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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Battery+checks for beginner /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1188195612 Message started by FreeSpirit on 08/26/07 at 23:20:12 |
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Title: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/26/07 at 23:20:12 Need a little help or direction: Ok, being new to all this still....I started out more trying to learn to ride and didnt pay much attention to the Bike checks and maintenance stuff,etc.....mainly because I had just paid alot for someone to check my bike over beforehand,change the oil,etc. Well,today,thinking that I should already have known how to check things!I decided to learn. I was going to check the oil,which the manual says to start it,let it idle a few minutes beforehand and I probably drained my battery from repeatedly trying to start it when it wouldnt start....so I got my manual out and started looking over things.... (First of all I did do a search on this site and tried to find info and couldnt,but if anyone can direct me to these answers/previous posts on,I would appreciate it.) But,I tried to check my battery window and saw nothing but a battery sticker!I dont know what kind of battery I have even,but I "thought" previous owner said he had just bought it...but...anyway,I wouldnt have expected to see only a sticker thru the window! All it says is something about battery acid or something. Then I tried to check the oil in the meantime and with a 2x4 piece,that someone said to use,I put the kickstand on it to lift the bike and it was barely showing oil....maybe wasnt upright enough,maybe because I hadnt started it yet....dont know. Also, I wondered about oil....should you always put the same kind/type of oil in it....to add to or can you use a different kind. I think the mechanic used synthetic oil when changing it. Any direction would be much appreciated......and I am going to buy/order the Clymers Manual this week in hopes that I can find more stuff on my own :-) But until then......Thanks for any help! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/27/07 at 00:57:15 The shop needs to tell you what oil they put in, so you can top it off. Sounds like you need to get a small charger on it. Some have said not to charge these little batteries with a full on car charger. Limit the charge to about 6 amps. I dont know about it, but it cant hurt to be easy on it. If it's that hard to start, something is wrong. If you want to check oil, idling isnt the way to warm it up. Go for a ride. When ya get back, park on a level place & get where there is good light on the side of the bike. Hold it so the handlebar just cant quite decide if it needs held up or down, then, its as straight up & down as it can be. Look in the window as you do this. It gets easier with practice, kinda like putting yer foot behind your head & standing on the other leg,, easy! If it's a new battery, ask whoever put it in to give ya the scoop on it.There are a few modifications that you will want to make, I imagine, They accomplish more than juist the mods, they allow you to get used to messing with the bike. It's a fun & easy bike to own & maintain. Welcome. Don't let that battery sit around discharged, thats bad for them. Maybe get it out & take it to Autozone or ABC & have them charge it, just remind them its not a 150 amp hour battery & maybe slow is good. It isnt too hard to get out, remember, negative lead first. If you knock a wrench on the frame getting the neg lead off, no sparks, The other one, not so friendly. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 01:51:30 Thanks! Forgot to mention,it was my fault on letting the battery run down....I think,not sure....but I was not going to ride the bike,so I tried to start it ,with the kickstand down just to let it idle(forgot not to do this)...it turned over but wouldnt start,(actually I didnt think though that it would even turn over if kickstand was down !?) When I realized what I did,I tried to start it the right way....but just turned over a few times and then nothing. Plus it had not been started in a few/4-5 days. Also, when you check the battery window,should you see a sticker there on the battery blocking the view?I thought the window just showed the water level. Dumber question: Do you have to take the battery out to add water.....I'm hoping the answer is "No" :-) Looks hard to get to. But ...yes,it is fun to learn about your motorcycle and be able to do things yourself. I ordered the clymers Manual....can't wait til I get it, the service manual is only very little help! