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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> turbo or all motor
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Message started by pitbullcustoms on 03/01/10 at 18:25:47

Title: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/01/10 at 18:25:47

I wanna either put a turbo on the motor i have now or build an all motor with maybe a little higher compression ration to produces more hP and torque and suggestions would be helpfull..... thank you !!!

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Charon on 03/01/10 at 21:32:32

It would probably be easier, cheaper, and more effective to just transplant the engine from a 600 cc sportbike into it. Or for that matter, an even bigger engine. The engine speed is limited by the relatively long stroke, and there isn't much that can be done about that. That leaves increasing torque as the route to more power, power being the product of torque and rpm. Torque can be increased only by increasing average cylinder pressures. You quickly run into a limit there with the limits of fuel quality, and will have to move to ethanol or methanol to get the higher octane required. You could try to find high octane racing fuel, at quite high prices, if you preferred. You will be interested to know that these are the very same limits that have existed since the days of the Model T.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by JohnBoy on 03/02/10 at 04:41:39

There are slightly larger pistons and you can nudge the compression by milling the head and the cyl. The group has access to two different hot cam grinds. Lancer has done it all...look for post on his bike Rex.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/02/10 at 13:44:51

well ive looked for parts for both turbo build and all motor at its about the same price unless someone knows where you can find a piston and ring set cheaper then 160$ if i were to swap motors to a sport bike you are very limited to motors because you cant fit a SV650 motor the only motor that might look good in there would be a twin cylinder maybe a kawi 500R motor unless there are others that i havent seen! well any help is appreciated i would like to start getting parts soon so that i will have parts by late summer early fall to get the build underway!

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Oldfeller on 03/02/10 at 15:01:22

You have never considered nitrous as a cheaper way to get the large performance increase you are seeking?

You only need that big performance occasionally, the rest of the time good fuel economy is a nice thing to have.

Nitrous does this better than any other performance increase modification.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Roadie on 03/02/10 at 16:00:39

67444C4E4D44444D5A280 wrote:

The thing I'd worry about is dropping the bottom end out like Torque did to his bike. Torque like to ride hard and fast if I remember. He replaced the savage with a sport bike after the bottom fell out.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/02/10 at 16:57:40

Unless you have a better opinion of the chassis setup than I, I'mnot understanding the desire for such power. My guess is, Lancers Rex is at the upper limits of power/performance that the frame geometry can use reasonably. Lancer, your thinking? Youve seen Rex stressed in a turn, does more power seem like something it needs?

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Charon on 03/02/10 at 17:09:45

The question that must be asked - of yourself - is "What is the object of the exercise?" Do you want to push the limits of the 650 cc single in the Savage/S40 chassis? Are you trying to make what you already have perform better? Or are you looking for a more powerful/faster bike without much regard to the chassis? Once you have answered that question you can decide how to proceed. In terms of top speed, a 250 Ninja that retails for $1000 less than the S40 will happily outrun the stock S40. A 600 cc sportbike of any make will outrun, outaccelerate, outbrake, and outhandle anything you can do with the S40. Only you can decide what you want, but it helps an awful lot if you define your objective in advance. Remember too that the S40 has brakes and suspension that are adequate to its basic performance, but probably not up to much more.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/02/10 at 18:20:17

i just want something fun to ride which the bike is but just a touch more power is all nothing over the top.. i have considered nitrous but not to sure on it... i had a sport bike before maybe thats y i want alittle more performance...and something unique that not may people have. i have thought about upgrading the brakes to stop better maybe i will just throw a cam and a new carb at it and that just might satisfy my needs...

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Truckinduc on 03/02/10 at 19:28:59

Sounds like your trying to do to yours what Im doing to mine.

