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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> New camchain snapped /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1193066353 Message started by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 08:19:12 |
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Title: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 08:19:12 That's right, the brand new camchain I had installed on the FireLizard, snapped on my way home from work Saturday night. I didn't even have 50 miles on that chain. >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( If the Suzi Stealership that sold me the chain is open today, I will be confronting them with this and try to make them replace it at no cost. If they don't, I just may be tempted to strangle them with it. (Not really, but it sure is a nice thought) |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by SteveRocket on 10/22/07 at 08:27:53 that's outrageous!! They should pay to have it fitted as well. (Fat chance I know) Steve |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by verslagen1 on 10/22/07 at 09:01:40 1st, remember that the stealership only sells parts doesn't make them. Don't shoot the courier. 2... They represent the mfgr, so give 'em 'ell. Do you have it openned yet? show us pict's of the snap. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Savage_Greg on 10/22/07 at 09:44:57 Yes, photos before anything else. BTW - how did the bike behave when this happened? What did it do? |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 11:29:02 Unfortunately my digi camera has dead batteries, and I have already took the snapped chain back to the stealership. The only person there has only been working there for 2 days and the manager won't be in until tomorrow. He kept the chain to show his manager and to ask her what they can do for me. The bike was running very sweetly. I took off from a traffic light like I normally do, which is to say I pulled out easily. (after all I have new rings and wanted to seat them in correctly before I do anything stupid) I got about five hundred feet when the engine died. It just died, no warning what so ever. Called the wife to bring the truck, got home, and yesterday I took off the head cover and pulled the chain right out from the top of the engine no binding or anything. The stealership is supposed to call me in the morning, (hopefully before I go to work) and let me know what they can do. I hope they can just give me a new one at no cost and then apologize to me profusely. (apology is optional, but new free chain is not) I wish my camera's batteries weren't dead, because I really was going to a pic and post it. I won't even be able to post a pic if they give the chain back to me because I look to be losing my internet access tomorrow. I'll just have to go to the library to check the board, but I won't be able to upload anything. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by verslagen1 on 10/22/07 at 14:50:58 So, what was the mode of failure? Links pulled thru pins? (cutting pins into many pieces) Pins pulled thru links? (cutting slots into links) Links snap? (links break into 2) |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Savage_Greg on 10/22/07 at 15:20:47 How old was your cam chain tensioner? |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 15:52:20 Savage_Greg wrote:
The tensioner was brand new. I replaced it when I replaced the camchain, guides as well. So, what was the mode of failure? Links pulled thru pins? (cutting pins into many pieces) Pins pulled thru links? (cutting slots into links) Links snap? (links break into 2) verslagen, I believe it was choice number two. Links destroyed |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Reelthing on 10/22/07 at 16:13:06 So did you luck out with the piston/valves ? |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 16:19:23 Haven't pulled the head itself off yet, but preliminary investigation shows that I may have lucked out. The camchain broke on the exhaust stroke so there wasn't a bunch of compression to lock the engine up. The exhaust valves were open. Part of the preliminary investigation was the old screw driver in the spark plug hole trick. I did not feel anything untoward as I turned the engine over by hand and watched and felt the screwdriver going up and down. Later I will be removing the head and taking a closer look. But on the plus side, when I tried to fire it back up after it died, I did not hear any rattling or banging from the bottom end or from the cylinder itself. With extreme luck, I should just have to replace the chain and get my knees back in the breeze. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 16:27:00 By the way, if my piston and valves are boogered, I think I'll try to get them to replace those for free as well. After all, they were perfectly fine before the camchain gave way. But we'll have to see first. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 17:44:59 Lucked out, piston, head, and valves okay. whew!!! |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Reelthing on 10/22/07 at 17:56:00 That's great! - if they would all break like that sure wouldn't be all the concern about them. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/22/07 at 18:58:10 With all the problems I've been having. I think my Gremlin Bell needs to be recharged. ;) ;) |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by LANCER on 10/23/07 at 03:54:36 I have been praying for your situation, favor with the dealership and removal of your mechanical demons. Be at peace. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by verslagen1 on 10/23/07 at 07:05:14 YonuhAdisi wrote:
So there my friends is the source of our troubles... soft links! Most likely someone got a deal on material. Or they have to use softer material on the worn out dies. Boooooo! Hisssss! >:( |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 10/23/07 at 09:16:29 The Stealership just called, no dice on letting me have a new chain at no cost especially since I can't find my receipt for when I bought it. So the FireLizard is down for a good long while. Can't afford a new chain and gasket kit. Spent all I had to rebuild her in the first place. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/23/07 at 10:00:35 YonuhAdisi wrote:
If you bought this chain at this stealership, then they should have a record of this. Most of them are now computerized for processing parts and they have your name and address in there. I would not let this die. I would tell that parts manager in no uncertain terms that if this is how they stand behind the products they sell, then I would never do any kind of business with them in the future, and make it my life's ambition to convey that sentiment to any and all fellow bikers I may run across. Like everything in life, if no one is held accountable, then there is no account of BS that will be perpetrated upon you. Good luck and give em hell! |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by verslagen1 on 10/23/07 at 11:32:45 You mean they can't remember you from a month ago? And they wonder why you don't go back? |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by T-Mack1 on 10/23/07 at 13:41:49 Like Rogue_Cheddar says, give the dealer He11. Hint: Do it when they're busy. Get real loud that you bought an expensive part and it was defective. Now they want to forget who you are. .... You will see them get real cooperative quickly to quiet you down. They don't want you to affect sales..... How did you pay. Cash, check or credit card. The check or credit card would have a paper trail. Makes for a vaild reason for using those "Check cards" for payments. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by bill67 on 10/23/07 at 14:17:25 If your bikes not stock I dont think the dealership will pay for it. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by islandwahine on 10/23/07 at 14:21:40 Can you remember the date you bought it? If not think back, was there anything else going on that day that might trigger your memory? If it does, was it morning or afternoon? If you do remember, tell them to pull out the register copy for that day (if they are not computerized) and have them look for the amount of cam chain. The register receipt has the time on it. Chances that someone else bought a chain on that day and in that time frame are so slim that they'll have to take your word for it. If yours was the only purchase recently for a chain, than they can also verify through inventory. I worked retail many years and know what goes on behind the scenes. Good luck and raise a stink!!! |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Bear_Rider on 10/23/07 at 16:09:10 Copy the url of this thread on a slip of paper and give it to the manager: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=RubberSideDown;action=display;num=1193066353 Let him come to his own conclusions about what repercussions his actions (or lack of same) will have on him and his business. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Oldfeller2 on 10/23/07 at 19:44:48 If he doesn't want to give you satisfaction, then the cam chain in question still belongs to you. Recover it from the dealership. Go get it. If they don't want to give it back to you then something is seriously wrong. I think something IS wrong with current crop of cam chains running around the motorcycle world (apart from the fact they are not the premium cam chain that IS available, they are the standard heat treated steel construction w/out nitridization of the pins). I think somebody shaved some pennies buying chain and has made a reliability pooper scooper event for Suzuki. Or else somebody in the replacement parts world is peddling some rip-off chains (yes, Morse is aware that people in China and Indonesia are selling rip-off chains that are stamp marked "M" for Morse) that are exhibiting early failure characteristics. Post the name and phone number of the dealership. Post the name of the person you deal with if they won't give you back your chain. Post the name of the person that you talk to at Suzuki of America when you call them about this issue. How many letters/emails to Suzuki of America will it take to get this fixed? How many emails directly to Suzuki of Japan? How many "letters to the editor" sent to major motorcycle magazines? Having cam chains quit this early isn't a joking matter any more. There are too many of them now. No motorcycle brand name wants their "fan base" pissed off at them. We are tracking the early failures