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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Grinding when shifting /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1275360465 Message started by PBLover on 05/31/10 at 19:47:45 |
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Title: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 05/31/10 at 19:47:45 Here's the problem: If I try to shift either down to first gear or up to second gear from neutral when bike is moving, I hear and feel a grinding noise, like the gears are grinding. Also, when stopped, I have an occasional problem shifting down in to first gear to take off. Does this sound more like a gear problem or clutch problem? By the way...it's not just me because I had someone else ride the bike today and it did the same thing for them and they have been riding for many years and lots of different bikes. Any thoughts or ideas of what the problem might be? |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by Skid Mark on 05/31/10 at 19:52:56 Its a deal at $200. Get it running and its a steal of a deal!!! |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by ralfyguy on 05/31/10 at 20:05:27 Mine does the same since 9,000 miles. Mine is a '06 with 12,000 miles on it. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by BurnPgh on 05/31/10 at 20:05:59 I never shift into nuetral while moving so I cant say as far as shifting out of nuetral while moving but as far as the hard shift when stopped...sometimes I get a nice clunk shifting down to first from neutral. You can try a few things...let the bike roll forward a few inches as you shift into first, squeeze the clutch 2 or 3 times before you shift, or blip the thorttle just a bit before you shift. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by WD on 05/31/10 at 20:17:51 How is your clutch free play at the lever? I'd guess excessive. Start by tightening up your clutch cable a bit. My 98 was the same way until the factory cable quit stretching. And if you are running a 10W40 oil, switch to 15W40. And don't run Actevo bike oil in any grade, that thin garbage will destroy your clutch. My 98 doesn't shift worth a darn if I screw up and run anything lighter than 15W40, and prefers 20W50. I see the language nanny is still enabled... :-X |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 05/31/10 at 20:26:44 083F38241A2D224A0 wrote:
Wish I could just shift it into first when stopped consistently. My problem is not being able to shift it into first when stopped, at least not consistently. When it does shift, there is the nice clunck sound, but sometimes it simply won't shift without rolling the bike. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 05/31/10 at 20:27:46 594A0E0 wrote:
Freeplay is quite the opposite, virtually none. Tonight I adjusted it so there is some play, took it for a ride and nothing changed. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by BurnPgh on 05/31/10 at 20:36:30 Likely, the cause, is that the shift linkage at the engine is off a spline or two, but I dont know if moving it clockwise or counter clockwise is correct. And its a PITA to move it just one or two splines. Then again, not correctly adjusting it puts more stress on the linkage rod and a few members have had theirs suddenly break. Thinking more about it...shifting from neutral while moving...the gears are synchronized (IIRC) to aid in smooth shifting from gear to gear. Being in neutral you arent in any gear at all really. It might just be that you need to be more careful about matching engine rpms with road speed when you shift. edit - there should be 3-5mm of free play between the clutch lever and the lever housing |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by BurnPgh on 05/31/10 at 20:42:40 1433353D2F560 wrote:
Wish I could just shift it into first when stopped consistently. My problem is not being able to shift it into first when stopped, at least not consistently. When it does shift, there is the nice clunck sound, but sometimes it simply won't shift without rolling the bike.[/quote] If its that bad move the shifter linkage a couple splines. Is it only shifting into first or is shifting down in general difficult? Mark where you're at now so you know how far you've gone after you adjust. Im going to geuss counterclockwise is correct. Verslagen knows for sure. Maybe he'll chime in. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 05/31/10 at 20:47:27 [/quote]Is it only shifting into first or is shifting down in general difficult? Mark where you're at now so you know how far you've gone after you adjust. Im going to geuss counterclockwise is correct. Verslagen knows for sure. Maybe he'll chime in.[/quote] It's when shifting down in to first or back up in to second from neutral. Shifting up and down from or in to 3,4,5 smooth as can be. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/31/10 at 21:16:58 If you are sitting in neutral w/ clutch pulled in, the tranny stops spinning. Let the clutch out to the first part of the friction zone, pull it back & gentloy step on the shifter. You should probably be in first at that stop,....aimed at a safe "OUT", wAtching the mirrors..ready to get outta the way.. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by verslagen1 on 05/31/10 at 22:41:36 You can try one spline on the shifter, if you are having trouble shifting up go down one spline and vice versa. But I think you are having a clutch issue. check the marks on the case for starters digger may chime in I think he's adjusted his or OF with bike off, in gear and clutch in... is it hard to push around? then you need to put in the longer clutch rod. what's happening is the clutch never completely disengages, so your tranny is always loaded. best work around till you get it fixed is always shift while moving. apply pressure to the shifter, don't stomp on it, that'll bend the dogs. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by Serowbot on 05/31/10 at 22:59:27 Bike tranny's are different than cars,... They don't like to shift when not rolling... It's normal... If it won't go into gear at a stop,... release the clutch and pull it in again... then it will work easy... ;)... |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 06/01/10 at 12:00:43 4A594E4F505D5B59520D3C0 wrote:
I will try adjusting one spline on shifter this afternoon after work. Also, you asked is it hard to push around...yes, it can be almost impossible even with the clutch pulled in. To answer Serowbot, I've tried many many times to double clutch at stops with no luck. Bike has to be rolled forward or backward before it will shift down in to first. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by verslagen1 on 06/01/10 at 12:02:59 1F383E36245D0 wrote:
I think your answer will be clutch rod. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by groupus on 06/01/10 at 12:51:22 i'm no expert but here's my opinion: the way a motorcycle transmission works is different from a car's. motorcycles are "constant mesh", meaning that all gears are spinning at the same time. instead of the gears sliding to engage, a set of "dogs" on a plate slide into holes on the gear to engage that gear to the output shaft. http://www.vf750fd.com/blurbs/Image8.gif image taken from http://www.vf750fd.com/blurbs/shifting.html so basically, the gears don't grind, the dogs do. your dogs could be worn out, in which case you should give them some water and a treat and a nap ;D or your holes could be elongated/beveled, and if that's the case, you should see a doctor :o honestly, this is probably worst case scenario, but unlikely. worth considering though and would explain the grinding sound. also if you clutch doesn't completely disengage, it would explain the grinding between 1 & 2. it will try to go into neutral between them. if the idle/engine speed is too high, it would be hard to shift out of neutral from a stop (high engine speed can't match low road speed), as the little dogs would skip over the holes too fast to engage. lots to consider. GOOD LUCK! |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by brianjkirk on 06/01/10 at 17:43:47 I had the same issue on my recently purchased 2003 with about 7000 miles. It would grind whenever shifting from first->second, usually settling in neutral, so I'd have to shift twice. During inspection, the shop said they adjusted the linkage rod. It's a bit better now, but not nearly as easy to shift as my old Honda. Shifting between other gears is not a problem. I'm thinking to adjust the shifting link further, maybe another spline. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 06/01/10 at 19:12:58 Ok, I've adjusted one spline tonight which "seems" to make it shift better. I didn't have too much time before it got dark and can hopefully ride a bit more tomorrow. The issue now is that the height of the shift lever is almost too high, I have to use the top of my foot, almost up to the ankle in order to shift. Is there a way to lower the shift lever again without changing the spline adjustment I just made? |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by verslagen1 on 06/01/10 at 19:20:23 yep, on the link the connects the arm to the lever loosen both nuts, one's left handed, one regular then twist the rod and the lever will come down if it goes up you went the wrong way. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by Tiefighterpilot on 06/01/10 at 22:37:54 Sounds like my bike. I have s40 2007. Mine don't like to shift out of N when stopped. My instructor told me that it is normal. When shifting to first moving to fast, going into first gear makes sound like gears hitting. I thought that was normal... I try to match my ground speed to gear speed before shifting. Only seem to make that sound if I am going much faster than where ground speed and gear speed is not matching. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by verslagen1 on 06/01/10 at 22:53:26 0D303C3F303E312D3C2B293035362D590 wrote:
If that's normal then your instructor either rode a lot of mal adjusted bikes or was tryin' to ease your nerves. Been on several savages, all of them went into N w/o any special effort. And only one needed to be adjusted to do that cause it was wrecked. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/02/10 at 06:33:04 How much can you move the clutch lever before its starting to actually disengage the clutch? |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 06/03/10 at 11:03:36 687B6C6D727F797B702F1E0 wrote:
Found the time to try this this morning, but no luck even getting the nuts loosened up. Tried turning both ways, didn't want to crank on it and strip them. Do you know what size they are? Clymer doesn't say but I thought it looks like 10mm? |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by verslagen1 on 06/03/10 at 11:16:54 you're gonna need to get down there to see which way the threads go. yeah, 10mm I think. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 06/08/10 at 12:36:05 Well, I think the problem is fixed. Been out riding a couple times, shifting is much smoother and no grinding noise. Still having a bit of a problem shifting from neutral to first without rolling bike forward a few inches, but things are working much smoother now. Best part, for me at least, is just knowing that it wasn't my newbie shifting that was causing the problem :D Next question is this: Is there any way to adjust the reach distance for the clutch lever? My hands are small and it is quite a reach for me. If there isn't an adjustment, is there a different lever type or shape that I can find somewhere? I've seen some adjustable levers on bikes before, but can't seem to find there anywhere now that I want a pair.... |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by ralfyguy on 06/08/10 at 16:23:45 The problem is that the clutch lever travel is needed for the clutch to engage/disengage properly. There isn't much to adjust. The free play at the knubby end of the lever should be about 1/2" or between 10mm and 15mm. |
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Title: Re: Grinding when shifting Post by PBLover on 06/09/10 at 11:04:02 Thanks Verslagen and everyone else for their help. Feels like a completely different bike now. |
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