over time) you rotate the table to put the worn edge against the wall.

When I sew the repair patch on to the chair I'll post a pic of what it looks like -- unless the hydraulic lift on the chair goes out first that is in which case I'll trash it.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/04/11 at 19:31:39

Thats one HUGE Cat,

I like gns, but Im not even almost fluent in them. The few I know, I know, most guns Ive never seen. Youve got a couple of fine ones there, but I would never be able to identify them. PIglet got a lot closer than I would have.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Ed L. on 03/04/11 at 19:55:16

Hey OF, have you ever played around with good ol black powder in a muzzle loader? I got a chance to blow some smoke out of a .54 caliber Hawkins last weekend. What a blast making tooth picks out of 2x4's at 50 yards. For long guns I have a Sedley Springfield 30-06 which was my dad's and a Remington BDL left handed 30-06 which I bought new back in the early '80s. You still haven't said what that big gun is, maybe a 300 Weatherby Mag?

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/04/11 at 21:15:55

Weatherby magnums always had a belt on the case, and you will note none of these modern large cartridges are belted. Headspacing off a belt doesn't work near as accurately as headspacing off the front shoulder of the case (and using cases that are neck sized only after being fired in your own gun's chamber so they are a custom snug fit).

But then you are likely gonna need a longer stronger bolt camming action to cam the case out after firing it once again on a moderately hot round ....

=================

My first pistol was a cap and ball Remington Italian copy. Still got it as a matter of fact. It was a blast to shoot at night (threw a cone of sparking smoke filled nasty that would night blind you it was so bright and showy). You could actually see the cylinder flash out past the barrel cylinder junction .... your hand was plumb buried in fire for an instant there buddy.

=================

No, all I've actually said so far in response to direct questions is that it isn't a belted magnum and the small one is tipped with a 154 grain 7mm bullet and fits into a standard sized rifle. Given that you should be able to figure out what the short one is and then use that to project a reasonable guess as to the bigger one.

Then again, few our age are real gun nuts any more -- although it seems to be a lot more popular among young people than you might think. They grew up with shoot'um up video games and when they hit 14-16 they started buying airsoft replicas and then they YouTube themselves doing head shots on deer and silly stuff like that when they hit 18 and can buy a real rifle and go hunting.

Gun culture seems to be doing fine -- there are far more guns, types of guns, pistols, etc now than there ever have been.

And it does seem to ring true the same ones also ride dirt bikes & mountain bikes when young, too. Guess what they become .... us

Women support pistol use quite a bit now (the great equalizer) and the largest indoor range and gun store in Raleigh NC is owned and run by a woman and has women only concealed carry classes where she teaches women how to (and when it is permitted to) pop the bastard instead of letting him rape you.

Go girls, go !!

;)

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/04/11 at 21:55:27

A friend had 45-70 rifle. He told me I could see the bullet as it flew away, IF Id stand behind him & shut my eyes till I heard the gun fire. ( We were in the road, in front of the car, at night, with the headlights on) He shot it & I opened my eyes & I could see that .45" lead turd lumbering away, That was fun..

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by stinger on 03/05/11 at 00:24:21

I have a 300 savage that was made in the 50's, and 2 Stayer Manlicher 30-06 sniper rifles with floating barrels and dual triggers and gas powered scopes. The 300 Savage is just as good a gun and still my favorite to shoot. Hardly kicks at all and you can drive nails at 150 yds.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/05/11 at 02:12:40

I too own a couple of Steyr rifles, but they are the M95s from before they got conglomerated in with Mannlicher. Not nearly as pretty as your guns.

Once diabetes kicked in good my left eye became noticeably better than my right, so I chose to accommodated the change with this rifle since I had to build the scope mount using a stock shotgun mount as a metal plus blank.

Turned out pretty good ... peek through the scope left eyed, work the straight pull action right handed.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/Steyr6.JPG

Cartridge is an old black power era case with LOTS & LOTS of modern capacity and it fires a mildly resized .338 bullet (resized down to .334" for my gun). Recoil can be as much as you care to withstand accordingly.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Wolfman on 03/05/11 at 07:56:49

Gun culture is doing ok but the hunting culture is'nt so hot. Last time i looked only 3 or 4 states even met or exceded replacement rates for new hunters.
In other words not enough young people were takeing up the sport to replace the older hunters who have left the sport through age, death ect.

