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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1283045653 Message started by Johansson on 08/28/10 at 18:34:13 |
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Title: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/28/10 at 18:34:13 Hi, I go by Chuck. Live near Dallas, Tx. Bought a savage, 97, 12,000 miles. After 30 years, I put my harley up on the stand. The gas tank had a dent or two. Was starting to rust inside. The oil lines need replacing. Might as well paint her, go through the motor a little. The harley runs fine, just think with about 130k on the motor, I should go through it. So, I needed a bike so I can still commute. Always liked the thumper. Found the above bike, just the ticket. Looked her over real well, good clean bike, needed new tires. Got her home, took the side cover off, someone had been there before me. I fixed it, did the versy fix. The dyna muffler, I discovered, was held on with three sheet metal zip screws. The muffler support bracket had been cut off with a hacksaw. Only the two header bolts held the whole exhaust up. Welded a new bracket on, tigged the old muffler to the header. The tab on the motor for the clutch cable was broke off, fixed that too. Previous owner had punched out a harley muffler. Bike sounded like nuts. Ran like nuts. Cut the muffler off, tigged a heritage softtail muffler on. Purrs like a kitten. Runs great. In fact, the savage runs extremly well. Has grown on me. I like it. A lot. Drove her like this for about 2500 miles. Had a little oil seepage aroung the jug in two spots. Felt I should torque the head. Took the seat off. Both seat bolts stripped. Took the tank off. Both tank bolts stripped. Son of a pregnant dog, same idiot who put the muffler on was in here. Oh well. Started to take the valve cover off. darn, three bolts are wrong, between 5 and 10 mm too short. Then, the 115 mm valve cover bolt. Stripped! Buttoned her right back up, did not attempt to remove the cover. Drove her about a week. On the way to work the last week, massive oil leak. Lost a qaurt in 9 miles. Took the valve cover off this time. The head plug looks like it is sealed and tight. I am working on my other bike, really do not want to pull the savage motor to fix that thread for the 115 mm bolt. I am thinking a sliver of wood, blue loctite, down that hole,may buy me a few months until I get the harley on the road again. Any one else have a suggestion? This is a great site for savage owners. Will post some pictures when the forum software allows. chuck |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/28/10 at 18:37:53 http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/38659_1561535644020_1404195253_31469987_3296094_n.jpg http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0183.jpg |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/28/10 at 18:39:35 well, I don't know how to post pictures from photo bucket so that they will show. I don't have pictures of the savage, just a few of the harley. http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0193.jpg http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0195.jpg http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0196.jpg chuck |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/28/10 at 19:37:42 so, the harley is on the stand, the savage is down, I am down to my last bike http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/IMG_0220uncchuck.jpg Just not gonna cut it. Some pictures of my tank repair. Left side, before http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/002.jpg Right side, before http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0022.jpg the tools, just some rod bent to access the dents through the filler neck http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0007.jpg The rust http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0014.jpg Left side, after http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0018.jpg http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0004.jpg http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0001.jpg Right side, after http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx174/echuckj5/fxrs/ASC_0019.jpg I have since stripped the tank of all paint. I will electrically remove the rust with a battery charger, tank of water and washing soda. After that, I will fill the tank with a large handfull of small steel washers and put the tank in a dryer along with several blankets to tumble and polish the inside. Then the kream sealant goes in. Then I'll paint the tank, along with the fenders. chuck |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by ralfyguy on 08/28/10 at 22:07:35 Dang that's alot of rust coming out of that tank! :o :o :o |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by ralfyguy on 08/28/10 at 22:14:13 I have one stripped head cover bolt. The long M4 or M5 one all the way on the right side. Got it out, cleaned the bolt, got the green Loctite and put a fair amount on the bolt and in the hole. Then tightened what was left to torque, let it set for a while and fired her up to let it get hot. Won't move anymore by itself. That long thin bolt doesn't hold much anyways. I have no doubt that won't make a difference. In my opinion if those long bolts are supposed to hold a lot, then they should be larger in diameter. It's been like this since several thousand miles and no leaks or anything. They could have left it off, and it wouldn't matter. