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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1227200533 Message started by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 09:02:12 |
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Title: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 09:02:12 Well Justin has shown an interest in also building a Trike and wants a little help with it, heck toss your thoughts out and I may learn something.. First, yes it will turn like a log with a solid rear axle in tight areas like a parking lot, but out on the open road its ok. A rear axle with a diff is WONDERFULL........... but $$$$$$$$$$ I cant stand Trikes built from VW's or front wheel drive cars with the motor in the back........... they may have 3 wheels but not a Trike in my eyes. A real Trike is nothing more than a motorcycle with 2 rear wheels, still has all the controls as a motorcycle it just wont lean, perfect for people with disabilities or people that have a hard time holding a motorcycle up. One prob with a Trike is high speed turns, in slow speed in a parking lot you have to really turn it hard and sharp to lift a rear wheel, but with brakes applied and sharp turn it will happen, fast turns if taking to sharp can and will lift a rear wheel and TRUST ME it will make your heart miss a beat or two ! All in all a Trike is a pleasure to ride, you dont have to worry about dropping the bike or proper counter steering technique, you just ride and enjoy the wind... Now for the rest of the story. Please ask away or toss in your opinion. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/20/08 at 09:30:47 I am thinking that considering the relatively low power that a couple of one way clutches would be worth looking at. My wife wont be gunning it off the line or running hard, so it might work. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by Bobbert on 11/20/08 at 09:34:51 It's pretty tough to set up the trike so that the bike can lean inside the rear axle isnt it? |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 09:57:09 504F494E53546555655D4F43083A0 wrote:
The prob with that is the way the oneway releases so to let the inside wheel slip is the same way the chain will drive it, so it wont be able to move... Bobbert' to have it lean freely on a rear axle could be dont by having a rear axle setup with a good strong axle tube and have the swingarm come in and hook to it in the very center with a pivot, the swingarm would allow up/down movement and the center pivot would allow the lean, and it "should" stay up at a stop... I built my last axle to have a diff, it worked like a charm, BUT the thing was heavy heavy, no prob on a 120hp bike but would be on a 30hp Savage ! For $3500 you can get a 90 pound all Alum Trike axle called Frankenstein... Or be like me and use a light and simple ATV axle for cheap and just deal with the odd tight turning... |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/20/08 at 10:00:49 Wuhh? With 2 one ways only the outside wheel would over run the axle, OR, my mental picture is an abstraction/hallucination. Or be like me and use a light and simple ATV axle for cheap and just deal with the odd tight turning... Looks like a good start, I'm gonna have to llok around & see what I can find. It seems to me that a pivot allowing some lean but going to to an axle that isnt solid mounted to the frame, then wouldnt it be hard to keep it standing up under way? The way I am thinking, the wheels on the bike need to be solid mounted to the frame, so that the frame & wheels lean together thru some mechanism. The ones Ive seen that have the front wheels lean are connected thru the steering arent they?I mean, they will lean only when the bars are turned & then only as much lean as would be proportionally "right" for any given amount of handlebar turn? I dont know, but where you are headed might need some work. Maybe the front wheel would be enough to keep the bike upright. I am sure there will be some well researched responses & Ill be getting an education on this. Heres why I think the rear wheel needs to be somehow regulated in its lean. The way I see riding is that its a constant correction of a constant fall. Whether we feel it or are aware of it, we are gently movong side to side, just a bit,steering under the butt. This is why countersteering works, drive the front wheel away from the desired path, then turn the front back under ourselves in a coordinated way, that stands the bike back up. I can name at least 3 here who I believe have the "stuff" to either support or decisively smack my point down. I have to go out & get some stuff done, Its Pretty today! Gotta go round up some firewood. I hope this thread finds some interest & we are able to get input from the guru types. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 10:07:49 352A2C2B3631003000382A266D5F0 wrote:
You DO NOT want to drive just one rear wheel......... It will turn great one way but not the other. It will cause bad things to happen if one wheel looses traction and regains it again and and... Solid or center diff...... Solid is easy, cheap, light, but has draw backs. Center diff will cost you or take time to build, maybe heavy and costly. The best way to go ! |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 10:16:48 Best Trike axle out ! But at $3500 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FRANKENSTEIN-TRIKE-REAR-END-REAREND-4-HARLEY-AXLE-KIT_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a543Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem110311967143QQitemZ110311967143QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v610/orange-appeal/569e_12.jpg |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by verslagen1 on 11/20/08 at 10:29:06 Since leaning into a turn is everything m/c, I would try to accomplish it and tie the steering to the lean mechanism for a coordinated turn/lean. How about a electric clutch to tie the left and right axles together? Either disengage manually for tight turns studdered for limited slip. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 10:36:20 667562637C7177757E21100 wrote:
Well if you really want to lean go with a motorcycle.... to make a Trike lean is very costly and hard, and unsafe if not done right, one Co, has a independent rear axle that has a lean option that uses an electric actuator but it cost like $13,000............ You can get Trikes with a single rear wheel and ATV type frontend that leans..... Like $15,000. If you want to lean but still be upright at stops you can buy a little Trike Scooter deal but it still cost like $8000. As for types of rear setups that will work and is favorable for most all Trikes, stick with a Solid ATV axle or one with a center diff, all other ideas have been looked at or try'd with not so good results... |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by Chong Kim on 11/20/08 at 14:03:02 Your 30 HP Savage should run about like a late 1940's HD Servicar. It will be fine on the road. Before you decide on the final wheelbase, why not measure one of those and take advantage of Harley's R&D on the geometry from back then? It would look cool with no rear suspension and a springer seat. JMO |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/20/08 at 18:29:20 On my last Trike I did alot or working out numbers to get the right wheel base and width, but this one is not a high speed deal, so the wheel base and width I put the rear tires in place and looked at it for a bit, drank a beer or two and moved them a few times until I came up to what you see in the pics, the new swing arm will be 24" from pivot bolt to center of the rear bearings and 36" from hub to hub... and I will also lower the whole thing 2" .. I was going to go all out retro, but my back cant take much as in bumps so a hard tail is out... I know I wanted to do that and white walls and all. But. I still have the SS rods holding my back together, it pops and hurts all the time as it is. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by T Mack 1 on 11/21/08 at 14:12:17 Hmmmm.... Maybe I'm not thinking correctly.... but I would first go down to your local dealer and look at all the ATV's (the big boys) and see if any have differentials. Then, if you find one that does, see it a slavage yard has any ....... |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/21/08 at 14:14:52 40395975777F25140 wrote:
Prob with that it they are all SHAFT drive !!!! I've been researching and looking into this for 5 years now. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by verslagen1 on 11/21/08 at 15:03:33 apparently, cb900's have a 2 speed jack shaft that converts the normal chain drive to shaft drive. don't know much about it yet. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mikestrikes on 11/21/08 at 16:56:34 Why ........ just use a solid ATV axle or pay to get a real Trike axle. You can try and find other ways but its a crap shoot or a waste of time. I still have a few parts from an axle I was building if you want to finish it. I have a diff with a sprocket replacing the ring gear, bearings to hold it, and axle shafts, you just need axle tubes from a Suzuki Samurai and make swing arm mounts. You can have it cheap if you want. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by sluggo on 11/21/08 at 21:18:27 sounds interesting, i'll stick to two wheels as long as i can, then decide which way to go. i saw an older 65ish lady who owns a honey shop, she rides a big yamaha with two exra rear wheels. that makes three rear. center provides power outer wheels allow the bike to lean. don't know how it all works, she like it. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by mick on 11/21/08 at 22:07:27 Mike, if you only have one of the rear wheel driven,the other one free to turn on a stubb axel and bearing,wouldn't that be like an diffrencial? I don't know your disabilities Mike but would a side car outfit be out of the question? I used to ride one in England every winter,couldn't afford a car. I would put the chair on every november,came off in April, it was and old BSA M21,pos but fun. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/22/08 at 05:24:12 Power to an offset rear wheel would drive the front end to one side. A one way clutch on each side wopuld allow either to run faster than the axle, so the outside wheel in a turn could turn faster, driving the inside wheel only, not ideal but it should turn easier than if its dragging the outside wheel. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by il67bp on 11/26/08 at 00:55:11 Look up the tiltster on www.mysterydesigns.com looks pretty cool. wasnt sure if you guys had seen this yet |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by Rockin_John on 11/26/08 at 01:42:35 53560C0D584A3A0 wrote:
H-D recently applied for a patent on their take of a "tilting trike" design. Don't know when or if it is planned for production. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by Rockin_John on 11/27/08 at 00:24:20 I'd forgotten that H-D's "tilting trike" patent was for two wheels at the front. As Mike suggested, that is a concept that doesn't really interest me. However, a more conventional chopper/trike does interest me. Does anyone maybe recognize the IRS belt drive axle system, with outboard rotors on this chopper? http://catoosatrading.com/images/cycles/rally/bbb_rally/PA060087.jpg http://catoosatrading.com/images/cycles/rally/bbb_rally/PA060088.jpg http://catoosatrading.com/images/cycles/rally/bbb_rally/PA060089.jpg http://catoosatrading.com/images/cycles/rally/bbb_rally/PA060090.jpg http://catoosatrading.com/images/cycles/rally/bbb_rally/PA060091.jpg |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/27/08 at 00:52:40 Wow,, I had no idea there are so many ways to build a trike rear axle.I just figured there would be some good stuff out there to buy, not too pricey, just grab one & slap it in there... UHhh No..Thats not the way it works, nope,,not so fast there, Pahdnuh. Well, I see this is gonna be a big deal & not just a few hundred bucks. Looks like I better have a solid plan before I pull the rear wheel & start in on it. |
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Title: Re: Mike's and Justin's Trike Q&A Thread.. Post by Roadie on 11/27/08 at 02:49:45 Out of all the suggestions here, I like the ATV rear. They are everywhere and parts are readily available. I'm not sure if they'd take highway speed but most modern ATV's can do 55 mph. I'd go get a salvage one on the cheap, rebuild the back and mess with that design. My .02, Roadie |
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