In the last few years though more women have began to take up the sport, which makes up for some of the young males who don't due to video games ect. MO had about the best replacement rate but it was only 1.6. Most states were less then equal running .6 to .8 or so.

#1 sport for women was bow hunting followed by spring turkey(shotgun) then firearms deer hunting.
Each sex has advantages the other dosent have to an extent.
Males generaly do better in the more physical areas of the sport for one. Females generaly have more patiance then the males of the species.

One small note to the females looking to take up hunting or shooting. Find someone to teach you. Husbands, brothers and boyfriends make the WORST teachers. Less patiance then a stranger or instructor.
This has been proven over and over in studies.

Competetitive shooting has seen more women take up the sport in the last 10 years or so as well. Used to be primarily a male dominated sport. You used to NEVER see a women compete and if she did it was in a female only class years ago.
Now days some of them gals will SMOKE your arse if your not real carefull in competetitive shooting. Some of them are pretty good hunters as well. ;)

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/05/11 at 08:52:58

Pilot testing shows that women have better hand/eye coordination than men.

Historically, women pilots have better service records than men pilots in the same craft and runs.

If you play a girl in a computer shooter game that she likes, she'll wax your butt.

Given a rifle or pistol that fits her (and I mean both stock length, drop, weight and recoil) you had better watch out.

I have taught 2 women to shoot. My wife listened and did exactly what she was told and hit dead center on her first shot -- didn't like a pistol's recoil so she stopped after 3 dead center shots. She felt satisfied she could do it as it wasn't that hard. She was right.

My daughter as an 8-9 year old was given a .357 in a cross body draw holster with some very low level 38 special level reloads and she liked to play a walking game called "shoot the pine cone". I'd toss a random pine cone from behind her and she'd make it roll around some for a quick 6 shots. She got cocky and would sometimes take one while it was still in the air when the bouncing on the ground stuff got too tame. She was a good reflex shooter.

She currently owns a .40 S&W Glock that she likes because it shoots well for her.

God help the whacked out druggie that tries to mess with her family -- a pine cone is a lot smaller than his head is and she understands what constitutes a good shoot too. She also has 13 rounds instead of six, so his buddies can have some too.

Women should NOT be helpless or dependent on sometimes absent men to protect them. Women are much more situation-ally aware than men are generally speaking -- they can move to avoid most nasty messes but they do need to be willing and able to take care of the messes that still keep coming at them after they try to avoid them.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/05/11 at 10:57:34

I like watchin th women play pro level pool. They can Shoot some danged 9 ball..

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/05/11 at 23:06:38

Yeah, I like that brunette girl from Vegas -- she totally distracts all men she plays against every time she leans across the table to make a shot.

Beautiful smart women who can play pool really well -- what's not to like?

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/06/11 at 03:06:55

gettin beat?

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Wolfman on 03/06/11 at 09:20:23

Ive seen some studies said women had better eye hand coordination and some that did'nt.
In 'General' a larger percentage of women have better eye hand coordination then most men. Its not a blanket rule. Theres a lot of men just as good or better then most women.
One easy test is the old pegboard speed test. Set em down at a table with a pegboard and time em as they stick pegs in the board in order. Most women will beat most men but not all. Runs about 8-2 on average.

I shot competitively for many years, mostly long range big bore pistol wiht some big bore rifle and small bore as well.
Taught hunter safety and firearms instruction for over 15 years as well for a state agency. Id whole lot rather teach a woman then a man....they LISTEN! Kids are a lot of fun as well.
Taught at some women in the outdoors events for the NWTF for a few years as well. Those were fun.
Many women had never held a gun let alone shot one but they picked up the basics pretty fast. Same way with archery.

Outdoor cooking and fly fishing were popular but black powder shooting really got a crowd usualy. Clay bird shooting was always real popular as well. Once they got over their fear of recoil and the BOOM they took to shooting like pigs to mud.
But for gods sake dont EVER bring a 6 foot rat snake into a pavillion unannounced wrapped around your arm. ;D
When they first see it its like haveing a bunch of deer caught in the headlights, heads raised,big eyes and ready to bolt...lol
When your the only guy among 20 women you also learn what a soup bone in a dog pound feels like...rofl I miss those days. ;D

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/06/11 at 13:56:17

here's a couple mo savages - a .17hmr and a '06

keep waiting to burn out the factory barrel on the '06 so I can
replace it - but it still hits under a moa if I'll do my part after a 1k
rounds or so and of course the 17hmr shoots the eyeballs out of a fly
in the right hands

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i433/Reel_thing/sav3006-1.jpg

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i433/Reel_thing/sav17-1.jpg

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 00:56:37

Now there are a couple of Savages that are typical of the breed.

