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Message started by Robertomoe on 09/07/07 at 19:37:57

Title: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Robertomoe on 09/07/07 at 19:37:57

I've been having troubles with my recently aquired Savage

the first night, I drained the battery. I successfully got it push started later on but I didnt run it long enough to be able to electrically start. I later got it started again and ran it for about half an hour and it finally had enough charge to get going. I checked that by starting up the bike, then I shut it off for the night, but it happened to not start again. I got it bump started and rode it around for about an hour before my shifting rod snapped, forcing me to park it for a few days. Now I have the new shift rod installed and it will not start. The lights on the bike appear to be shining strong (unlike when I was trying to start it the morning after I drained it) but when I try to start the bike I can hear the clicking/grinding noise of the starter and see the lights dimming. When I try to bump start the bike, the motor will pop once or twice then freeze up.

I have a video of the sound the bike makes, but can anyone tell what the problem is?

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/07/07 at 21:14:18

Yep, yer battery is toast, or at least needing charged. Testing a battery to see if it will start the bike, knowing it is "Iffy" ( which is the only reason to test it) is asking for trouble. The drain created by starting it wasnt replaced by run time. It was barely strong enough to start it & then after that, it didnt get recharged. Try charging it. If that doesnt get it, pull the battery & take it to be tested. Having a battery checker, both load tester & hygrometer, to know the specific gravity & a load tester to check the charge AND condition of the plates & their ability to provide strong current, not just voltage is a good thing. That stuff is good to have even if there are no bikes in the garage. I am not sure about this, but I am kinda of the opinion that it is hard on the charge circuit to run a near dead battery, since the charge circuit then has so much current passing thru it, as it charges the battery. Restoring the charge in a battery after starting is one thing. Recharging one that is as close to dead as possible is another. Who has sufficient knowledge/experience/understanding of the circuit & load to teach me how this works?

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by drums1 on 09/07/07 at 23:00:24

Well, on a car, the alternator maintains the charge in the battery. It is not a battery charger, as such. It even tells you in the instructions to make sure you have a fully charged battery before installing new alternator. If not, it causes the alternator to put out too many amps, causing it to overheat and then burns out bearings and new alternator is junk. Not exactly the same on a bike, I know, but same concept.
You'd be surprised what a new battery will do for a bike. I went from standing there looking at it saying "what the f___"?, to saying "It runs" !!
I would try a new battery 1st, before condemning anything else.

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by drharveys on 09/10/07 at 03:15:07

DON'T try to squeeze that last engine turnover out of a dying battery! There may be just enough power left to burn out a relay. I don't know if that's what happens on the Savage, but it sure did on my BMW K-75!

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Reelthing on 09/10/07 at 06:14:07

check the battery voltage - some where around 12.3v or maybe 12.28v it no longer has enough to fire the ign module properly

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by slavy on 09/10/07 at 07:27:02

Don't hesitate- just bite the bullet and buy a new sealed battery. All of a sudden after that the life will get better. You might have to change the spark plug, because it might be covered with sludge from the numerous attempts to start the bike without of spark.
But first thing, try to start it with the old spark plug and try to save your self the hassle. If it happens to replace the plug, don't install back the RR spark plug cover bolt /check for this mod in the technical section/ and this will help in the future.
Also when installing the new battery, take Your time and install a jumper lead on the + terminal- again for the future.

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by FreeSpirit on 09/10/07 at 09:17:27

[quote
Also when installing the new battery, take Your time and install a jumper lead on the + terminal- again for the future.[/quote]

You just need to put a charger lead on the + terminal?
Not on the negative also? Or are you saying the + and -?

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Reelthing on 09/10/07 at 09:58:36

you can use most any unpainted part of the bike for the ground

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by FreeSpirit on 09/10/07 at 16:46:03

But you can go ahead and put/leave the negative and postive charger leads on the battery,right?

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Reelthing on 09/10/07 at 20:25:23

you bet - I've seen some of the trickle chargers with quick connect adapters that stay on the battery - s far as I can tell if you put a AGM battery and ride the bike every now and then you really don't need a charger on it as they hold the charge much longer

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Savage_Rob on 09/11/07 at 04:52:14

The Battery Tender Jr. comes with a set you permanently attach to your battery with a connector to attach to the charger (which I keep coiled up under my seat). In addition, it comes with a set of the more standard clamps that also attach the the connector on the charger's cord. It's small and won't overcharge your battery. The cord's connector is "polarized" so you don't have to worry about reconnecting it backwards once you've got it permanently attached to your battery.

http://batterytender.com/images/Battery_Tender_Jr.jpe

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Robertomoe on 09/11/07 at 18:00:14

I should mention that the battery is relatively new (last 6 months)

so after a few days of scrounging around for tools, I finally found a random stranger with a socket wrench to get that darn seat off the bike.

after some more struggling with stripped screws, the battery is out-

Im going to find my way to autozone soon, but several things are quickly apparent

It's a sealed battery
There is plenty of fluid, in fact, the battery is filled anywhere from 1/4 to 1/2 inch above the Upper Level.
The cells on the - side are more full than the cells on the + side (each cell getting more full as you go from + to -)

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by T-Mack1 on 09/11/07 at 19:42:12

So, while the batery is out, charge it. I saw somewhere that a new battery will show 12v and start the bike at first but isn't "fully" charged. Maybe yours is that way.

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Robertomoe on 09/11/07 at 19:55:10

yeah, I figured something like that

however, should I be concerned about these levels?

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by T-Mack1 on 09/12/07 at 05:47:24

On some batteries the plastic between the cells doesn't go all the way up. You may want to try to tip it (be gentle), pivoting on the long side, and see if they level out. If not, the levels you state shouldn't be a problem.

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by Robertomoe on 09/13/07 at 21:31:08

ok, had the battery checked out

only pumping 9 volts, had it charged at autozone

after putting it back in...

the bike still wont start and every time the bike attempts to turn over there is a single loud click from the top of the cylinder. I have another video which Ill put up (mostly just shows the sound)

Title: Re: bike wont start, even when pushed
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/14/07 at 10:26:25

That single loud click is the decompression solenoid, normal stuff. slap a battery in it, a new one, a gel cell.