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Message started by J Mac on 09/15/07 at 10:33:32

Title: Wide open stall
Post by J Mac on 09/15/07 at 10:33:32

Hello friends,

2003 Savage, no mods at all, 2700 miles, Houston TX area

I "experienced" my 2nd wide-open stall in about 2 weeks last night. Losing all power at 70 MPH is not a good feeling. Fortunately, both times this happened I had a huge shoulder to pull onto and light traffic. Last night I even pulled onto some tall grass until it started to burn on the pipe :P. The first time this happened, I thought it was rain-related, because it was my first ride in heavier rain on this bike. I may or may not have messed with the petc0ck and put it on reserve for lack of any other ideas. I was able to resume after 2 minutes, and water diagnosis later didn't turn up much. Well, last night, I couldn't get the bike to turn over, so I thought I'd put it on reserve, even though I had topped off 30 minutes before after running out of gas and kicking it into reserve (I had returned it to "on" position after topping off the gas). Anyway, after the stall and putting it on RES, it fired up and acted normally (in spite of my riding with the choke on for 10 minutes :P). This sounds like a problem with the petChicken, or maybe the fuel screen, right? Or could it be water in the tank? I'm open to suggestions. Something tells me I'll be popping that tank off, but I'd like to avoid it. I'd like to avoid 70mph freeway stalls too... ha ha.

By the way, I've found out a quick way to identify a biker who is "all hat and no cattle". You mention riding and the rain and see if you get the reply, "Oh, I've never ridden in the rain." None of us want to start out in the rain, but if it rains somewhere along the way, "oh well." Thanks!!

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by demin on 09/15/07 at 10:45:38

check the vacuum hose that goes from the intake to the petchicken(I like that).It is controlled by vacuum.I had a Virago that would do the same thing.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by serowbot on 09/15/07 at 10:52:47

Does it sputter and stop(fuel) or just cut out instantly(electric)?

Check that your kickstand is not coming down. If you hit a bump, or if it droops or sticks down a little bit, maybe your foot catches it, etc..,the switch behind it will stall the bike.

Otherwise, you're probably on the right track with a gas problem.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by verslagen1 on 09/15/07 at 13:16:26

My guess is the petcork (my fav).

Just a little leak in the vacuum line will make a marginal condition catastrophic. Since you menstioned WOT, I think the vacuum tap is in a spot where vacuum is minimum at WOT and max at idle. So combine wot and a little or even no leak and you plain run out of juice. At 70 it don't take long.

My fix has been to run in secondary all the time. Yes, the other name for that is reserve.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/15/07 at 16:40:07

I thought it would have to be on Prime, rather than Reserve, since Reserve requires vacuum, like Run does, right?

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by T-Mack1 on 09/15/07 at 17:09:45

Agreed with verslagen1.......WOT is low vac. Back in th e'70s they put vacuum gauges on cars to watch fuel usage. Plus at 70 mph the bowl will drain fast.

Plus....it's a easy check, inspect the Petc0ck vac hose. If that's good, then drain the tank and check the screen.

After that get back to us.......Better to checkoff the easy stuff first.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by J Mac on 09/15/07 at 17:33:28

Thanks, brothers. Serowbot, the cutoff is instant "enough". I can't say whether it dies at the same rate as if I hit the kill switch. After it died, it would NOT fire up until I messed with the petRock. Then all was well. The stand switch crossed my mind, but this was on a beautiful piece of asphalt with no bumps. Demin and T-Mack1, I looked at the vac hose a while back and today. It has a springy sheath around it and looks OK, except I hate those chintzy mouse-ear clips they use on it. This bike is still like-new. The vac hose does appear to kink or buckle some after the petRock tube ends; maybe I should look for a stiffer hose. Verslagen1, thanks for the tip about running on SEC. I may do that to get rid of some of the fuel in the tank before checking the screen. I'll get back to y'all, thanks again.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by islandwahine on 09/15/07 at 18:04:25

demin wrote:

check the vacuum hose that goes from the intake to the petchicken(I like that).It is controlled by vacuum.I had a Virago that would do the same thing.

Remember mine did the same! Only it stalled in the middle of a 180 curve, and I was lucky to press the starter and had it start again all while having the bike angled to the right in the curve. It died again a few yards later but at least I was going straight then. It kept on happening every few miles until I got home. I ended up replacing the vacuum hose and have not had it happen since.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by longmi01 on 09/17/07 at 21:54:56

Hi,
I've been experiencing the same problem on my longer rides (more than a half hour). I had been wondering if this was an electrical problem(spark plug, etc.), but after reading about the vacuum line and what it does, I have been thinking that this was my problem. Today I took apart my petcock to see if there was anything that was restricting flow, but I found nothing but a slight bit of grit at the bottom of the tank. I have no reason to believe that restricted flow to the carb is the reason for my stalling after going WOT after seeing that there was nothing blocking the fuel's way to the engine. Is this really my problem?

I have recently rejetted the carb to a 152.5 and a half white spacer, but no aftermarket exhaust. Could this have anything to do with my problem, even though this happened before I made the adjustments? Do I need to get a more free flowing exhaust (I plan to anyway in the next few months)? Let me know, and thanks for welcoming me to the wonderful world of the Savage!

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by slavy on 09/17/07 at 23:24:31

It sounds like running out of gas. It is possible that there is a slight build-up arounf the fuel valve screen. It has happened to me on a different bike.
May be a good idea to pull out the valve and make sure that it is clean .
The next thing is to try riding the boke WOT in PRI and see what will hapen.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by mornhm on 09/18/07 at 05:10:55

WOT and a single cylinder = single carb is not going to going to give you much warning before quitting due to fuel starvation. Makes it harder to differentiate between fuel and electrical shutdown. If the problem only occurs at WOT I suspect fuel starvation. Which implies petcock (my favorite - wonder why "they" thought thingie would be an improvement) or vacuum problem.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by barry68v10 on 09/18/07 at 13:57:43

I concur, petc0ck, fuel screen, or vac line.

I had all the same symptoms with my 1997. Did the petc0ck conversion and removed the screen, nary a problem since...and that was about 4000 miles ago.

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by longmi01 on 09/19/07 at 11:04:04

I assume you guys are talking about the screen that is on the long part of the petc0ck that sticks up into the gas tank? When you removed that, did you put an in-line fuel filter as well?

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by islandwahine on 09/19/07 at 18:41:25

I was wondering about that as well! otherwise all the cr_p from the tank gets in the carb doesn't it?

Title: Re: Wide open stall
Post by J Mac on 09/19/07 at 20:13:04

Thanks to all for the suggestions. I took the vacuum line off, and it seemed kind of junky and brittle and did have a couple of tiny holes towards the ends. Since the holes would sit above the flared portion of the metal tubes, I'm not sure why there would be a leak. Then again, those little mouse-ear clips don't do much to seal anything. I then went to a couple of auto parts stores, and all they had was 3/16" fuel line. I installed a piece of Goodyear fuel line today and used real hose clamps. There wasn't really enough clearance on the carb side connection to set the clamp properly, but I did my best. There is barely enough clearance to use the thick fuel line at all, but it should last forever. To make a long story short, I took the bike out tonight and brought it up to 80 a couple times. There was no sign of fuel starvation, and there was still throttle left. I can't imagine wanting to go 80 too often on a bike that light, but it's possible. Later . . .