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Message started by Rocco on 05/13/09 at 15:35:29

Title: waggin my tail
Post by Rocco on 05/13/09 at 15:35:29

so i was cruising around last night, and a typical south florida green light is only 30 seconds lol so i got caught @ a yellow and had to slow....pretty quickly.....my reaction is still to slam my right foot(from driving a car for so long) so i started sliding and slipping all over

when i came 2 a stop the older gentlemen next to me gave me a thumbs up....if only he knew it def was not on purpose!!

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by PTRider on 05/13/09 at 15:41:32

About 80% to 100% of a modern motorcycle's braking capability is on the front tire. Can anyone do a stoppie on a Savage/S40 by just clamping down on the front brake?... Even if you start bouncing the bike first? I doubt it.

Try just using the front brake alone. When you get out of the habit of using the rear brake, use some rear brake moderately when you begin braking and taper off as you slow. On the wet, use both equally (but how in the world does anyone judge how much braking effort each end is providing???)

More on braking:
TAPER BRAKING (http://www.msgroup.org/Tip.aspx?Num=030&Set=)
BRAKING:
WEIGHT TRANSFER AND MAXIMUM PERFORMANCE (http://genjac.com/BoomerBiker/Braking.htm)

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Ed L. on 05/13/09 at 16:50:24

Once you got that rear brake locked up don't let go, you have to ride it out till the bike comes to a stop. If you get off a locked up rear brake when the bike is moving you risk a quick and ugly high side. You did good by keeping the rear locked up till you stopped. :)

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Rocco on 05/13/09 at 20:05:31

i am definitely am training to only use the front brake!!! and i'd love 2 see a stoppie on a savage...u guys go first!

i went 2 my tattoo artist's 2nite, who's ridden all his life...he walked outside and goes "screw the virago, this is sweeeet!" he had 2 hop on and turn the handle bars too....coming from an old school guy i think that's an awesome compliment!

and i'm glad i kept it under control, i locked up the rear and fishtailed @ the safety course and the instructor asked if i was nuts ;D

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by aebooze on 05/14/09 at 05:26:57

lol. I usually use only my rear brake for stopping even though I know I'm supposed to use both of them. My reason is the squealing from the front brakes annoys me, but I'm too lazy to change the pads and it pisses me off that I should have to change them when they're still good.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by diamond jim on 05/14/09 at 05:38:25

Find a motorcycle cop. Ask him about using the rear brake. They go through the training courses and do the pylon ballet using those big bikes. They have mastered the rear brake.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by savagedml on 05/14/09 at 05:42:10

I've found it useful to use the bike's engine to help ease the braking process . "Engine braking" by downshifting will assist that front brake in slowing you down. And I certainly won't wreck my bike over a yellow light. I'd rather roll the dice on a ticket than roll the dice on broken bike and bones!

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by PTRider on 05/14/09 at 07:07:40

I disagree that one is "supposed" to use both brakes. On slippery surfaces, yes. On dry pavement, not so much. The front has all the braking you can use, although using the rear a bit might help a shorter panic stop.

In the middle of a panic stop is no time to be fiddling with the shifter. Brake, keep straight, and balance. If you were taught to downshift during a panic stop, reconsider the wisdom of that.

To de-squeak the disc brake, remove the pads, clean the rust off the steel plate, very lightly sandpaper the friction surface perfectly flat (put fine sandpaper on a flat surface and lightly rub the pad across the sandpaper), and put disc brake caliper grease or no-squeak stuff very sparingly on the points of contact between the backing plate and the caliper. You don't need new pads if they still have adequate friction material.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by savagedml on 05/14/09 at 07:41:59

Bless your heart PT. No one said anything about "fiddling with a shifter in the middle of a panic stop". Nor did anyone mention "downshifting during a panic stop". Please don't embellish my posts. Thanks.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Bug Chaser on 05/14/09 at 08:16:28

South Florida, Palm Beach County near the coast in particular, is always adventure biking. The speed limit on I-95 is really the average age of the cage drivers. They tend to wander on the road, panic stopping and avoidance maneuvers are definitely skills to master. Since I got back on the bike I noticed my skills needed updating. Give’em lots of respect and room and never be in a rush. Take the Bee Line Hwy west for a good long ride with not much traffic. You can find your own way back, which is why you got on the bike I the first place.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by doc5446 on 05/14/09 at 08:53:27

767F7E7361617B667760120 wrote:

I totally agree with ya here. I hardly ever use my brakes at all unless I need to come to a complete stop. Plus I think it is always wise to be in the right gear at the right speed.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Rocco on 05/14/09 at 09:01:29

i don't dare go on 95 with the bike yet...i don't like driving on it in the car! no one pays attention and they all think they need 2 be in front of u!

i drive a stratus so i'm not the fastest car out there, even the soccer moms are crazed....have u ever seen a minivan peel out? lol

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by BurnPgh on 05/14/09 at 11:00:27

I was actually taught to downshift during panic stops in the MSF course.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Yonuh Adisi on 05/14/09 at 11:34:17

Too pass my riding test, I had to demonstrate a panic stop. I had to be in first with both feet on the ground at the end.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by merhlin on 05/14/09 at 12:12:27

When I did my course in Washington state, we had to downshift and be in neutral after the panic stop, with your hand OFF the clutch handle. If said hand was still on the handle he would reach out and remove it to make sure you were in neutral. Bike jumps or stalls, fail that part of the course.

