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Message started by Seattle_Savage on 10/04/08 at 18:00:33

Title: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/04/08 at 18:00:33

I remove the cylinder head without removing the engine. I now discovered that one of the exhaust valve broke and it stick into the head of the piston. So, I need to replace the piston as well as the exhaust valve.

I would like to know if there is any possibility to remove the cylinder without pulling the engine out of the frame?

I can't find my camera, otherwise I can post picture for you to look at. Very interesting.

Any info is appreciated.

Thanks,
Seattle_Savage

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by verslagen1 on 10/04/08 at 18:01:47

You can do it, but you'll have a much easier time if you just pull it.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/04/08 at 18:08:26

Thank you! with your experience. How long does it takes to get the engine out of the frame? i took most of the thing off, but if I need to take the engine out, I now need to mess around with the left side of the engine which taking the belt out etc...

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Trippah on 10/04/08 at 18:49:33

Even though its possible to take the head off without removing the motor(in some cases), there is precious little room for a torque wrench for reassembly.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 08:36:24

This will be my project for the next few months once I have time.

Some how, one of the exhaust valve broke at the base and during the firing, it turned around and stick it into the piston head. I look at the cylinder, there was no damage, but the piston needs to be replaced and I will replace the new ring set as well.

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19261.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19271.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19281.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19291.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19301.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19311.jpg

Any idea what happens in this case?

Seattle_Savage.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/05/08 at 08:47:47

This is the 2nd dropped valve in a coouple of months..whats going on?

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 09:01:41

Hah... I feel a bit better now to know that mine is not the only case.

Seattle_Savage.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/05/08 at 11:28:24

477175477562757371140 wrote:

I can have the engine out of the frame in about half an hour, but the first time I did it took me about two to three hours. Go slow and keep the Clymers/Service manual open in front of you the entire time no matter how good of a mechanic you are.

Once you do get the engine out, definitely inspect the case for that peace of broken piston.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by saluteTOme on 10/05/08 at 16:20:19

wow, thats interesting the say the least.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 16:47:33

Hmmm what's really going on here. I'm just waiting on the last couple parts to arrive this week and I'll be finishing my rebuild. This same thing happened to me. It's been months now and many $$ and now I'm getting a little apprehensive..If this happens to me again I don't know what I'll do. Guess I might need to follow the advice of some wise members here, might be ordering some new valves and seats just in case. I REALLY wanna get back to riding!! Good luck with your rebuild man. I've rec'd a lot of advise from the members here and so far everything is going well, if you need anything just holler

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 16:53:33

I have sometime today. So, I just took the engine of the bike and dis-assembly the cylinder and took the piston out. I was not too bad, it took me about 2 hours to do so since I do not have the service manual with me and I do not have all the tools that I need.

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19321.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19331.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19341.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19351.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19361.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj66/Crystal_RX/IMG_19371.jpg

Next step will be my trip to the dealer sometime next week to get the new piston & valves.

I check the ring sets and they are still good. Do I need to replace them as well?

Seattle_Savage.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 17:07:15

Hmmm looks awful similar to my bike right now haha. I ordered all my parts from bikebandit.com. They're quick and reasonable. You can find your own stuff off their schematics without dealing with the stealer. Also, they're customer service was pretty good to me. I've places a few orders in the last few weeks cause I keep realizing I need more parts and when I talked to them fri the guy offerred to refund my shipping on the most recent order. Pretty cool

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/05/08 at 17:07:37

596F6B596B7C6B6D6F0A0 wrote:

I check the ring sets and they are still good. Do I need to replace them as well?

Seattle_Savage.

Any time you replace the piston, you MUST replace the rings, and do not forget to re-hone the cylinder.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 17:13:11

Seattle_Savage..my post starts in the rubber side down forum as "anyone have any good news for me"..don't know if you'll find any good info there but worth a look. I'll try to post some pix early this week on my progress.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 17:16:03

Thanks. i will use that post and continue with it then.

Sorry for the stupid question. How do you re-hone the cylinder?