They shoot good from stock and they have been tweeked some by the owner to make them even better.

Choate stock on the '06? (That third leg in the back kinda gives it away)

What sort of hand loads do you use in the '06?

============================

Speaking of bullets, Hornady built some OEM cannalured Interbonds for an OEM that apparently rejected the shipments -- Hornady then eventually sold the custom cannalured stuff to Midsouth who put them out as "nameless blems" for half the normal price.

http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/blem_bullets.asp

You click on the picture of the bullets to go to the page that lists the bullets still remaining on sale.

Now these half price blems are on sale for the next 2 weeks -- check it out and buy a few bags of a very durn good hunting bullet at a very good price.

Both of my rounds are tipped with some of these blem Interbond bullets.

(this is a hint, BabyHog)

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzDSM0RcCWg&feature=player_embedded[/media]

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Wolfman on 03/07/11 at 02:10:37

Speaking of bullets....
Most folks know polishing the chamber and crowning the muzzle helps accuracy.
What a lot don't know or relize is the variance in weights of even good match grade bullets.
Most will vary +/- 2 1/2 grains or more. This dosent bother most folks hunting but long range shooting it can cause problems, especialy when you work in the variances in brass, powder and primer burn rates.

Trick many of us used to do is weigh each and every bullet and try to stay within +/- 1 grain. Even buying match kings and buying all our bullets from the same lot.
Did the same on brass, powder and primers.
Different powder and primers from the same manufacturer will vary burn rates slightly with each different lot number. Buy bulk from the same lot number.
Same with primers. Different brands will vary more.
Brass wise we always bought from the same manfacturing facility by checking the headstamp markings. Wall Thickness will vary slightly from each brass facility changeing internal pressure a bit.
Federal for example used to have 3 different brass manufactureing facilities that manufactured all their brass.
Keep in mind military brass is thicker then civilian brass as well. Enough so to need to drop your powder weights by 2-3 grains anyway.
Or risk head seperation or split cases.
Tie em all together and you wont notice much at a 100 yards but 200 and beyond you will, especialy with any kind of a crosswind.

Some even used a micrometer to check seating depth on each and every bullet to the thousandth of an inch.
I usualy eyeballed em good and checked about 1 in 5 myself.
Them lil cheap fiber board nail files work real well to touch up them bullet points after seating.
One other lil trick was leave off the smokes, caffinated pop and coffee/tea for at least 15 minutes before going on the shooting line.
Nicotine from the smokes will make your nerves have tiny lil misfires, twitchs. Caffine is almost as bad.

Any of you guys/gals shooting a .204?

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 02:55:06

Not me, I tended to use a 6.5 or now-a-days a 7mm for shooting at them little varmint types.

Went prairie dogging once when I lived in Wichita Kansas and they got after me for "not doing it right".

I was shooting a 6.5x55 Swede and I was using 120 grain hunting bullets that I had already loaded, so to try to get the red mist and the flying pop up to show properly I was aiming low and sending the round through part of the lip of the hill to get the bullet all fully expanded before hitting the rodent's lower half, blowing him up out of the hill like a ballistic missile launch (a huge blast of dust, with the rodent top half departing vertically, very visibly arching out over the dog town trailing dust after it).

I was "ruining the dogtown" and I wasn't asked back again ....

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/07/11 at 06:03:03

That was funny, ,,

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 08:41:46

Kel, what do you think about it?

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by kel30734 on 03/07/11 at 08:42:47

Lets see.....
Here is what I got.
1961 J.C. Higgins .22 cal with Crome Bolt and Trigger

2009 Savage MRK2 .22 cal with Bull barrel and the Accutrigger and 3-7X32 with Scope Can knock the Hair Off a gnat @ 100Yds Left handed Bolt

Unknown year Chinese SKS 7.62X39

Unknown Year Mosin-Nagat 7.62X54r (Model 1891)

Jennings .25Cal Pocket Pistol

Rexio 9 shot .22Cal Revolver

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by kel30734 on 03/07/11 at 08:47:37

5F7C7476757C7C7562100 wrote:

Kel, what do you think about it?

.270 just an unedgimacated Guess

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 08:57:48

Which one, the little one? I already said the smaller cartridge is carrying a 154 grain 7mm Interbond on the end of it.

