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Message started by BurnPgh on 05/30/09 at 22:31:44

Title: wobble
Post by BurnPgh on 05/30/09 at 22:31:44

This is going to be explained badly...be prepared. I've had a wobble/pull to the right for a while now. Its nothing dangerously out of whack (If it were i wouldnt have put 2k+ mi on it) and I mentioned in another thread that my buddy rode my bike. He's been a long long time rider of pretty much every motorized vehicle you can imagine from mopeds/scooters to semis. He himself has a honda 650 single enduro something or other that he races like a madman. He didnt even notice it until i told him to put it in nuetral while he was riding and remove his hands from the bars but I notice it and while it isnt at all bad it is irritating. I did the gs450 cast wheel mod and I can only imagine my spacing is wrong on the axles. Which one is the question. The front wheel is slightly (about 1 mm . Had to jerry rig the front spacers) off center between the forks. That much I know, so thats what Im eye balling most viciously. The rear wheel is dead center between the ends of the swingarm however the swingarm is asymetrical on account of the belt drive, but ive converted to chain. So, should the rear wheel be dead centered between the swingarm or slightly off since im no longer running a belt? And, in relation to the rear wheel, if the front were off center to the left (while riding) it would cause a rightward pull correct? Or have I got it backwards? Im sorry if i sound stupid. Forgive me as Im only a public high school graduate and admittedly did not pay much attention in any classes that may have touched on this or that related mathematical or geometric equation because well...i knew i could pass without paying attention or doing anything (yay public education system) and i didnt figure id ever need that information. Until now I was right. As of now Im just ignorant. Ive been reluctant to ask this here until now because i've felt so stupid. I know I rushed ahead of myself this winter doing this and that mod without having the proper knowledge and Im only getting what I deserve but Id appreciate help in this matter. Thank you.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by verslagen1 on 05/30/09 at 23:14:51

Hey Burn, don't play stupid. Your arse is well educated and knows a bobble when it feels it. That's pretty darn smart for an arse. ;D

Me thinks we have a similar issue and I R N injinear.
I've aligned my '8802 to a nat's pitooie, the air pressure is right and I added a fork brace. And still it doesn't feel like my '96. I know it's been dropped at some point cause one of the engine bolts don't go thru easily.

There were some tips on checking frame alignment, I'm going to have to search thru and find them. I suspect that a slight offset of the front tire to the head turn is castering the bike into a perpetual turn that must be compensated for. That and I think the head bearings are shot.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/30/09 at 23:35:06

Non stretchy string. Tie it around front tire. Center it & tape it. Go to end of one handlebar. Compare to other side.

If suspicious of spacers on front, swap spacers out & see if bike favors the same side.
Make sure rear wheel is straight in swingarm.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by BurnPgh on 05/30/09 at 23:52:34

I know my head bearings are good (enough). They certainly arent shot. It IS possible im misaligned (wheel/head set) as a while ago I turned right into my gravel driveway a little too sharp and took a lowside at 5-10mph but the wobble was noticeable before that happened so my questions still stand unanswered. Thanks for the encouragement though Verslagen.

Im mildly "confused" on aligning the rear wheel straight with the swinarm as 1 - the notches on the side of the swing arm are essentially useless 2 - I never did have to tighten the belt and as such never had to check alignment.
I've been using a slide caliper to measure the distance between the very end of the swingarm and the flat threaded plate part of the tensioner assembly that the bolt threads through.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by SV og LS on 05/31/09 at 01:23:41

0730372B15222D450 wrote:

I've been using a slide caliper to measure the distance between the very end of the swingarm and the flat threaded plate part of the tensioner assembly that the bolt threads through.

The best no cost way to check alignment is to tie a string around rear wheel (both ends pointing forward, ending ahead of front tyre, ends held tight between bricks or something), moving the string ends so both just touch the front edge of rear tyre so the string's parallel with the rear, then measuring the distance between string and front tyre both sides, both front and rear edges. You may need to slightly turn the front, then realign the string and remeasure. This way your wheels are aligned although rear to swing arm or pulleys likely aren't.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by marshall13 on 05/31/09 at 09:57:45

to get your wheel straight in the swingarm, use a very high-tech tool... a measuring tape... if you measure from center of the swingarm pivot, to the center of the axle, and get the measurement the same on both sides it is straight in the swingarm.... once you've done that, measure from front engine mount bolt center to rear axle center both sides...should measure the same... a difference means either the swingarm or frame is bent... a front tire offset right will cause the bike to pull to the right(more drag on that side of the steering centerline)... you can check the straightness of fork tubes with a small square... the long leg should have complete contact with the tube no matter how you align the short leg on the bottom tree, if not, it's bent.... you can also drop plumb-bobs from symetrical fixed points(like the neck pivot, and ends of rear axle, swingarm pivots, front engine mounts, rear engine mounts, etc), and do both linear, and diagonal measurements... if linears match, and diagonals dont, the frame is "diamond shaped"(bent out of square)..... neither match? bent laterally....

Title: Re: wobble
Post by BurnPgh on 05/31/09 at 14:15:37

All very useful information. Another question...should the wheel, looking from behind, be dead center between the ends of the swingarm? Mine is, but the tire is slighlty offset to the left between the fender. Centered between the swingarm, not the rear fender. Okay or no? The gs wheel doesnt have a massive pulley on the side. With the savage wheel its centered between both the swingarm and fender because the swingarm is asymetrical to accomdate the pulley. With the gs wheel centered between the swingarm the sprockets line up perfectly but the wheel is offset left between the edges of the rear fender.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by John_D on 05/31/09 at 14:26:37

I'll be the first to admit I'm not very knowledgable about this kinda thing, but it seems to me that if the swingarm is asymetrical to take the pully into account, the wheel should be centered to the main frame of the bike/center of mass, instead of the swingarm. Hopefully the smart folks will chime in and prove me right or wrong. :-/

Title: Re: wobble
Post by Yonuh Adisi on 05/31/09 at 14:42:30

6077767C7771792520232220120 wrote:

I would be inclined to agree. The frame was designed to accomadate the offset.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by Phelonius on 05/31/09 at 17:47:01

If the bike has ever been crashed, it could be frame alignment.
With someone in the saddle to hold the bike verticle and the steering straight ahead, lay down about ten feet in back of the bike and look at the alignment of the wheels. Look for tilt too. then do the same from the front.
Also make sure your forks are properly aligned in the triple trees.
Rear wheel in the swing arm is something you should already have done.

Phelonius

Title: Re: wobble
Post by Sandy Koocanusa on 05/31/09 at 17:57:01

Unlike you, I did pay attention in high school. It, too, was a public school, and I was in the G/T classes. The solution to your problem is, therefore, obvious to me...

Put a brick in your left saddlebag to balance stuff out, and get back to riding. ;D

Sorry dude. That's the best I've got. You lost me when you divulged that your front wheel was 1mm off center. I have more than a millimeter of bugs stuck to the forks, making such a measurement impossible to take.

Title: Re: wobble
Post by BurnPgh on 05/31/09 at 23:28:57

I did a lot of measuring and such to initially center the wheel between the fender but wasnt quite sure and it was easier and cheaper to have it centered in the swingarm. No spacing of the sprocket required. I was going to have a custom spacer made for the sprocket but screw it. I'll get some washers and longer bolts. The buddy I had ride it before said that wouldnt be an issue. Its really not a huge issue as it is but its just getting irritating. I kind of rushed through the whole mod so I could ride as soon as the weather was tolerable. I knew Id have to go back and fine tune. Got a couple rainy days on the way. Now's the time I geuss.