Seattle_Savage.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 18:45:55

Find a machine shop. I got mine rehoned for $15. Was going to send it to boretech to have it done (I think it's $60 there) and was going to get the carbide bore process but already putting so much $ into this thing I think I'll wait. After I got mine rehoned I also took it to a deburring shop and had it all bead blasted...has a real nice satin finish on the head and cover now. I also polished the right and left sides of the case. I'll post some pix soon.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 19:00:39

Thanks for the info. Do I need to bring in the cylinder & piston for rehone or just the cylinder?

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/05/08 at 19:15:27

If you are just having it re-honed, all you need to do is bring in the cylinder. Now if you were boring it, then you would need both the piston and cylinder.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 19:31:45

If I go to the dealer to buy new piston & ring set, then I do not need to bore it. Right? just rehone the cylinder?

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/05/08 at 19:52:43

You will only need to bore the cylinder if you are putting in a bigger piston. But first, is the cylinder in good shape? No deep scratches or gouges?

If the cylinder is still in good shape then yes, a re-hone should be all that is required for a new stock sized piston and rings.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 19:57:26

The cylinder is still ing good shape. No cratches or gouges of any kind!

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by BurnPgh on 10/05/08 at 20:13:28

As long as "what's going on" was brought up...Seattle and Pagan what years have you got?

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 20:15:38

96 with about 12k miles..I think it was 12 but could be 14. Hmmm been so long since I've looked down at the tank haha

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/05/08 at 20:18:15

Quote:

The cylinder is still ing good shape. No cratches or gouges of any kind!

Then yes, all it needs is re-honed. It's a very simple procedure actually.

This is the type of cylinder hone I use typically referred to as a bottle brush hone.

http://imageserver.isnweb.com/BRMGBD6.jpg

It is the simplest to use. You just attach it into a drill, coat it with some oil, stick it into your cylinder and squeeze the trigger while you move it up and down. What the hone does is takes out the glaze caused by the piston rings as the engine is running and allows the new rings to seat properly.

When done you should have a bunch of minor scratches in a cross hatch pattern.

http://images.popularhotrodding.com/enginemasters/articles/hardcore/0612em_06_z+cylinder_head_honing+crosshatch_angle.jpg

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 20:42:59

Mine is 97 with 14,850 miles on it.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 20:50:55

Does any of you know if Auto parts store can rehone motorcycle cylinder?

It's weird that 88pagan's 96 and mine 97 have the same issue.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 21:23:56

Maybe I shouldn't assume..but is your name indicative of your location? If so, go to googlemaps and search "cylinder honing". There are several machine shops in the Seattle area that should be able to take care of you.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by 88pagan on 10/05/08 at 21:26:21

Now I'm back to wondering..was it just a failure of the valve that did me in...or was it something I did?? hmmm, like valves out of adjustment, running hot, etc. I don't think either of those apply to my situation though. darn I really don't want to do all this work and drop another valve

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/05/08 at 21:30:17

Thanks for the suggestion. I found what I need.

In my case, It might be too lean because it was constantly back fire through the muffler. I am going to do through out cleaning of the carb this time and see if it helps.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by verslagen1 on 10/06/08 at 07:15:00

Are you running the stock jet?

I was able to tune out the backfire by going slightly richer on the idle mixture and smoother running overall by going to 150

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/06/08 at 14:32:03

I believe it is stock. It is running fine or less backfire when i pull the choke out a bit.

Anyway, I am going to buy the berryman dip cleaner and clean the carb and see if it helps. If it not, then might be rejet it.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by Seattle_Savage on 10/07/08 at 21:47:00

A friend of mine lend me the honing tool. So, i am going to do it myself. How are you going to clean the cylinder after honing?

Any info is appreciated.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by BurnPgh on 10/07/08 at 22:11:04

aye...I've got a '95 with 14,215....now im frightened.

Title: Re: Cylinder remove
Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/07/08 at 23:03:40

5E686C5E6C7B6C6A680D0 wrote:

A friend of mine lend me the honing tool. So, i am going to do it myself. How are you going to clean the cylinder after honing?

Any info is appreciated.

Warm soap and water, then make sure it is very dry afterwords. I used a paper towel to dry and kept at it until the towel came out as clean as it went in. (you will use a lot of paper towels)