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 01:59:45 Sorry,I meant the owners manual is only very little help:-) I checked my reciept from mechanic...it only says 2 quarts oil 10-40(materials used)(not the type of oil) and complete inspection(ok). |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 08/27/07 at 02:15:16 Hi FreeSprit, I hope this is not the case with yours, but when I bought my bike the previous owner had purchased the wrong battery for it, so they stuck in in backward so the + and- would reach the cables, which put the sticker in front of the window, and jammed the overflow valve against the case on the inside. The bike occasionally would not start either, or was hard to start. Haven't had that problem since I bought the right battery. Taking the battery out is no big deal! First take off seat, and then just take toolbox cover off (shiny rectangular box thing on the right side) remove the few screws that hold on the toolbox (2 on bottom 1 on top), and you can see the battery. Here comes the tricky part, remove the clamp on the left side (when you are sitting on the bike left) first!! I made the mistake off thinking the negative was on the other side and boy you should have seen it spark!! The screw on the left battery clamp is easier to get to if you remove that big fat hose that blocks your way when you try to stick the Philips screwdriver in from the top. The hose is just clamped on. But is is possible without removing it. Once you got the left clamp off, you can go and remove the right (a lot easier!!) What I did the second time around was screwing the screw back in, because the tiny square nuts that hold the screw can slide out when you pull the battery out. I lost mine inside the bike, turns out it was in one of the groves of the belt! OY! The manual explains it pretty good, even though I had a bit of a hard time figuring out some of the pics. Good luck! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 02:50:50 Hi islandwahine, You wrote: when I bought my bike the previous owner had purchased the wrong battery for it, so they stuck in in backward so the + and- would reach the cables, which put the sticker in front of the window, and jammed the overflow valve against the case on the inside. Me-Thanks,I knew that did not look right...the sticker! But what is the overflow valve? And youre right,the pictures in the owners manual....(well to put it in better word than I was going to say)....are screwy :-) I can't tell what is what in those pics. I never had a problem getting it started though until today. Thanks for the instructions :-) Hope I can do it! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/27/07 at 09:17:51 Someone here recommended a syringe for adding the distilled water to the battery. It IS the best answer. It allows for real control & wont just cover the hole & run everywhere without going in. How Does water Do that anyway? No, No, I really dont want a physics lesson,, sorry I asked. If that battery is toast, get a gel pack type. Big Crank, about $50.00. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 08/27/07 at 10:46:18 FreeSpirit wrote:
I'm not sure if it is called an overflow valve or vent or??? But the battery that comes with the bike has a little bump on one side with a tube attached to it, it vents out something (don't ask me what!). I bought a battery without one of those, I'm not sure what kind, but it was about $90! OY! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by skatnbnc on 08/27/07 at 11:33:18 For more info about this AND photos, check out the thread NOT a battery question? (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=RubberSideDown;action=display;num=1176427367) which covers a lot of your questions. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 12:01:38 Did anyone answer this previous question? "Do you have to take the battery out to add water.....I'm hoping the answer is "No" I see instructions for taking it out....that's good. But...you dont have to take it out to add water do you? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Savage_Rob on 08/27/07 at 12:29:18 I think it'd probably be easier than anything else. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by skatnbnc on 08/27/07 at 13:04:34 FreeSpirit wrote:
Um, sorry but the answer is YES, and Savage Rob is being a little sarcastic there. ;) Step-by-step is on the Tech Section. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 08/27/07 at 13:06:51 Free Spirit, Take the tool box cover off, get a flashlight and look. I would think that it would need to come out. there's not too much room in there. I can't say from experience thought, because mine came with a new batteryand it's one size larger (a model "...15..") and it just barely fits. A little scary how close the terminal gets when pushing in. Thank goodness it it's a sealed type. And it works...... |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 13:30:21 skatnbnc wrote:
Apparently I am not a great searcher.....where in the tech forum is it? Under Batteries? Also maybe would be a good idea to have a "newbie section" in the tech forum.....or maybe there is and I havent found it yet :-) I read so much and go to so many posts in searching for things that I usually wind up "totally confused" :-) I am hoping the Clymers Manual(when I get it ) will eliminate alot of the frustration though....(ordered it,waiting on it to get here) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 13:35:10 T-Mack1 wrote:
Thanks T-mack1 :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Savage_Rob on 08/27/07 at 14:00:54 skatnbnc wrote:
I wasn't being sarcastic at all. I tried to picture the battery box in my head and thought about removing the top - not a big deal... Unfortunately, after that the mental picture went somewhere into the realm of inspection mirrors and turkey basters and I decided it was far easier to remove the battery. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 16:24:17 Thanks guys......now just please tell me where it is in the tech forum......can't find it :-) Pictures always help... since the owners manual has bad pics to say the least! Cant even tell which side or end of the motorcycle the item is on in their pics :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 08/27/07 at 18:53:29 I did a quick look and came up only with other threads like how to change cylinder head cap plug. Not battery removal...or battery change....hmmmmmm Well, here you go: Battery Removal procedure: 1) remove tool kit cover. 2) remove tools. 3) remove seat (10 mm bolts, 2, one each side). Lift up back and slide seat to the rear. 3) remove three screws on tool compartment plate covering battery, one on top, two holding latch catch. Make note of how latch is mounted!!!! 4) Disconnect negative terminal from battery. Keep connector away from battery terminal!!! (tape? ? ?) 5) Disconnect positive terminal. Keep connector away from battery terminal!!! 6) Push battery out. My 01' is easy from the opening in left (shifter) side. For acid (water) level filling on non-sealed batteries: 7) Clean up any corrosion on terminals with mixture of Baking Soda & water. (yep....good old Arm&Hammer). 8 ) open each cell and top off level. Use either battery acid (auto store) or distilled water. Dry off any over flow. Avoid using Tap water as it has minerals and may shorten battery life. 9) optional: go to AutoZone (or local auto retail store) and pick up some anti corrosion spray, coat terminals as recommended on product. Re-install: reverse 6 thru 1....... Your done.. Go ride!!!! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 19:24:04 T-Mack1.....you are so nice, thank you, I just got back in from removing the battery....then I read your post....and I thought,hmmm,steps there I don't remember doing :-) But I got it out ok....and I'll use your notes to put it back in tomorrow, I can use them I'm sure as I was out in the semi dark doing all this :-) The battery is a (which I was very curious about the type it was,since it was in there so tight couldnt see)but... it is a ..Yuasa super sealed high performance battery.....No where to put water....maintenance free,I think!? So, I'll take it tomorrow and see about getting it charged?! I guess that's my next step since I tried again today to start it and it appeared dead. Couldnt see the terminals good to see if any corrosion...at any point....got dark so will check tomorrow. One question....do these type batterys go dead also, unless they're old? I thought I had read on this site somewhere that these dont give you any problems ?! Maybe another kind,not sure. You know I never had a problem with it until I dropped my bike....could just be coincidence though. Thanks again!! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 19:35:15 T-Mack1: I'm glad youre very good directions are posted though...I'm going to keep them until I'm sure I have it down pat....I mean how often do you remove the battery?! I hope not often :-) and its nice to have them here if any other new/beginner needs them! Also....one more question,anyone,...do you have to remove the battery to charge it? I'm thinking if you have a charger at home...then no. And what is the best type of charger for MC's?I'm sure I'll get one soon,so need to know. Might as well have everything about battery's on this one topic here .... "maybe" put it in the tech section for newbies :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 08/27/07 at 19:42:47 FreeSpirit wrote:
If a battery is good, then there is no need to have a charger, cause the alternator on the bike is supposed to charge your battery while you are riding. I would take the battery to a dealer and have them check it to see if it is dead. If it is they might be willing to charge it for you. If after riding around for a while, and your battery dies again, it's either a bad battery or your alternator is not working. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 20:44:58 islandwahine wrote:
Thanks,but...I do think its a good idea for anyone to have a charger. What if you forgot to turn off the key,etc....and let your battery drain? You would need to charge it or sit home one :-) Also I dont know about charging batterys(and the type I have) for MC's....can you charge them quickly or need to charge them slowly... My battery says charge at 1.2amps at 5-10 hrs.....dont think I could leave it with a dealer for that long :-)If that's my only option on charging. BTW,I did a search on my particular battery and it is for the/fits the Suz Savage & the right year also....that was good news! I heard there are some battery experts here. Maybe they will give us some more info :-)Or don't have to be a expert! Since the post was started ,has some good info already and I had such a hard time finding info on battery's...I hope all good info gets put here and its not dropped before someone answers these last questions. Would sure make it easy for someone else to find the answers.In one place:-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 21:33:48 Thought of this a while ago.....Is there anything I could have knocked loose or bent or anything ,when I dropped my bike that would interfere with it starting? Anything at all? I'm just wondering why my savage started so darn good,dropped the bike hard,and now having starting problems.Coincidence maybe but it makes me wonder.... Especially knowing now that I have a good type of battery! Other question though is....is there anyway to tell how old your battery is? Stock Date or something? I don't know when it was put in. Was in when I bought it. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/27/07 at 22:53:27 Well, Yea,, dropping it might do something to whether it starts. Check spark, check to see if fuel is in the bowl( crack that little screw sticking in the pointy down doohickey at the bottom of the carb,, uh huhh, high tech!! ) Make sure the plug wire is on the plug. Fuel, air, compression, spark,, = putt, putt. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/27/07 at 23:26:34 Thanks Justin, Youre going to make a MC mechanic out of me yet :-) Hang on though and let me get my only help..owners(almost worthless)manual :-) Ok,the basics: fuel-I understand,air-I dont ,compression-I dont ,spark-I understand. Air....only thing I know is the air filter...am I close? Compression....dont have a clue. But would be a good start to understand those! You have answers? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Savage_Rob on 08/28/07 at 05:11:09 There are a lot of different battery chargers out there. I can say that I've been very pleased with my Battery Tender Jr. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 08/28/07 at 10:49:05 Batteries do go bad, nothing is perfect. The sealed units do last longer than the non-sealed (vented) types only because they do better at keeping the water in. Batteries normally go bad from two main reasons, the lead plates inside get too much oxide build up (old age)or the bottom gets a build up of sediment that is the results of the chemical reaction that happens during charging. (my grandfather use to work at an Exide plant around here). If the battery is not new than dropping the bike could have shifted the sediment, causing a cell to "short" out and you would get weaker or no Amp's to start the bike. Charigng your battery,..... here's where the sealed units have to charge slower. When you charge a battery, the acid/water boils a little. The bigger the charger (amps) the more it boils. Remember your science classes in school, when things boil the expand, so the vented batteries do better to relieve this pressure from expansion. The sealed units do have pressure relieve valves, but.... if you try and charge it too fast and it could turn into a balloon, than pop.....actually a hiss than...blah...a mess I use a 1 amp trickle charger over night. A Battery tender sold at cycle shops work better becuase they monitor the chagre level and do not over charge ( They also are tricke chargers). |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by allan on 08/28/07 at 11:31:38 just my 2 cent's wear eye protection (especially a newbie) do not smoke around batteries. get a battery tender and fit the pig tails permantly to the battery then when its laid up you can connect your tender and charge away, lay the wires under your seat, on an upward note glad to see you girls looking after each other :) :) :) :) :) allan. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Starlifter on 08/28/07 at 11:45:13 For the eventiual battery replacement I have been considering the "Big Crank". Did someone say that the battery bay needs a modification for the crank to fit? If so what is it? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Savage_Rob on 08/28/07 at 13:26:34 I think there's a Big Crank that fits without mods. I had to mod a bit to fit the Odyssey. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/28/07 at 14:15:28 Thanks guys! Great info! I found out the date my battery was made....Feb.'06 And that they should last 5 yrs. (I'm getting better on searching for info :-) Thank ya'll for having patience with me as a newbie...I am getting better....(It was so frustrating to begin with) I need to learn so much more,hoping clymers manual will help and getting better at searchs so I dont have to ask so many dumb questions) SO...I now realize it "may" not even be the battery!! I bought fuses yesterday,also I am going to check around the bike and see if I did do some type of harm when I dropped it! One last battery question.....how do you test "this type" battery to see if it is good....I do want to do that first! Battery is :Yuasa High Performance Super sealed Maint... Free Thanks again :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by verslagen1 on 08/28/07 at 14:28:12 Most of the auto parts stores will do it for free. When I had an issue with my car, they tested it in the car for me. But with the savage, I'd take it out as the terminals can easily be shorted to ground. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/28/07 at 23:09:47 allan wrote:
Thanks Allen, While reading your post I had the battery in the living room....smoking a cigarette and almost choked when I read don't smoke around batterys :-) Fitting the pigtails to the battery permanently was something I didnt know ....thanks I'll do that! I bought a charger,let it trickle charge for 4 hours at 1.5amps,checked on it and it was charged....is that good? Does that mean my battery has hope ? Or is that normal? Anyone? BTW....Auto parts store said it wouldnt get a good reading,to check it,unless it was charged,so I went ahead and bought the charger. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 08/29/07 at 01:16:25 FreeSpirit wrote:
That's pretty much why I suggested earlier to have it tested. It saved me a bunch of time when I thought my new battery was dead (I didn't think it was charging correctly). Turns out it was a fuse, but there is almost always a reason a fuse goes (bike mechanic told me) so it turned out to be a short. BTW on which side did you drop it? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/29/07 at 11:58:38 islandwahine wrote:
I do remember reading a post of yours in another topic about a starting problem but can't remember where it is! Was it the one where the local mechanic young guy helped you and found the short? Anyway,they couldnt test the battery good unless it was fully charged...or so they said...so it charged up in 4 hrs....I d/c the charger and checked it again today and it was still fully charged.....dont know if that means anything or not. BUT....I dropped it on the right side....pretty sure my leg got most of the damage though/broke the fall for the bike :-) But it could be something simple...lose wire,fuse,etc. I spent most of the day....in the owners manual trying to figure out what was where....and reading info on the bike. I will get the clymers manual this week in mail ... I'm working long hours and hope to look the bike over good Friday....I should have the manual by then. I havent seen the spark plug yet,but will Friday to check that,connection,....I can't believe you have to take the gas tank off! But where was the wiring short on yours? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/29/07 at 13:33:28 Islandwahine.. Oh....I found your post/topic....Powerless! Maybe I should have titled my topic....Bike won't start for beginner :-) But I've learned alot,which I needed to and this has really helped so I can do things on my own :-) Will hopefully get my bike started Friday! or find the reason. Does it take much to run a battery down on a MC? Also if anyone knows of good websites to learn MC things for beginners,besides this one, let me know. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 08/30/07 at 23:11:46 I guess I'm used to working on cars, didn't know you could run a battery down on a bike. The only reasons I can think of with a car is corrosion on the clamps, broken alternator, loose clamps, etc. I'll keep my fingers crossed that you'll figure it out soon. I would hop over if I lived in the neighborhood. Two minds are better then one! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by pgman on 08/31/07 at 04:54:50 I am going to chime in here - mostly because I want to elaborate on some of the points already mentioned. If your bike will not start, but it cranks over well when you hit the start button, the battery is not likely the problem. If the motor won't crank at all, if it cranks very slowly, or if it stops suddenly while you're trying to start it, I would check all the connections and electrical components - especially those that may have taken a hit when you dropped the bike. It is possible, by the way, to destroy a battery by jarring / dropping it. Though it would be rather difficult to do, measuring the Voltage while you crank the bike over would tell you a lot. If it drops way down then it is likely your battery is bad. Also, knowing the battery Voltage when the bike is running would also provide good information as to the state of the electrical system (alternator / rectifier and regulator). On the LS650, the regulator / rectifier module is mounted under the pillion seat if I remember correctly. Though it is not real common, these modules do fail. One of the ways they can be damaged is by running the bike with a battery that is not fully charged (or at least pretty well charged). The alternator is not really designed to rejuvinate and old, tired battery. It is meant to provide enough power to keep the bike running and provide a (relatively) small amount of current to keep the battery fully charged. A lot of low-speed operation (as is what often happens with a beginner) can also cause a battery to drain - especially if it is old. Since beginners are often re-starting the motor a lot and, when they are running, are riding at slow speeds over short distances, the alternator never has a good chance to catch up to the drain on the battery. In that case, a good slow-charger will be worth its weight in gold - especially if you have an "off season". I didn't see in your post where you live but, if you have to put the bike away for a while each year, you will really benefit from having a battery tender. Finally, (or maybe this should have been first) batteries are not un-safe but they are dangerous (there is a difference). You should always keep fire and sparks away from lead / acid batteries because they create and vent Hydrogen gas when they are charging. This can linger for a long time in and around batteries so that is why it is never a good idea to work around this type of battery when you are smoking. However, even power tools (like drills, grinders and other such things) have electric motors which create very small sparks internally. These are enough to set off a battery so be careful with those as well. Best rule of thumb - always wear protective eyawear and rubber gloves when you are working on a MC (or automotive) battery and only do so in a well-ventilated area - use a box fan to circulate fresh air if you have to. Also, always remove the negative battery terminal first and replace it last. This will drastically reduce the chance of sparks and fire. Motorcycle batteries are not nearly as bad as car batteries, but they are still capable of burning you very badly if you are ignorant to the risks. Good luck, and be safe - especially after you get your baby running! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 08/31/07 at 09:01:34 islandwahine wrote:
Thanks! Yep,we're not exactly neighbors are we :-) And two minds are better than one.....or 10 is better than one! Glad I had all this help! I didnt get the Clymers manual yet.....they must have forgot to mail it :-) So maybe tomorrow....I'd much rather have decent pictures ,if I need them. I hate to start working on something I'm not use to and not have everything I need. But as far as a MC battery running down....I assume its like any battery,.....maybe someone will tell us :-)But if you leave your bike on by mistake,I'm sure that would drain the battery!? But this is good in a strange way.....its got me into the workings of the bike and seeing its not really that difficult :-) Not like I had thought....so far :-) It's actually fun learning! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by verslagen1 on 08/31/07 at 11:18:24 Starlifter wrote:
The big crank has really big terminals. the cables have a tab that's bent down to keep it from twisting. You'll need to bend that up. Otherwise, goes right in. And yes, leave the lights on and it will drain a battery dead. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/01/07 at 20:05:37 Cant get the screw out of the left panel thing. I've tried WD-40 several times,giving it time to soak in and still can't get it to turn....I've almost stripped the screw! Any suggestions? I did see somewhere something about a impact screwdriver .I know nothing about those ,don't really have much money,already spent too much on bike this week.....so hoping for other suggestions. Trying to put battery in to see if my bike will start after charging the battery. Thanks for any help. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by verslagen1 on 09/01/07 at 20:09:20 If you're talking about the cover with s40 or ls650 on it, an impact driver won't do much good as there isn't much meat behind it. And you'll just bend the cover. Get a small pair of vice grips and clamp on the side of the head. Then you can turn it out. And do give it a squirt of penetrating oil. wd40 ok, but pen oil better. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/01/07 at 20:49:57 verslagen1 wrote:
clamp on the side of the head.......its a flat head,can't get anything to the side of it. Used bike ,not sure if this screw is original or not. penetrating oil....what is that? Maybe a name of one would be familiar. 3in1 oil?(I think that's the name of it,not sure.) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 09/01/07 at 21:04:34 Good luck FreeSpirit! I ran into the same problem today trying to get the philips screw out of the turn signal stem. I shredded the head of the screw, so now I got to think of a way to get it out while the fork is off of the bike. Don't want to be messing with it later, too hard to reach. I think I'll try one of those kits that lets you make a new hole in the screw to loosen it up. Requires drilling though, not too exited about that! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/01/07 at 21:25:30 Some of the phillips head screws on mine are ,odofied to straight screwdriver slotted heads. I have a Dremel tool clone & cut off discs I can use to make a slot. If you dont & you can get to it well enough, sometimes a hacksaw can work out, but thats dangerous, if it slips, paint is gonna suffer. Use masking tape & protect the paint. You can also use a file to cut into the head & grab it with vise grips. If you have already flared the edges of the phillips head you can use a small punch & small, light hammer, using light taps, to slowly drive the meat back into position & then try again, maybe the tapping will free the bolt a bit. Good penetrating oil, Kroil, also, I think I saw an ex Navy guy suggest wintergreen oil, |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/01/07 at 22:25:04 If I mess up this screw,which I probably will,and need to replace it.......is there a better quality of screw to replace it with? It seems these screws are poor quality !! Are there stainless steel screws? Would they be better if there is? And....thanks alot for the masking tape tip....I didnt think of that for some reason, and do want to save my paint job :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 09/02/07 at 01:44:03 justin_o_guy2 wrote:
Great tip, I can use your advice for my screw problem too. I do own a Dremel tool, and you're right, it's easy to cut a grove for a big flathead. Hope I don't shred that one too. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/02/07 at 08:19:29 Go too deep & the bolt head will split when the screwdriver applies torque. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 09/02/07 at 08:47:07 Another note, take a close look at you phillips screwdriver. They go bad easily, and a bad scredriver will mess up a stubborn screw real fast. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 11:24:03 Can anyone tell me if there are better quality screws out there somewhere to fit MC's.....to replace these? This one started stripping pretty easily. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 09/02/07 at 12:16:21 T-Mack1 wrote:
Brand new Phillips with nice big fat grip! Nope screw was weak and I think partially corroded |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 12:45:36 T-Mack1 wrote:
Thanks, changed screw drivers,got a hammer and taped it and ....got it out!Think letting it soak in liquid wrench over night helped also,maybe. Now ,I'm trying to check fuses and I CANT GET THE FUSE OUT!! Either one of them! I 've even tried pliers and cant pull them out! Any help on this? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 13:43:30 The previous fuse question may sound dumb to some people and it probably is but....I can't work on my bike past dark and I really need to get the bike done today. I have searched here and google and can't find anything! Don't know if anyone has suggestions or not,but if so,please let me know. I've just never seen a fuse that wouldnt come out before on anything. Makes me think they havent been checked in awhile and would hate to get out somewhere and not be able to get them out! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 14:49:03 Ok, I have left the fuses alone for now . I went ahead,with battery charged up,put it back in and tried to start my bike. It turns over really good but.....wont start. Need help with this!....I've only had my bike a little over a month......so,not familiar with all this stuff yet....what are the possible reasons why it wouldnt start? It has gas in it,the battery is fully charged....that's all I know . I really need to figure this out today,before it drives me crazy :-) Will keep doing searches but any help would be appreciated. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 15:02:14 Nevermind....got it started!! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 09/02/07 at 17:11:29 SUPER!!! Well, seeing you got it started it means the fuses are fine. I don't understand why you couldn't pull them out. It really isn't all that hard to pull out. Glad you got the screw out. I ended up having to drill the shredded head a little deeper, and with the fine point Dremel bit I carved the hole into a #3 Phillips size. After that it came out quite easy with the hammer drill. What an ordeal however!! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 17:40:48 I have no idea why the fuses wouldnt come out...Looks like one is in upside down,if that is possible :-) But need to get them to come out....I'd hate to be stranded somewhere,need/have a fuse but couldnt get it out to change it :-) But something that simple is so frustrating when you can't do it! Sorry you had trouble but sounds like you did a good job! I'm just happy I got my bike started today!!! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 09/02/07 at 17:50:23 The fuses cannot be upside down! Basically what you should see is 2 clear yellow flat/pieces in this square rubber fuse holder thing. http://www.consumabulbs.com/photo/20a%20mini.jpg If you wiggle a little back and forth while holding the skinny ends you should be able to get them out |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 09/02/07 at 17:59:06 islandwahine, Since you live in a humid climate, you may want to buy the stainless steel screws at the hardware store. FreeSpirit, Sounds like yours may have been in the weather too, either sitting or dirivng. The connections can get corroded. Repeat after me "WD40/Liquid Wrench/CRC (pick one) is my friend.....". Auto stores sell the fuses..... |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 18:17:55 T-Mack1 wrote:
I found out today that I can get the stainless steel screws....I'd rather do that ,so no problem next time. As far as the fuses...I wiggled them ,pulled on them with pliers and still couldnt get them out! BTW -I had already bought fuses and had them here!(I'm not totally dumb,just a beginner,I'm sure I'll laugh about all this one day,hopefully soon :-) Can you put WD-40 around the fuses???They must not have been removed in a while! I wasnt sure if you could do that or not....didnt want to make things worse. And...could not find any info on the net,so this is probably a rare problem. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/02/07 at 20:14:30 Sorry guys, When I said !(I'm not totally dumb,just a beginner,...... Afterwards that sounded kind of rude, didn't mean to be rude.I know people are just trying to help! Just very frustrated over the fuses!Something that should be so simple! But I'll give everything a rest for tonight! and start over tomorrow when I'm not so frustrated :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by islandwahine on 09/02/07 at 22:55:44 T-Mack1 wrote:
I just did, 45 cents per screw (wow). They should last for a while. But you know they say stainless steel doesn't rust. Well, that's just a myth. I have really expensive stainless steel pots and pans, and one of them I never use because it's huge. It was stored in my cabinet, and when I took it out to use it for some dying It had a bunch of rust spots on it. Go figures |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/03/07 at 00:30:05 Stainless Steel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel I did a search,some say it wont rust that if there's rust it is from a contaminate! But my question about better quality screws originally was... Meant rather...ones that wont strip so easily,stronger!! Will do a search and see if I can find out :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/03/07 at 02:30:50 Ok,this is what I found: "Stainless steel is generally a stronger fastener and will not show rust but will dull as time and oxidation takes its toll but is better in a damp salty environment than chromed bolts.Chrome bolts are better in/for a dryer climate." That