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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Savage compared to SV650
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Message started by Bear_Rider on 01/02/08 at 18:21:17

Title: Savage compared to SV650
Post by Bear_Rider on 01/02/08 at 18:21:17

I'm still learning about motorcycles and the Savage's place in the scheme of things. How does the Savage compare to a "standard" bike like the SV650? I'm not so much concerned about the speed and power issues. They appear to weigh about the same, and I assume that the SV has more top end than the Savage.

I'm more interested in the controllability, seating posture, suitability for travel (camping), and the learning curve moving up from a 250 Rebel.

If this has been discussed before, accept my apologies. I have searched using several terms, but found nothing.

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by JakeB on 01/02/08 at 18:34:12

Just my opinion but the SV would probably handle better at higher speeds and the LS would be better at lower speeds due to its low center of gravity. Seating posture I guess would be recliner (LS) or bar stool (SV). Neither would be incredibly comfortable for travel but I'm leaning towards the LS because of the seating posture and other comfort mods that can be done (gel seat, highway pegs). The LS would be much more natural moving up from the Rebel than the SV because of the low center of gravity and the seating posture.

Hope that helps some!
JakeB

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by Max_Morley on 01/02/08 at 18:47:01

Kinda like comparing apples to oranges, they are both motorcycles but different types. The sv650 is a highly rated (by most) sport/sport touring bike, they even make those fancy aluminum panniers for them now for the dedicated traveling crowd. With the right tires-understand it is passable for off road use. The LS 650 is a highly rated thumper (just ask us) that also handles well and is just enough different to keep us happy. It is all about "smiles per smile" or "whatever spins your crank". Max

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by barry68v10 on 01/02/08 at 19:22:53

There is a strangley lop-sided comparison:

HP: SV650 wins by 35hp+
Top speed: SV650 wins by 40+
Suspension travel: Really?!? The LS650 has rear suspension travel?
MPG: LS 650 wins by 10-13 mpg
Cost: LS 650 wins by factor of 2
Looks: Hmmm, you're own opinion?
Comfort: LS 650 wins just as a Turkish prison wins over the stocks :-/
Simplicity and ease of maintenence: LS650 WINNER!
Acceptance on this site? Advantage LS650 :D
Oh, wait...I don't seem have that one :-[

And yet, despite all this, I still own one and won't part with it until I've thoroughly driven it into the ground, so to speak.

BTW, still have the title of "rounder" going. Haven't missed a single month of riding since I bought it! ;D

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by Paladin. on 01/02/08 at 20:59:30

1433372409043F323324560 wrote:

... How does the Savage compare to ... the SV650?
... They appear to weigh about the same, and I assume that the SV has more top end than the Savage.

I'm more interested in the controllability, seating posture, suitability for travel (camping), and the learning curve moving up from a 250 Rebel.

Last first: the change from a Rebel to a Savage is near nothing -- same basic size, position, etc..

The Savage is a "cruiser" with the "rocking chair" seating position you are used to from the Rebel. The SV has you sitting much higher, with a forward lean that puts part of your upper body weight on your wrists/hands, knees bent to place your feet under you. A position I find very uncomfortable, especially the knees, YMMV. If you're young you might be able to get use to it.

In my humble opinion, NOTHING is more important than being comfortable on the bike. Everything else can be made to work. The "controlability" of the motorcycle depends greatly on how you and the bike fit together. If the fit is perfect you will have greater control than on a "better" bike that does not fit you.

For travel/camping: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1177262289 -- http://paladin.savageriders.com/LA-OKC/RestStop-Flagstaff.jpg -- I have a pair of 18-quart hard bags, the 21"x 14.5"x 7.5" Airline-Carry-On suitcase, and a roll on the pillion with the camping gear. I'm planning on building a trailer hitch (3/16" x 1.5" x 18" steel bars mounted between the saddlebags and the side rails, sockets to take the dropdown/back hitch) and a trailer (using Savage front wheels!). Seeing what people haul in sidecar configuration I see no problem with hauling 300 pounds of gear on a 100 pound trailer. Ya know how comfy you can be camping with a 300 pound payload!

The Savage, with very little effort, cruises at 85. Going to OKC I ran 65-70 very comfortably.

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by Bear_Rider on 01/02/08 at 21:36:31

Paladin,

Your points on posture are well taken. I'm not young, and I have a ruptured lower disk. My knees don't like to bend, and although I can handle just about any sort of ride so long as I can maintain the arch in my lower back, bending forward can take out that arch very quickly.