of these "current crop" cam chains. We have people charting the failures in failure tables. Suzuki America/Japan should be wanting the chain back for analysis. If they are not astute enough to volunteer to analyze the failure mode (and offer a replacement chain in exchange) then perhaps we will have to do it. ============= Now, is there anything you haven't told us? Did you have ANY issues when installing the chain? Were there any signs of stressed or dented areas on the new chain? Are any of the links motions "stiff" as has been described recently? Was the chain packaged in Suzuki OEM packaging? Oldfeller |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by SteveRocket on 10/23/07 at 20:40:07 Did you post up on the site here the day you got it running?. That might give you the idea to when you bought it. Not sure on the law over here but at some places the receipt is not required esp if you paid by card. and if you paid by by credit card they may have some say in the matter. I would that helps a little Steve |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by youzguyz on 10/24/07 at 01:54:13 My two cents worth ( and not worth much more). 1. Get that busted chain back ASAP before they "lose" it. Probably shouldn't have given it to them until you had the replacement, but hindsight is 20-20. 2. You only have one reason for them to replace it (it broke). They have a thousand and one "excuses" why they shouldn't. Work was not done by them, you did something wrong putting it in (we know you didn't, but can you prove it to them?), you didn't torque the fritzjammer to 3.141579 ft/lb, you tightened the bolts in the wrong pattern, etc, etc. 3. Do what pushing you can as others have stated, at least to get your money back for at least the chain itself. Good luck! |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Oldfeller2 on 10/24/07 at 04:06:50 There is another good reason to get the cam chain back from the dealership -- you need to "put it back together" on a clean white piece of paper with any loose pieces you took out of the motor simply to figure out if you got ALL the little bitty broken pieces out of the motor. When the cam chain is assembled at the factory it uses a "staking link" (identical to all the rest of the staking pins except it is put together at a separate staking station" The staking link is made up of four discrete parts and you need to find ALL of them or you have steel available inside your motor to do more damage. If a working link broke you may have a total of 8 little pieces available to chase down. Have you rolled all your gear forms examining them under a strong light looking for DAMAGE? When a chain snaps, there are things available to get jammed in the gear forms and give them lasting damage. Examine the nearby gears for damage. If you ran some of these bits through your main gears you may have damaged them also. If this happened, check your cases for cracking while you have it down & open. Oldfeller |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 12/21/07 at 17:54:16 Update on camchain issue: I finally found the receipt and took it to them. All they were willing to do was credit my card with the price of the chain. (at least they did that much). They had all ready threw out the chain I brought them. I am still gonna completely tear down my engine so I can make dang sure there are no little pieces of camchain lying in wait to ambush my motor. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by T Mack 1 on 12/21/07 at 21:04:09 695F5E45587154594359300 wrote:
I take it you know the cardboard routine when taking the thing apart. Draw a picture of what the bolts are coming from, then as you take them off, poke them in the appropriate spot on the drawing. Makes reassembly a breeze. .....aaahhh the smell of Brake cleaner and Gunk degreaser....what memories....Good luck |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by Savage_Greg on 12/22/07 at 06:52:44 Did you ever get photos of the busted chain? |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 12/23/07 at 12:15:08 093C2B2911787B7E4E0 wrote:
Unfortunately no, I really wish I had before I took it up to them. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by KenGLong on 12/23/07 at 13:29:11 At least you're getting a store credit for the broken chain. Considering that they didn't install it, that was pretty fair of them to do that for you. Ken |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by verslagen1 on 12/23/07 at 13:34:47 My guess would be that a couple of links got c0cked and jamed between the gear and the case. Look for evidence in the lead in areas on the case. You might see 2 indents where the chain smacked into the case. :o |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by YonuhAdisi on 12/30/07 at 21:16:38 Okay, I got very lucky, was able to get a very good look inside the case and I have discovered that there is no loose pieces of the snapped chain in there, the inside of the case is very clean and free of debris. |
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Title: Re: New camchain snapped Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/30/07 at 21:52:31 Coolniss, still wouldnt hurt to run a magnet around on everything you can. |
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