270's topped out at 150 grains and they were .005" smaller diameter than the 7mm slug.

===============================

Now, how's about Reelthing's '06 ?

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i433/Reel_thing/sav3006-1.jpg

Me, I think it looks sorta like a short action Savage, mebbie more of a .308 Winchester cartridge instead of a 30-06 jest from looking at it closely.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/07/11 at 11:06:08

OF, nice story of teaching your wife and daughter to shoot. How old is your daughter now? I wouldn't mess with her if she can skip pine cones. LOL

I did get to shoot my hubby's KelTec PF9 a couple of weekends ago. We sat a red plastic cup at about 35-40 yards, I lined it up, fired once, hit the cup square, and handed it back to him. He said 'shoot some more'. I said no, its lined up just fine!

I'm still debating what to do about my Savage. The stock is a little long for me, and the recoil pad is pretty thick. Its synthetic, so I really don't want to shave the stock down. I'd love to find a different recoil pad, but haven't found any to fit it. Don't want to use a slip-on. Its made different than standard. It slides up into the stock and clicks in. I'll try to remember to take a pic tonight. You might be able to help me. Since it doesn't kick much, I'm considering shaving off the recoil pad, to give me about another inch relief. I think I could get the OEM replacement if it ever became necessary (like if I ever decided to sell the gun, but I don't foresee that!) Otherwise, I don't know what else to do....

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/07/11 at 16:30:55

7350585A595050594E3C0 wrote:

I'll let some body else chamber a .308 in here and pull the trigger I'm not gonna!

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i433/Reel_thing/bolt06.jpg

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/07/11 at 16:33:31

your round a 7mm-08?

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Wolfman on 03/07/11 at 17:46:23

Piglet, buy a replacement pad and shave it down on a belt sander to fit.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 18:18:58

Wheeeee !!! WE GOT A WINNER !!!

Realthing wins the little rifle contest !!! 7mm-08 it is, a Savage Stevens to be exact. Mods include increased case cam out ability by means of a large knob longer tactical bolt handle, refinished stock with action bedding, and one stock trigger completely reworked and a very light crown job to remove pushed in burrs left over from the factory crowning cuts.

Here is the whole story behind the rifle, as posted on the "other" gun nut site.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=2735&highlight=Savage+Stevens

Now Reelthing, your rear scope mount was an eyeball fooler when seen from the other side of the gun, it made the action seem shorter when it is not. My bad.

;D

Now, who is gonna finish off the second rifle, since you have more than enough clues now (surely you do .... really)

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 19:10:47

BabyHog, a pic of your pad and stock with the pad on and off would help.

There have been too many different stocks used on Savage rifles to make any advice "wise" until we have seen what you are really dealing with.

Next, a stray thought. Is the stock too long or are you having to crane your neck forward because the scope doesn't go back far enough? (you have to struggle to get forward enough to get the scope rear bell window to fill up properly)

I have faced and beaten both, but they are different animals ....

Daughter is 28 now and designs big construction cranes for a living.

She are an engineer ....

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/07/11 at 20:22:06

So do I win the rifle?

anyway on the '06 i've only put factory rounds through it - settled on the black hills gold 168 a-max - bought a good many on sale/over stocked or some such a while back - group well

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 20:44:34

Heck no, just the joy of knowing you solved the puzzlement.

;)

Now, impress us all again and figure out the big rifle

=============================

A-max gets kudos for target shooting and the looooonnnnnggg range boys sometimes use them to shoot game animals at amazingly long distances, knowing by the time the little hand grenades get all the way out to the deer they have slowed way down, slow enough not to be so durn explosive.

Plus, they are shooting very heavy for the caliber very high BC bullets that don't totally evaporate anyway, the broken pieces weigh enough to dead a deer even though they aren't in the jacket any more.

Same folks used to use Sierra MatchKings to do the same duty, but they like the poly tipped A-Max for the higher BCs that they offer. Plus the A-Max always opens up because of the poly tip, them all metal Sierra MatchKing itty bitty hollow points sometimes penciled on through without opening up when hair & skin plugged up the little hollow point solid.

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In the past 5 years powders and bullets have taken a quantum leap forward. Plus, there has been a LOT of consolidation in both industries.

Right now IMR, Winchester and Hodgon are ONE POWDER COMPANY -- that is all your American suppliers conglomerated together. Powder is not made in the USA any more, some comes from Canada, most actually comes from Scandinavia and the old Soviet republics.