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/03/08 at 02:08:42

The move from a CMX250 Rebel to an LS650 Savage/S40 is as natural as breathing! 8-)

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by smokin_blue on 01/03/08 at 03:01:23

4E696D7E535E6568697E0C0 wrote:

With your back you might want to think long and hard. For me a crusier style is very hard on a back. My dad is 76 and the surgeons that look at his MRI don't see how he still functions. He still rides an SV (2001 model) and has done some very long days (300-400 miles). What you need to watch is what year you are looking at. He has an '01 standard so the bars are slightly higher than the SV650S model which had clip ons. I don't know if the standard bar option is available any more. As long as the bars are about 1-2" above the triple clamp you end up with a comfortable seating positision. On the standard model the pegs were in a very low position but yet under you and a slight lean to the bars. He was always a GS rider and afraid of that position but I rode that style for years and assured him he would like it. Like I say, as long as the bars aren't too low you really don't put much weight on your rists and at highway speed it is very neutral. The key will be what year you are looking at buying. There are a ton of older models (look at the frame difference (round tube vs angular)) if you want to pick up a used one and save the depreciation.

As far as power and handling it will out rock a savage in the twisties and top end but if your style is slightly more relaxed (which it sounds like it is) the savage does wonderful. The key of course to power is usable power. The savage has tractor pulling low end. The SV is more low to mid with a solid hit on top. My '86 GSXR is all top end. I drag raced my dad on the highway from a stop light up to 70 mph (my '86 GSXR750 to his '01 SV650).

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by smokin_blue on 01/03/08 at 03:05:00

(Continued) He ran right with me from 0-70. He went through 3 gears to my 2 up to 70. Of course from there to 130 I would have had the upper hand but now you are out of "streetable" range.

All said. go sit on some. Better yet find someone that has one if possible and ride it. One question I would ask is how are you doing with the rebel? Is that comfortable? If not I would go find an older style standard SV (not the sport) to sit on and see what you think.

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by barry68v10 on 01/03/08 at 04:45:52

I agree with Smokin_Blue. There is soooo much preference and give and take involved. The most comfortable position to me is a dirt bike. Naturally I should prefer a dual sport right? On the road, the high profile is a curse. Cross-winds and semi's blow you all over the place. Not so with the LS650. Although I've known a couple riders to take several thousand mile trips on a dual-sport riding two-up...

I took a 200-mile trip with a combined weight of rider, passanger and gear of around 450 lbs. Still cruised at a part-throttle 70mph on the highway and got around 60 mpg. 8-)

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by Polar_Pilot on 01/04/08 at 15:02:33

Hate to say this but there really is not comparison.between the LS650/S40 and the SV650.
The two bikes are aimed at entirely different styles of riding/
The s40 is a cruiser - you do not want to be on it for hours at a time. This is not to say you cannot, just add a Lazyrider or Protac backrest and an Airhawk seat pad and you are good to go for an Ironbutt if you choose.

But if you want to travel - several long days in a roll with thousands of miles to cover - go for the SV650. The riding position lends itself to hard highway running and the wind helps keep the pressure off your shoulders neck and spine.

The bikes are really not comparable so there is only one real solution.

Get one of each and then you have the best of both worlds!!!!

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by drharveys on 01/04/08 at 20:53:51

Gotta clear up a misunderstanding -- you should not have any weight on your hands when riding anything short of an all out race or track bike, and I'm not sure if you should even on them. The correct riding position on a sport or sport/touring bike is actually the basic athletic position -- knees bent, body bent at the hips (not the waist), back straight or slightly arched. On the bike, when you raise your hands, the bars should fit right there. This is very much the position used when riding a horse with an English saddle. It's also, except for the hands, close to the position of an outfielder, or a golfer addressing the ball.

When I had my BMW R1150RS, if my hands started tingling, I knew I had to arch my back.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/drharveys/img_3487.jpg

Killboy caught me in good form last May! In that wet, I had zero weight on the handlebars.

Title: Re: Savage compared to SV650
Post by Bear_Rider on 01/05/08 at 12:29:37

Thanks to all.

I'm beginning to understand part of my confusion. I have two bikes - a TW200 Dual Purpose, and the Rebel. The Rebel is a MUCH better road bike than the TW200. It's enough faster than the TW that it's comforatble in traffic, and quieter -- thus much less stress. However, around town and on secondary roads, the TW is more comfortable to sit on for long periods. I've been blaming this on the Rebel's saddle, which even many of the most diehard fans detest, but this may not be the real problem. You have given me a good deal of food for thought concerning my intended use and my physical limitations.