Merhlin

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by PTRider on 05/14/09 at 12:20:23

Savagedml, No problem, you know to concentrate on braking when braking hard, but others might not.

Yonuh & BurnPgh, You might give some consideration to what you were taught. I feel that braking during a panic stop takes away the concentration you need to brake at the max short of locking up and sliding either tire. I feel that the MSF is wrong here. What do you feel is safest to get stopped in the shortest possible distance? I agree with this viewpoint (http://www.msgroup.org/Tip.aspx?Num=216&Set=)--note the data he posts where the professional riders averaged stops 10-1/2' shorter from 60 mph when just pulling the clutch in and braking.

Rocco, Buy something like this mesh armored motorcycle jacket (http://motodirect.com/product/17_18-Mesh-Motorcycle-Jackets/138-EXL-EXL-Motorcycle-Jackets-MJ109-Mens-Yellow-Mesh-Biker-Jacket.html). You need mesh for ventilation, and you need the armor for the time you go down. Get a very bright color...red, yellow, or orange...to help drivers see you and maybe not do something stupid and painful (for you).
http://motodirect.com/images/products/138-1-md.jpg

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by bill67 on 05/14/09 at 12:30:45

I never took a motorcycle course,I pull in the clutch when breaking,I wear regular clothes in the summer,like short sleeve shirt.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by PerrydaSavage on 05/14/09 at 13:19:47

Glad you didn't dump yer Bike dude!

I am an instructor with the Canadian equivalent of the American MSF Course ("Gearing Up" Motorcycle Training Program) and we teach;

Both front and rear brakes applied during ALL braking (exception, slight rear "trail" braking as necessary when executing slow-speed maneuvers).

During Emergency Braking; clutch in, apply both brakes evenly (try to avoid front or rear lock-up), tapping down repeatedly on the shifter to ensure in 1st gear at stop in case a quick getaway is needed (as in about to be rear-ended, as Bike can stop waaaay quicker than cages)

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Rocco on 05/14/09 at 19:36:17

u guys give the best advice! i didn't realize til after how close i had come 2 flipping...i was almost sideways if i recall!

when i brake i pull in clutch, downshift and both brakes...that's what i was taught and it works pretty good, but right now my right foot is heavier then my right hand lol

and i did just that! my friend gave me a very thick leather jacket....looks bada$$.....but i'll get heat stroke if it's not snowing down here...so i bought a motoboss mesh and armor jacket...on sale 120 @ cycle gear...black, red and reflective silver...those are my colors and it doesn't feel like i'm wearing anything with the water/wind liner removed!

i'm thinking of getting the leds that sit near the engine, kind of like "chassis glo" on cars....since my bike is black with purple and blue sparkles i was thinking a deep purple light would look sweet shining off the engine......i saw a chopper that had green and it looked wicked....awesome AND safe, sign me up!

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by verslagen1 on 05/14/09 at 22:44:31

5A676B6B67080 wrote:

Yeah I know what you mean, that right foot instintively leaps up off of the gas pedel and stomps down on the brake all by itself.

JOG reduced the rear brake shoes area so you can apply a heavy foot without locking it up.

You can also lower the engagement point so it takes more pedal travel.

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by John_D on 05/15/09 at 02:05:51

063324242F3237053720373133560 wrote:

Precisely the technique and reasoning our instructor (Clark County WA) taught us. Works for me; once I got into the habit, I don't even think about it when I downshift, whether during gradual or sudden stops.
Although I must admit, my very first panic stop, I locked the backend up too! ;D Blasted cage pulled out in front of me when I was cruising a nice backroad with shiny new Class 3 endorsement.
Got a better feel for the brake now, and it's broken in a little, it's a little more forgiving to that kinda thing.
And I definitely need to save up for one of those shnazzy mesh jackets, it's gonna be a warm summer! 8-)

Title: Re: waggin my tail
Post by Rocco on 05/15/09 at 09:03:31

i'm trying to get to the point where i don't have 2 think about it, it just happens....my karate is like that but i've been training 3 years every day...and if u get a textile jacket u won't even feel it, except the knowing the fact u have elbow pads lol