Ill turbo it eventually, but its alot of parts and money and many factors for error. A destroyed motor is easy to accomplish.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/03/10 at 16:18:24

so after doing some thinking im going to look more into nitrous i have found some kits that are a dry shoot and it starts at a 10Hp jet which should be plenty but they give you 5 different jets... and a lancer cam and a carb!!! so time to save my money and start getting the parts together.. probably a new carb first tho

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by LANCER on 03/03/10 at 21:56:30

4D54495F4851515E484E4952504E3D0 wrote:

;) 8-)

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Charon on 03/04/10 at 06:27:19

I probably didn't use the correct search terms. I was looking for the price of the Lancer cam and the Lancer carburetor kit. Any chance they could be posted for the edification of anyone who might want one? I think I remember the carburetor as being about $400, but I could be radically wrong.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by dasch on 03/04/10 at 09:53:00

455C4157405959564046415A5846350 wrote:

Interested too. Can you post a link or contact?

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Yonuh Adisi on 03/04/10 at 10:13:30

Just contact Lancer through PM. He can give you the prices and specs. I bought his stage 1 cam and it works great.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/04/10 at 12:03:34

I rejetted & added the Supertrapp on one set of mods. Did the Stage 1 cam when time came for a chain. I think I felt almost the "bump" in performance from the cam as the one I got from the TRapp & jets. If you want the full ride, do some head work in the exhaust,free up the intake airflow& go withthe stage 2 & put a carb on it. Your call on the exhaust, but a more free flowing header, tied to a Trapp is tunable.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by dasch on 03/04/10 at 13:26:33

Yonuh, I meant link or contact for 10Hp Nitro kit.

I did contact Lancer for the cam too, BTW ;)

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by Yonuh Adisi on 03/04/10 at 13:37:00

323725353E560 wrote:

Yonuh, I meant link or contact for 10Hp Nitro kit.

I did contact Lancer for the cam too, BTW ;)

Okay, sorry about that. :-[ I just got as my wife likes to say "confuzzled".

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/04/10 at 18:16:24

well i went to start the bike today and suprise suprise the bike wouldnt start... so i checked the spark and got good spark!!! took the intake off and found that on the compression stroke its pushing the air fuel mixture out the carb any ideas on whats wrong? possible the intake valves out of adjustment? any help would be great

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by bill67 on 03/04/10 at 18:37:05

I don't know whats wrong but I would put some Sea Foam in the oil and turn it over some and let it sit for a couple hours,It seems like something is sticking.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/04/10 at 22:45:57

554C5147504949465056514A4856250 wrote:

You gotta look at the valves. Id stay away from the starter button till I knew what was going on.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by dasch on 03/05/10 at 03:12:16

oh boy! Intake valve stays open?
Does decomp solenoid actuate intake or exhaust valve??

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/05/10 at 03:30:40

Exhaust,

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/05/10 at 16:39:24

so i readjusted the valves those are fine now but it still wont start not it just clicks when i hit the starter button i traced it to a relay under the tank that looks like its wire to the decomp any ideas of what could be wrong?

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by verslagen1 on 03/05/10 at 17:07:21

clicking is a sign of a bad battery.
so if the battery tests good (take it to autozone or the like)
check the grounds and cable connections.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/05/10 at 18:10:23

Your current situation is one that would lend itself to a dead or low battery. Youve been messing with it, but not riding & recharging it. Charge it up & see how it goes.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/05/10 at 18:33:38

see thats what i thought to but i have all lights and everything works just when i start it.. it just clicks once and thats it the lights dim a bit when it clicks im very confused about y it wont start

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/05/10 at 18:52:28

Youve been messing with it, start it, shut it off, crank on it, piddle, no time running to charge that TINY battery. Charge it up & see what happens. Check the water level, KNOW whats going on with the battery or be in the dark.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by verslagen1 on 03/05/10 at 18:52:52

The ignition is very voltage sensitive. What will keep the starter going won't spark. the battery has to be up to the top.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by pitbullcustoms on 03/05/10 at 19:06:49

ok so i will charge the battery tomorrow and top off the water... so finally after alot of searching the thing that is clicking is the decomp control unit....

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by JESPOKER4FUN on 03/05/10 at 19:24:47

If your battery is ok and you suspect the decompression control unit is at fault, get a clymer service manual and refer to page 245 and 246 for testing procedure.
Very detailed in the manual.
If you do not have a manual you cam pm me and I will give you the info.

Title: Re: turbo or all motor
Post by dasch on 03/06/10 at 05:22:36

+1 on a low battery. Easy test: jump it.