Hodgon has developed new spherical powders using the all the way through the powder grain deterrent techniques taken from Swedish powder makers. They also CUSTOM MIX different rates of very small spherical powders to make up a dense 100% case filling compressed charge that makes a very broad even pressure curve that maxes out at just the right max pressure for the exact cartridge.

Because of this, built to fit Hodgon powder can turn a 30-06 into 300 Win Mag performance-wise.

At the same time bullets have gotten far far better. Hornady is the main driver here -- they have begun making bonded bullets that are better performers than Nosler accubonds and they have begun making monolithic gilding metal "X" bullets that easily outperform Barnes X bullets. You will hear about them as Interbonds and GMX bullets --- but the main point is that a 30-30 using a GMX bullet can kill an elk. And they can sell a bonded bullet that can go to Africa and kill everything but the elephant out of a 30-06 at the old 30-06 velocities (wasn't allowed to shoot anything less than a 416 Rigby at an elephant by African laws)

Question becomes -- do you really need a magnum any more?

Long range target shooters are all using the new super BC heavy 6.5 bullets to win now, not 30 caliber and not 7mm. Guess what, the 140 grain and 160 grain 6.5 super hunting bullets available now can kill anything on 4 feet (except elephants and that is only because of the old legal restrictions) at ridiculous distances. The 260 Remington and the 6.5 Creedmore are taking over the long distance target shooting sports very fast now. 6 and 6.5 BR are taking over benchrest wholesale, no point in bringing a .308 to the match any more.

These same guns can kill deer at those same very long distances ....

And they don't kick your shoulder off either. Getting your shoulder kicked is becoming passe very quickly in all the shooting sports.

http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/

Click on target rifles, then long range precision rifles and the pure open match rifles -- you no longer even see the .308 listed any more except in the military Palma match classes where it is required.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/07/11 at 22:47:26

The beltless larger round just doesn't look like anything exotic to my eyes - and since the 7mm-08 is really a .308 with a 7mm neck the round is the same length so the larger round looks to be a .30-06 size round could be a tad longer just can't tell - could be a .280 rem or something

the rifle looks like a bull barrel'd savage 110 can't see if it has a accu-trig or not - doubt it if it's an older buildup.

it's a 30-06

my guess

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 23:00:48

He's winner -- 2 for 2

It is a long bull barreled 30-06 that started out life as a Police SWAT rifle that couldn't sell because everyone wanted a .308 short bull barrel SWAT rifle. Bought it brand new (unfired and 2 years discontinued) for dirt cheap.

Using modern powders and bullets and the Shooter program on an android tablet there is nothing that you can see from where ever you are that this rifle cannot drop a 165 grain Interbond into (and kill handily).

Yup, has the accutrigger and that year's accustock, has all the goodies that the Police line had to offer at that point in time.

And because it weighs so durn much it doesn't kick very much at all.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/07/11 at 23:05:21

Certainly is rapid devlopment is rounds for sure - some pretty high pressures - certainly blow apart older chambers - on the little side - rim fire - the .17hmr just are not being beat any longer where they are
allowed

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/07/11 at 23:16:00

Hodgon swears the superperformance stuff adheres to SAAMI maximum chamber pressures for each cartridge, the stuff works by keeping the pressure up at maximum a lot longer than powders used to be able to do. No sharp pressure peaks, a broad hump instead.

You use all of the barrel length much more efficiently with the new powders, so longer barrels give you even greater speeds than they used to.

This has been verified by folks with pressure transducer rigs on their Ohler 35 chronographs. It is real and it really works.

What amazes me is the new superperformance powders don't react to hot weather like IMR powders used to do.

It really is new and better.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Reelthing on 03/07/11 at 23:23:33

interesting list of rifles for savage this year - wonder if walmart can/will still order all for cheap!

you know the 6.5 all seem a bit exotic to me - rather interesting the .243 is being made - but I guess nothing anymore exotic than
these little .17hmr cci tnt exploding rounds

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/08/11 at 07:15:39

Walmart still sells guns in some states, but they no longer do in mine.

Shame that -- but change is everything.

Savage Stevens are still sold, but they are not the low end Savage any more, the Savage Axis is the low end gun. It gets good reviews, BTW.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/09/11 at 05:46:21

65464E4C4F46464F582A0 wrote:

Ok, here's my Savage Edge .223. (Which I think they are now calling the Axis, not sure what they changed, or if they changed anything) I'm extremely happy with it, being my first rifle.

