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Message started by rigidchop on 03/01/08 at 08:37:21

Title: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by rigidchop on 03/01/08 at 08:37:21

ok i have an 87 savage, started out with a 155 main, added a se slash cut muff, one of lancers filters still ran rich, tried the white spacer thing, no go . jetted it down to a 152.5 still runs a little rich, which means i should go down another size right? well here is the kicker, its starting to backfire now, usually after shutoff. which to me means a lean condition. the backfire sounds like a shotgun, with the se muff. not the little pfft like with the stock muff. what am i doing wrong? i dont think that my neighbors like the sound of shotgun blasts, neither do i.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by T Mack 1 on 03/01/08 at 09:32:51

Remember, the carb has three circuts. Low, mid and high,

Low speed is Air screw/idle mix screw.
Mid is the spacer (needle height)
High is the main jet.

To say the bike is rich, you have to think "where is it rich? "......

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by rigidchop on 03/01/08 at 12:15:08

its rich above idle. surely i dont need to increase the size of the spacer.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by JakeB on 03/01/08 at 16:51:53

If it was rich in the mid range before, then you don't need to cut down the spacer you need to make it thicker. If it's rich at idle turn in the idle mixture screw and if you can't adjust it enough go one size down on the pilot jet. If it is rich at WOT then you need to decrease the size of the mainjet.

JakeB

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by Reelthing on 03/01/08 at 17:02:36

the 87 is a different carb than the '95 and later bikes - it was not lean from the factory and does not need the needle jet raise (1/2 spacer)

did you richen up the idle mixture screw? and are you real sure you not have any air leaks at the head/header muffler/header?

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by rigidchop on 03/01/08 at 19:18:44

i dont think that i have a leak around the header, even put a new gasket in the last time that i had it off. at anything above idle it puts out black smoke. i tried to adjust the idle mixture screw and it doesnt seem to have any effect. adjusted it both ways, just to be sure.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by verslagen1 on 03/01/08 at 19:58:49

From what you say, I think you may need a larger Idle jet and a smaller main jet.

Shot gun blast at shut off means lean, on mine a 1/4 CCW fixed it.
Black smoke above idle means rich. Check your sparky, is it black?

Standard Idle screw adjustment:
Turn Clockwise to shut off, lightly or it will jam.
Turn 1 1/2 turns CCW to start with.
Adjust CCW until idle reaches peak, if you keep going it will drop off.
Helps to have a tach or a fine ear.

The other possibility why the idle can't be adjust with the idle screw is that you have the idle speed to high.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by rigidchop on 03/01/08 at 20:35:26

idle could be set too high, i guess. has a really low idle speed though. spark plug is very black. also it has always been hard to start. i would assume its partly because of the blackened plug. at first i did put in a larger idle jet and the 152 main, then put the smaller idle jet back in as it didnt seem to make any difference. the thing that really confuses me is that after putting on a free flowing muff and air filter its still running rich. those two additions should make it leaner. i think i'll change the idle and main jets again and mess with the idle screw adjustment in the a.m. also i wonder if the idle circuit could be clogged. making the idle adjustment not work.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by rigidchop on 03/02/08 at 08:59:55

the idle was set too high. also the bike didnt like the 55 pilot so i had to go back down. went down to a 150 main, and the black smoke disappeared, then i rode it a bit and i am noticing the smoke again above idle. gonna mess with the screw again. i think that will take care of it. thanks again.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by verslagen1 on 03/02/08 at 13:20:27

Even though you think the muf is free flowing, there maybe still restriction built into it, just not obvious. Also the Head and header have restriction built into them.

The sparky will tell you what to do better than the exhaust, mine is lean and I need to go up a notch on the jet. Sparky tells me so, but the muff black. I'll go up before summer comes, but she's running good, 87 uphill, and over 50 mpg.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by rigidchop on 03/02/08 at 14:37:33

the muff does have a baffle(sort of) and the plugs have always been black. gonna have to get some new ones, and read them afterwards. is starting easier though. although it was unseasonably warm today. thanks for all your help.

Title: Re: carb question (i know, i know)
Post by T Mack 1 on 03/02/08 at 14:43:18

Next time you have the carb apart, check how you reassembled the needle and spacer. .