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Message started by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 17:13:24

Title: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 17:13:24

I just had to replace my cam chain and the tensioner. Everything went very smooth with that. After putting everything back together she will not start up. Just turn and turns. Any ideas what I can check? Kinda got me wooried since I just dropped money and time into the cam chain, tensioner, and gaskets.

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by rigidchop on 11/14/08 at 17:16:10

might start with the wiring first. kickstand switch, and the connector on the brake side, below the tank are usually culprits.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 17:29:45

Thank You! I will check that! I had no idea there was wiring for the kick stand!

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by rigidchop on 11/14/08 at 17:43:51

its a disable switch, if you try and take off with the kickstand down, the bike will stall. are you getting any fire to the plug?

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 17:49:26

I will have to check that also. I was getting fire before I changed the parts so I just figured it was fine. Obviously i need to go through the wiring. Should I have changed the spark plu at the time of doing the cam chain repair?

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by rigidchop on 11/14/08 at 17:55:07

start with the simple stuff first. fuel and fire. then move on to the electrics. you porbably already know how to check for fire, but if you dont,pull the plug attach it to the plug wire, and thumb the starter button. if it sparks you obviously have fire. i wouldnt think you would need a new plug, if the old one looks o.k. i tape the clutch lever closed, so i can have my left hand free. you can never have too many hands.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 18:06:28

I dont have to have the clutch pressed when starting mine in neutral. Just curious why tape it down? I had to remove the brake and kickstand to get that side plate off because I was putting a new gasket on it and I am betting I probably disconnected whatever it is for the kickstand. If i am lucky that would be it. What if there is no fire?
Thanks for all your advice by the way!!

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by rigidchop on 11/14/08 at 18:34:25

i thought mine had to have the clutch pulled in to start it, even in neutral. maybe i'm wrong, it quit working anyway, so i dont worrry about it. if you dont have fire i would almost bet it is the connector under the tank on the brake side. it comes loose really easily. a few people have had it come apart. even me. i don't think its the kickstand switch, i dont think it would prevent a bike from starting, i'm pretty tired so bare with me. ;D

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by verslagen1 on 11/14/08 at 19:15:47

I have a '96, clutch has to be in no matter what.
with kick stand down, has to be in neutral
with ks up, can be it gear.

If your clutch safety is shorted, it might do what your's is doing.

did you put it prime to fill the carb prior to starting?

and if you've already turned and turned it, might be the battery is low
it will turn with the battery low but no spark or weak spark

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 20:04:34

I didnt prime anything. How would I do that. The battery was connected to a jump starter so I know I am good there. I have never had to hold in the clutch to start unless in gear of course. That couold have been disconnected by the previous owner. I did go check all the wiring and everything is connected just as it was before the cam chain change. I am thinking I may need to start tearing back down but I really dont want to. I dont have a spark plug wrench the correct size so I will have to check to see if I am geting fore tomorrow.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by Yonuh Adisi on 11/14/08 at 20:06:14

Prime carburetor by switching the petcock to PRI, that is what that setting is for.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 20:08:51

I have a custom sportster tank and the petcock has on , off, and res

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by Yonuh Adisi on 11/14/08 at 20:16:12

Oh, didn't know that.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by verslagen1 on 11/14/08 at 20:41:59

Well if you don't post it, how do we know?

Ok, on is as good as prime.

Got spark?

If you do, then I'd check compression.
If not wiring.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/14/08 at 20:52:30

Could something be wrong with the engine itself? It is turn just never starting. The cam chain broke while I was riding. I had it looked at and they said my valves were fine luckily. So I only needed to replace the chain and tensioner. After my first post I was sure it had to be wiring but I have went back through it and it is just as it was prior to the repair. If it needs a valve adjustment could that keep it from starting? Sorry to be so unknowledgeable. I am new to this site and the savage.

Thanks!

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/14/08 at 22:25:19

You sure you got the cam timed right? If its cranking over so much, maybe you have no compression.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by mick on 11/14/08 at 22:36:29

Could it be the valve timing? Verslagen might give some thoughts on that, I have the head off my engine as we speak and will be re assembling tomorrow,I was wondering about valve timing myself,
I know the cam shaft drive wheel has a locator pin , but I think it could be assembled with that in the wrong position by 90 degrees ?
depending if you had the piston at TDC on the firing stroke.
I just don't know for sure ,I put it out there ,hoping someone has the answer.
PS,try to make it habit to pull the clutch lever in while starting,even if you are in neutral.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by mick on 11/14/08 at 22:43:21

Justin , odd we came up with the valve thing at the same time, any more ideas on that?

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by verslagen1 on 11/14/08 at 22:52:50

53575D554A565B5257535B473E0 wrote:

As long as you have the pin in, the bolts tight, it ain't goin' no where.

Now, when you put the chain back on, was the piston at TDC? the pin at 1 o'clock? and the scribe marks horizontal?

You got those 3 things done it's hard to get out of time.

And BTW, it don't matter which TDC it is. Cause until you put the cam on there's only 1 TDC.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by mick on 11/14/08 at 23:03:51

Thanks Vers,as usual the voice of reason.
Scribe marks ? where the heck are those ?

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by verslagen1 on 11/14/08 at 23:39:01

I remember as lines clear across the gear but...

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/5000SE/LSCamwheelnewpos.jpg

Kwaknut tells me different, only across the hub.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by verslagen1 on 11/14/08 at 23:44:29

6E414C547F424F1A1E2D0 wrote:

I think even if it were really out of whack (slap, slap, slap, instead of tictictic) it still run just poorly. But in the process of checking it might find something out.

If it were out of time you'd know it by now.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/15/08 at 02:27:42

Thanks everyone for the info. Iwill be at it tomorrow and hopefully figure it out. I did want to mention that you guys are talking about compression and stuff so I realized I am lost. I didn't check nor do I know hoe to check the compression. I just change the chain and put it back together. Should I open it back up and take a step by step procedure to assure everything is right and if so what would that be?
Thanks!

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/15/08 at 03:45:22

If you didnt set the piston at TDC & make sure it stayed there thruout the job, I bet youre going back in.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by verslagen1 on 11/15/08 at 08:12:48

You said they checked the valves and they're alright.
Was the head removed?

Did you take the jug off?
If so, you may need new rings, the jug honed, etc.

The piston should be at TDC when you put the cam chain on. I don't know what will happen if it's out of time 1 tooth or 180°. But at some point there may be interference between valve and piston.

Before I took it apart again (OMG) I'd exhaust every check I could think of, turn the cylinder and watch the valves, compression check, etc. (no, I don't know what etc is) ::)

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/15/08 at 18:44:46

Thanks everyone! It was the timing of the cam shaft. I didnt know to align the marks on the shaft with the cylinder head while keeping the piston at TDC. I went back in and made the adjustments and it fired right up when I was done! Now i just noticed a little oil leak so tomorrow I will be checking on that but atleast she runs now so thats progress. I wouldnt have know this without all of you guys and this site! So thanks everyone!

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by rigidchop on 11/17/08 at 16:08:26

glad you got it running again.

Title: Re: I Need some help!
Post by savageclay on 11/17/08 at 18:06:37

Ok she starts up and idles ok. The problem now is when I ride it and gas it good to speed up it stutters. Any ideas on this? Carb or valves?