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by LANCER on 08/29/10 at 03:41:45 the long right rear bolt on the head sets in an oil passageway to the head and strips fairly easily. using a bolt that is a little longer or a long stud with nuts on top will access the lower threads down in the hole ....the standard length bolt does not use all of the available threads so going longer will give more threads to get a good bite on when I had the engine apart I drilled and installed the steel threads on the engine case for all the long bolts I also cut a little metal off the top of the head cover for that right rear bolt so it would go deeper into the lower threads. be sure to use those special black "sealing" washers on the bolts that go through the oils passageways just an added note; I just removed a head yesterday from an engine and the "oil plug" in the head was just sitting there the head had never been off before so when assembled at the factory they person doing the assembly DID NOT USE SEALANT/ADHESIVE on the plug ...it was just pushed down with the fingers...I just picked it up with my fingers ...no pressure at all I had never seen that before on any engine |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/29/10 at 08:15:17 Good job guys, I never would have thought of a longer bolt or stud. I did not want to put it back together with a baling wire fix. Spent the last week cursing the fool who previously worked on the bike. The savage is at my brothers house in a neighboring town. The closest place to park it coming home from work with oil pouring out of the motor. The head plug does have sealant on it. Probably is the source of the leak. I will replace the head plug. I will also order a new camshaft plug and that oil o-ring seal before I install the cover. Will have to find the correct bolts for the 2 that are short too. Guess I might as well replace the three sealing washers too. I thank you guys for all the help I found here. Has made working on this bike a pleasure. Lot easier. I have fixed the camshaft adjuster, the versy fix speedometer rattle, the oldfeller fix headlight rattle, again, oldfeller harley exhaust, tuned the carb, many contributers here seat mod lift These simple repairs have made a finely tuned machine that is a pleasure to drive. Now, I have just one more area to improve. The steering and suspension. The bike had a pretty good pull to the side while driving. The drive belt tracks perfectly on the front and rear pulleys, took me awhile to get it to this level. I noticed that the handlebars were not quite lined up with the front wheel. I loosened the tripletree fork bolts and lined up the two front tubes by eye to what seemed parallel. This improved the pull, took probably 80% of the pull away. Is there a proper way to align the fork tubes? I weigh 220 lbs. With the rear shocks set on 1 or 2 the handling is pretty bad at 65 mph. The bike wanders. At 4 or 5 she tracks better, but the ride is bone jarring. I run the shocks at the 3 position, about the best for comfort and tracking combined. Is there a better rear shock? I typed fork oil into the search, not much help. Is there a thread to fork oil here? I would like to change my fork oil soon. seems like a pretty wide variation of suggested weights. From 5 weight to 20 weight. Chuck |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by ralfyguy on 08/29/10 at 08:16:37 My bolt is the long one on the right side just in front of the cam plug. This one didn't have a washer underneath. I don't know if it should have one. I looked at it closely and it still doesn't make much sense to me for the bolt to even have to be there. Considering the long length and the small diameter screwed into aluminum is kinda hideous. I am not trying to be superior to Suzuki engineers, but as a machinist it just kinda makes me shake my head. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by ralfyguy on 08/29/10 at 08:21:54 4B4D465B4D45441B2E0 wrote:
Actually there is really nothing to align. If I try to picture what you are trying to explain, it sounds to me like the fork tubes are bent. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by verslagen1 on 08/29/10 at 08:42:12 5C4F424857495B572E0 wrote:
Actually there is really nothing to align. If I try to picture what you are trying to explain, it sounds to me like the fork tubes are bent.[/quote] Right there's nothing to align... except the forks can be tweaked in the trees. And yes, it's possible the forks are bent. To check for this, I'd remove the wheel, loosen one fork in the tree, and turn the tube around in the tree, looking and the axle end for wobble. Then tighten up that side and repeat for the other. If you can get the wobbles either straight forward or back then it shouldn't pull at all. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/29/10 at 09:22:58 The fork tubes don't visually look bent. I checked this very closely by eye. Spinning the tube should let me know if a tube is bent. Never thought of checking tube run out. I think the triple trees just are'nt perfectly aligned to each other. Remember, someone with no mechanical ability worked on this bike before me. Assuming the forks are not bent. Take the front wheel off. Loosen the steering head bolt a little. Loosen the triple tree pinch bolts on the tubes. Carefully retighten everything and the forks should parallel themselves? Chuck |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by verslagen1 on 08/29/10 at 09:26:15 yeah, I would think so. I'd take time to inspect and clean the mating surfaces. cinch down the top cap 1st then the bottom pinch bolts. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by ralfyguy on 08/29/10 at 09:38:42 I know mine are bent back about 5 degrees. I suspect that the fact that the previous owner had a teenage son, and he occasionally let him drive it around the yard, that he hit something, maybe the garage wall. But the bike wasn't laid down. I bought it like that and knew it when I bought it three years and 10,000 miles ago. I never touched the forks as it runs perfectly straight and no wobbles. I even tried it at about 90mph one handed and there's no pull or wobble at all. I never replaced it because those forks are expensive, even just the upper tubes. And I don't have the courage to take them apart either. Especially since I am very restricted in terms of tools and such. I don't even have a bike lift or a work bench with a vise. Actually I even like how the bike handles like that. I like it when it seems to fall into the corners by itself. It has almost no understeer at all when pushed, unlike cruisers usually seem to have with a extended rake. It behaves more like a sports bike in corners, yet cruises just fine when riding relaxed on the highway. I don't wanna change that. It is amazing how I can flick it into a sharp turn with just a push of my knee and just a little handle bar input. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by verslagen1 on 08/29/10 at 09:40:36 One thing to do while you got it all apart... clean and pack the stem bearings. mine where so gummed up then it wobbled down the freeway cause I couldn't balance the bike. |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 08/29/10 at 11:32:40 Yea, I'll repack those headset bearings. I have had the savage since March. It is stored outdoors mostly. I have oiled the cables a couple of times. On the harley and my 1982 virago 920 I replaced the headset bearings with tapered bearings. Helped the virago a lot. I need to get to work on the savage. I feel I am heading in the correct direction now, give me a couple of weekends to get all the bolts in and the other supplies. I'll get back with you. Many Thanks to all of you for great advice, Chuck |
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Title: Re: Stripped head cover bolt, the 115 mm one. Post by Johansson on 09/06/10 at 19:15:35 I took the day off yesterday, worked on the savage. Torqued the head bolts. Man, were they tight. Way tight. Thought they would snap, as tight as they were. Did em one at a time, oiled em, per Old Feller's thinking. Get to the front one, by the exhaust. Loose, came right off. Now the rear one, pretty loose. Threaded it off with my fingers, the stud came out. With the nut. Should have been looking. Took two hours to get that stud back up there. Thank god it was just stripped the first couple of threads. Rechecked all the torques, all good. Measured the head cover bolts. Previous owner had the 130 in the 125 hole. The 125 hole was stripped to. So, I put the 125 in the 115 hole, snugged right down. Put the 130 in the 130 hole, snugged right down. The 125 hole is completely stripped, even the stud spins. No hope for that hole. Will have to be fixed later. Previous owner had mixed up the bolts to some of the other holes too. I was able to fix them with a tap. Got lucky there. Adjusted the valves, buttoned her right up again. runs fine. I will have to glue that stud in the 125 hole. Hate to do it, may not come out. Will try a little blue loctite, with a sliver of delran, delrin, see if that works. Well, it's nice to have it on the road again, Oh, ordered the 6 mm threaded rod from fastenal, did not come in yet. One of my hammer drills has a depth gage. Which consists of a rod. Just happened to measure 6 mm. Tapped it, cut it to the right length first. Got tired of waiting on fastenal. My brother, He is not mechanical. Has a Harbor Freight tools right near him. He is now the proud owner of a nice socket set, really. I bought that 60 dollar tap set, at Harbor Freight, it will work, for him. Oh, He got a few other tools too. I set up his garage pretty good. Old craftsman roll around, among other things. Thanks for all the advice, made the job a lot easier. chuck |
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