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Message started by up4fishin on 10/16/08 at 02:52:52

Title: 600 mile service details?
Post by up4fishin on 10/16/08 at 02:52:52

I just did some searching the site and came up short (rare event, good job everyone for keeping all the info out there). I'm looking for details on the 600 mile service. I checked all posts with 600 in them and didn't find the details. My bike is running fine, so I'm curious to know is there anything beyond an oil change I really should do. Is it worth the risk/expense of taking it to the dealer? anything else? thanks. :-/

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Oldfeller on 10/16/08 at 03:09:12

They should check your valve adjustments and retorque your head bolts. This requires exposing the top part of your cam by lifting the top part of the head off and requires removal of gas tank, etc.

Many problems are traced back to this first major service as the techs are NOT familiar with your engine (unless you specifically ask for a tech that has done it before many times and get assured that the older, experienced man will do your work). TELL THEM YOU WANT SEALANT PUT ON THE LITTLE RUBBER PLUG WHEN IT GETS PUT BACK IN AFTER TORQING THE BOLT NEXT TO THE EXHAUST HEADER. (their shop manual doesn't tell them to do this and when they don't do it, you get the infamous head oil leak within 10,000 miles or so).

Good luck -- we get more reports of bikes getting messed up at this 600 mile service because "Hey kid, go do the 600 mile service on this here single cylinder -- that's about your beginner speed (hee hee)".

They give the kid the standard 2.6 hours to do the whole job and he struggles through it, putting oil filters back in backwards and leaving pin/keys off cam gears and not putting sealant on plugs and putting cam seal rubbers in backwards and blocking off a few oil passages with excess goop ......

It is not a simple job. The kid will mess it up -- he has no experience working on this bike. The kid will follow "the book" and the book doesn't tell him to do critical parts of it as the book is incomplete.

Oldfeller

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Tincanman on 10/16/08 at 06:27:06

well I'd rebut but that about covers it!!

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by 07S40rider on 10/16/08 at 09:33:34

I will be the counter balance to oldfellers post. I checked with 4 different dealerships and went with the one that had 'almost' the best price but that I also felt 100% comfortable that they would take care of my bike. That was about 1200 miles ago and I have not had a single issue. If I had it to do over again, I would take the exact same route. Sure there are cases where the initial service might get goofed up and cause some issues, but I highly doubt that it is 'normal' for your bike to come out in worse shape than it went in.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by up4fishin on 10/17/08 at 03:04:59

so what everyone is saying is even though my bike is running fine, i should still get someone to open it up and mess with the insides...

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Oldfeller on 10/17/08 at 14:47:19

Nope, I'd suggest doing it yourself. When we do these things they rarely go bad on us.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by bill67 on 10/17/08 at 15:26:30

Upforfishing I wouldn't open it up,the guys who put it together have done thousands.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by EssForty on 10/17/08 at 17:01:29

I did my 600 miler myself, with the Clymers and the postings on the tech docs section. Although I did not find any valves out of adjustment I did find one at the upper limit so I adjusted it to the center of the spec.
In addition to torquing the head nuts, you'll also check the free play in your brake & clutch cables and your automatic decompression system. None of the work is really hard if you have moderate wrenching skills and a good torque wrench. It also helps to have deep offset metric box wrenches.

Everything went smoothly and my bike runs great. I use it to commute 25 miles to work each day, and so I wanted to make sure it was done right. It is a good way to get familiar with your bike, and since you'll be re-torqing the headbolts a few times in the future, it's a good time to get some practice.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by up4fishin on 10/18/08 at 02:24:42

Very interesting twist....

I went to the local dealership (there's only one around here) and asked about the service for the S40. I got what I suspect was a generic answer: for $299, we replace all fluids and check/adjust all cables, and perform a compression check.

Ok. So I then asked about whether they were familiar with some of the issues resulting from opening up the S40 (and gave some examples thanks to you guys), and was told they don't open it up unless they "hear something". On the plus side, they said if I go with the $299 deal they fix anything they find, including what is inside the crankcase.

I did not get a "warm and fuzzy" that they treat specific bikes specifically. Again, they're the only game in town. I'm inclined to change the oil, change the plug, torque the head bolts and call it good.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by EssForty on 10/18/08 at 04:33:22

I think that should work fine for you. Be sure you keep track of where each head cover bolt is removed from since they are not all the same. And as mentioned, seal under the head plug cap as well as the head cover mating surfaces.