In answer to your questions, I do have trouble getting close enough to the scope. We tried several different mounts/rings, etc, tried a couple different scopes (I love the current one, so changing it is not an option) and we can't adjust it back any further. There might be another ring setup that would work, but that will just cost me more money.... I haven't shot without the pad, but I seem to get better positioning without it, which is why I figure I'll just trim it down. Just scared to make that first cut... All tips and suggestions are welcomed... "Just do it!"

http://i757.photobucket.com/albums/xx211/babyhog/stuff/WP_000164.jpg

http://i757.photobucket.com/albums/xx211/babyhog/stuff/WP_000156.jpg

http://i757.photobucket.com/albums/xx211/babyhog/stuff/WP_000161.jpg

http://i757.photobucket.com/albums/xx211/babyhog/stuff/WP_000160.jpg

http://i757.photobucket.com/albums/xx211/babyhog/stuff/WP_000159.jpg

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/09/11 at 07:20:30

Savage Edge only had one action length and that was enough for a full length cartridge. I bet you don't have to stroke the action all the way back for a .223, now do you? Point being, it's a long action type action. It is like my bigger rifle as far as putting a scope on it goes.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF000114.JPG

This is the back view of 2 rifles with the butt plate set up equal. The two stock's length and drop are the same -- but the scopes are not.

You will notice below that both scopes are backed up all the way that they can go with the front ring hitting the front bell (I have neck and shoulder problems and I need an "upright" head position as I cannot "get down into the scope" any more at all.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF00068.JPG

How do my scopes manage to work and get back far enough for me to use? The big scope is a foot and a half long (gives lots of reach back and you notice that I use it all -- with keeping 3.5 inches of eye relief at max magnification as I don't like scope brow bruises or cuts when using the high magnifications (been there, done that -- it hurts and it really messes up a set of glasses).

It also has a rubber lip on the eye bell as somebody got whacked by it and they changed the eye bell to make it more brow whacking friendly.

The little scope on the little gun has extended eye relief (nearly six inches worth, with 4 inches remaining at highest magnification). It is a cheap Simmons scope and I have two of them so one can be getting fixed for $10 while the other one does rifle duty. Not the best scope in the world, but it has independently focusable front and end bells which my poor old eyes require. You can buy these long eye relief Simmons cheapie scopes for less than $50 on the internet.

Me, I'd change the scope again to a long eye relief model -- or I would look for a Weaver mount that would let you move the front ring back over the action some. I hate the way that "hanging out over the action" stuff looks though, so I'd go the bigger scope route (or an extended eye relief scope if you wanted the scope to be all short and neat looking).

Shotgun scopes as a class all have extended eye relief and they tend to be small and neat looking scopes. Lots of longer main rifle scopes have very long eye relief (all the Simmons scopes do).

As you have learned from taking it apart, your first thought of shortening the stock turns into a bit of kerfluffle as the tapered plastic and rubber parts all fit together at the stock length and nowhere else.

You can cut the plastic stock and epoxy a normal butt plate on to the gun, or cut all the stuff off your existing plate, sand the inside flat and epoxy that on to the cut off stock (after trimming the OD profile back to fit the cut off stock). Lotsa lotsa work, that.

You could buy (or swap for) a youth stock, which is available for your gun. Bet it doesn't feel right for your adult body -- go to a gun store and try one out for feel as it costs nothing and answers your question on youth stocks for you right quick like.

Good luck with your choices, but remember your problem isn't the stock -- it is really the scope and mount position.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/09/11 at 07:32:39

Well, thanks. I wish I had taken a pic with the scope on. It has variable-intensity red or green lighted reticle. I don't think I'd find a scope I like any better, so I may do some more searching for different mounts. Maybe I'll try shooting it without the pad (temporarily attach a thinner one in its place) and see if that helps before chopping into the original pad.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by Oldfeller on 03/09/11 at 07:38:55

Go to the gun store and measure and try out a youth stock. If it works good for you, you know how much to saw off the plastic stock on your gun.

A belt sander could reduce the tapered inner part on your existing butt plate to fit the reduced taper on the cut off stock.

Then the butt plate would overhang the cut off stock a little bit, but it would look consistent and "on purpose" since it would be all even looking.

Title: Re: Two new Savages for BabyHog and Justin
Post by babyhog on 03/09/11 at 09:05:22

I'm not cutting the stock. Just the recoil pad. I think that extra inch will do it.... ;)