was what I was trying to find,which one was better/stronger, chromed or stainless steel. Could be something stronger,I dont know....I'm just a beginner :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 09/03/07 at 07:30:15 They actually make several grades of SS screws & bolts (cooking pans too). Identified by a numbering system (like 316). Some have more alloys that oxidizes than others. So, yes SS can be magnetic and can rust in the right situations. The medical grade is the most non-magnetic and non-oxidizing there is, the aircraft grade is one of the strongest (and both are some of the more expensive). SS tends to be more brittle (shears easier) so it's not a good idea to use SS for something that requires lots of torque (head bolts etc etc). For the sides cover and misc things like that it works great. SS also galls which is a condition where it basically flakes when it rubs against itself under pressure (screw to nut contact) so anti-sieze or WD40 is recomended. Otherwise it could bind up badly. If you are concerned about stripping the phillips head change to different style (hex head, allen head etc etc). Battery acid does attack some of the materials in SS (found out from my garden tractor). |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by verslagen1 on 09/03/07 at 08:40:21 Common SS fasteners are generally 80% as strong as their counter parts in steel. And various grades of SS do rust as a brown spot. But if you use plain steel work the pots (in this case) some of the plain steel can rub off and that can be the cause of your spots. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/03/07 at 23:33:57 Thanks T-mack1: "If you are concerned about stripping the phillips head change to different style (hex head, allen head etc etc). " That's what I needed! I have another question : I just read" Never charge a battery while its still in the machine as damage may result to the battery or regulator. Should I charge it in the bike or not....should I be concerned? Any comments on this? Do ya'll leave the pigtail in the bike connected to the battery? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by T-Mack1 on 09/04/07 at 06:54:41 FreeSpirit wrote:
Interesting question and another one that will have different view points. In theory, yes, you could mess up the battery & regulator........if you hooked up the charger backwards......or used a charger of the wrong size. If you use a std auto charger or trickle charger and hook up the leads correcctly you will be fine. Heck......they sell the battery tenders for the purpose of being hooked all the time..... |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/05/07 at 00:08:55 T-Mack1.....yes later I thought kinda the same thing,why would they sell the pigtail with it ,if you couldnt do that...charge it in the bike. I can't remember where I read that statement from....wish I could,but hopefully they are talking about a full charger,not a trickle charger :-) Also,Being low on money has made me worry too much ....I may get a extra job :-) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Trippah on 09/05/07 at 15:35:59 Just a quick question- I learned way back about thirty years ago to disconnected the hot terminal first, and then the ground; and to connect the ground first and then the hot terminal..less likely to spark should you touch something metallic in the process.. is this correct? |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by grandpa on 09/05/07 at 15:57:50 Yes you can use WD40 around electrical parts. Do not spray it in areas where there will be sparks until it dries. Have known people who sprayed it inside distributor caps on cars to dry them out. Didn't wipe the excess out or let it air dry. Blew the distributor cap off the first time they cranked the engine. Works great as long as it's used properly!! Just like a lot of other stuff!!! |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Max_Morley on 09/05/07 at 18:38:00 It wasn't the WD-40 that is the problem, it used to be propelled out of the can with Propane. You could ignite the stream from the nozzle with a lighter or match. May have changed in recent years however. Thats why it worked as a intake manifold leak finder. At one time I even had a aluminum bendable wand the fir ona propane torch just for finding intake and carb to manifold leaks. Not as messy as carb cleaner or WD-40. There have been times I wish I could find another one. Max |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by YonuhAdisi on 09/05/07 at 19:15:41 Trippah wrote:
The rule of thumb has always been disconnect negative first, then positive. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/06/07 at 12:56:45 Oh my Gosh! I just got the Clymer's manual and it is the difference between night and day in having it, as far as understanding things! Just about every question(tools & mechanical) I've had so far is in this manual. I had no idea it was this good :-) All newbies need this!! :) |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by Savage_Rob on 09/06/07 at 13:55:33 FreeSpirit wrote:
Be sure to look in the Tech Ref section for the known errors in the Clymers. There are some of which to be aware. |
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Title: Re: Battery+checks for beginner Post by FreeSpirit on 09/06/07 at 16:56:41 Savage_Rob wrote:
Thanks, I will :) |
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