Be sure to reward yourself with a six pack and a new fishing lure with the $300 you save. Ok. Make it a 12-pack and a new rod... ;)

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/18/08 at 04:35:56

The valves will require YOUR attention. If you pay someone to adjust the valves when it needs done, youll spend every penny the little thing saves in its delivery of decent MPG & youll miss riding time, because it will be sitting in a shop. At 600 miles, it needs checked, Get the tools & a book & be ready to take your time. people will talk you thru it, Its not hard, it just takes a little learning. I was nervous as could be the first few times, now, it's no biggeee,,,

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by SV og LS on 10/18/08 at 07:09:55

If I had a brand new S40 waiting for the first maintenance I doubt I would remove the head cover and retorque the head nuts at all just because there may be leakage problems in the long run. It's supposed to be done every 6000 kms which I did for the first few years but eventually the cover started to be harder and harder to seal properly. After 8th time I decided that's it and haven't touched the cover nor the bolts since.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by bill67 on 10/18/08 at 07:20:11

I took mine in for the 600 mile check up and they change oil and filter and checked that everything worked right. That was OK with me.The 600 mile check up was included in the price of the bike.New 06 $3800 out the door , In 07

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Dj12midnit on 10/18/08 at 08:02:43

300 talk about over inflated.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/18/08 at 10:39:03

I have YET to retorque the head. I was gonna do it when I did the cam, but forgot. Theres over 19,000 miles on it. No problems

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Oldfeller on 10/18/08 at 14:05:01

Since I bought mine with 435 miles on the clock and I have never seen the inside of the Suzuki service dept -- maybe I should retorque my own head bolts some time or another when I am in there that far anyway.

I got the head leak syndrome anyway (a very small light one) and I will be due a lookie see at the cam chain tensioner extension next Christmas maybe. That would be a good time to do it, as it will expose the top of the chain guides and allow me to take the stock straight chain guides out and reform them a bit.

You should be able to adjust your own valves, set your starter solenoid clearance, pop the top off your head and torque your own bolts -- all it takes is a clymer book and some patience.

It sounds like you are paying $300 bucks to your stealership for PRACTICALLY NOTHING as all those guys are going to do is listen to your engine and maybe check your valve clearances if they think they need to. Danger at 600 miles is a tight valve and that doesn't make any noise and does not necessarily cause a compression variation (which is why they are going to check your compression, BTW).

Lazy suckers, take the man's money to unscrew his spark plug (bet they sell you a new one even though you don't need it) stick a compression gage in the hole, crank it over and then give him the bike back "with a clean bill of health" after really having done nothing.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Pabst 2006 on 10/18/08 at 15:39:00

Sure sounds like a "generic answer", a really suspicious answer too.

Just putting it out there for informational purposes, local Suzuki dealer 10 mi. away from me, just got done with my 600 mi. service today, they charged $189 plus consumables (fresh oil for the oil change portion, etc). No word yet on whether they did the valve checks/adjustment, but they stated adamantly beforehand that they do it right by the book (same checks as listed within owner's manual)

Throwing $$$ at the stealership was unfortunate but necessary in my case as I don't have the free time, nor the proper tools (yet).
--Pabst

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Zappa on 10/19/08 at 14:54:56

Now I have to admit in a little bit of shame that i did skip the 600 mile service. I have 14000 miles on and i only changed oil and filter according to schedule. The bike runs good but things are coming up that i wish i had taken care of.
And what is the head that needs to be retorqued.
how good is the service manual really?

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by Oldfeller on 10/19/08 at 15:22:08

The factory service manual is pretty good, but has omissions (like not telling the tech to goop the rubber plug with sealant). Clymers has errors, they are all noted here in Tech section (and my Clymers copy has them all corrected in red ink).

There is NOTHING hard about working on this bike using a Clymers. Way back when I was 16-20 I tore down a S90 and then a CB160 down to the cases and put them back together using a Clymers manual. I owned a '66 Corvair for crying out loud, which required weekly attention just to keep it running. I like Clymers pretty good, I own one for my Acuras and use it as an index of topics (and I also insist on a full shop manual for the cars as well -- Dealers throw them in along with a full spare set of floor mats if you negotiate for them).

This bike is easy to understand and work on. Just don't expect to go do something complicated in 2.7 hours. Go slow and ask questions.

Title: Re: 600 mile service details?
Post by EssForty on 10/19/08 at 16:29:11

5F64757564050 wrote:

The headcover has 4 nuts that need to be retorqued. They are at the top of the cylinder. One is recessed under the head plug cap. There are also two base to cylinder nuts fore and aft that need to be retorqued.

No Savage owner should be without a Clymers. It's simply that good, even with the few errors.