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Message started by DocNeedles on 06/08/07 at 21:23:23

Title: Tire Problem
Post by DocNeedles on 06/08/07 at 21:23:23

I am new to this site and new to Savages, I have a 1986 Savage with 11,00 miles on it and love it. Recently I after having my back brakes done I noticed a scraping noise when I moved my bike backwards and also somewhat when I moved it forwards. I thought it must be the shoes setting because it stopped. Today a friend noticed that I had a big groove worn into the side of my tire and feeling underneath the back fender found a bolt had come loose and had cut this groove in the tire so badly that it has to be replaced. On one side of the bike someone had reversed the screws with an acorn nut on the outside so it does not stick out toward the tire. On the side where the groove is worn there are still some screws and I will have to reverse them. I am running a Dunlop 404, 140-90-15 on the back. I wonder if anyone else has had this problem? Thanks for any feedback.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by Rockin_John on 06/08/07 at 21:38:08

My 1999 chopper has that exact tire on the back, and it has one screw removed completely, and another turned around on the left side for that very reason. I didn't put that tire on there, but I've felt up inside the fender for the clearance, and know exactly why the fender bracket bolts are in the way they are...

I'm curious what the shop may have changed to cause the bolt to start scraping if it didn't before you took it in. If they "fixed" something they weren't asked to, by turning bolts around while they had the tire off... they screwed up. I'd be pissed and wanting help from them to make it right.

If it is just a matter of the screw on your fender came lose and caused the damage... that's just bad luck and a reminder to tighten things frequently on your Savage.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by youzguyz on 06/09/07 at 03:18:56

This is a "heads up" for anyone who just put on the Dunlop 404 140/90-15 tire. (Or any other tire of that size?)
Dunlop says this tire fits. That's because they don't have a 140/80-15.

The fender bolts on the left side may very well start rubbing on the tire.
ESPECIALLY if you have saddle bag brackets mounted!

http://www.bikebandit.com/partsbandit/showschematic.asp?dept_id=714814

Each pillion handle has 4 bolts (if stock). As far as I can tell, the the 2 at the front (with the acorn nuts on the outside (#9/#10 - only one pair shown) are not an issue.
The next one back (#8 ) is a definite problem for rubbing.
The one furthest back (#8 on the sissy bar) is not a problem.
The typical solution is to change the bolt out with something that is shallower. I heard someone mention mushroom bolts (probably the best solution).
Or just leaving the offending bolt off. Probably ok if no saddle bag bracket. Maybe not ok if carrying passenger?

I just took a grinding wheel to the bolt head and removed about half of it. (Couldn't find mushroom bolts of the right size).
I did the one on the right side as well. It wasn't rubbing, but it was very, very close.

The big thing here is to CHECK to make sure it is not rubbing!
What I do is put the bike on a jack (if not already as I was doing something with the rear wheel). Remove both shocks so the swing arm has free travel. Then get on the ground, look up in the fender and lift the tire up into the fender to see what, if anything, is hitting/rubbing.
(I should not need to mention that someone should steady the bike, or it should be firmly strapped, when doing this).
If there is some doubt if it is rubbing, use chalk on the bolt(s) in question and hoist the tire again a few times, then check the tire for chalk marks.
I would suggest you do this anytime you do anything that might effect clearance, and there is any doubt.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by trooper3 on 06/09/07 at 03:42:30

I agree with the post above. I too have the Dunlop 140/90-15 tire on an 87 Savage and it rubbed the head of the middle bolt only on the left side of the bike. I took it out and ground the head about 2/3 the way down but it is still very, very close. The right side has a lot more clearance but I ground that one down too. My tire has the left edge worn away where the sidewall meets the face profile. I am lucky I investigated the whirring noise I kept hearing as the rear end was loaded downward. Based on what I am reading here, this is a common problem.
Rick C.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by azjay on 06/09/07 at 07:06:33

we have a dunlop k555 140/?/15 i dont recall any clearance issues with it. is there a 130/90/15 available? has anybody run a 130? up until this phat tire craze came into the bike world, HDs ran 'em with all that torque and weight ??? it never seemed to be an issue

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by Max_Morley on 06/09/07 at 09:45:41

The K555's that I ran were 140/80 x 15 so were the stock size. I have a 140/90 x 15 Maxxis WWW on now but have hard bags with my own brackets external so it is not a problem. Max

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by DocNeedles on 06/09/07 at 18:17:02

Thanks for the information and feedback. I like the tire and am going to replace it with the same and have the bolts replaced with mushroom bolts to have clearance. Can anyone tell me if this will stop me being able to put saddle bag brackets on in the future?

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by SteveRocket on 06/09/07 at 22:16:36

I have just the spent the day putting the supports and saddle bags on my Savage. I rode it home from
my friends house and it rode like a pig. I checked the tire when I got home saw that it had been rubbing. Thoughly P***d off , I took a look on the forum and surprise surprise there is a thread relating to my problem. I go out to check the the tire size and find it's 90 just like the other posters with the problem. So my question for all the very knowledgeable people here is can I keep my saddle bags on the the bike with the 90 tire. What actually is a mushroom bolt ? and is it only the center bolthead that rubs?. Another thought was , as I understand the shocks are adjustable if I stffened them up a notch would that prevent it from rubbing ?. Thanks in advance for any help and just to say this forum has already been a great help to me.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by Max_Morley on 06/09/07 at 22:39:18

Turning the shocks to the firmest setting wiil help. After you remove the offending bolt, take it to any good nut and bolt dealer and they can sell you one with an almost flat head with a allen drive, at least that is what mine was. Others suggest grindng part of the head off and going that way. Max

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by Savage_Rob on 06/10/07 at 09:42:55

Max is right. You have an oversized tire on it. I didn't run into problems until I put saddlebag supports on it at the same time. As mentioned above, setting your shocks to their highest/stiffest presets will help, as will getting some mushroom head allen bolts to reduce their profile. Overall, the best fixes are either a stock tire size, a larger or removed rear fender, or higher shocks. I went with higher shocks and haven't looked back.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by DocNeedles on 06/10/07 at 10:42:03

So Savage__Rob, is there a specific shock that you would recommend to fix this problem? I am going to go with the mushroom headed bolt and would like to have as much clearance as possible for when I put saddle bags and brackets on. Is it possible to use the tie down soft bags safely without using the brackets?

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by Savage_Rob on 06/10/07 at 11:40:07

There are a lot of threads on taller shocks and you can look into them for comparisons. I used Progressive Suspension's 412 series heavy duty 12.5" shocks. I like the higher profile. The stock shocks of 10.5", so I'm sure the 11" or 11.5" would be just fine and would stay closer to the bike's normal lower profile. I think I used their product search and used an 800cc Suzuki Intruder as the bike because they don't list the Savage. If you do that, you can find the part numbers of the various models you might consider and can watch on eBay, etc. I went with the 412 series because I didn't want to fork out the duckets for the cushier 440's. However, some folks have picked up 440's for a steal on eBay. If you can be patient, good deals can be had that route. Unfortunately, I wasn't in a patient frame of mind at that point.

Title: Re: Tire Problem
Post by SteveRocket on 06/10/07 at 14:14:53

Well thanks for all the help on this issue. I went a different route with this and it's either very good or someone will point out the folly of this. What I did on the left hand side of the bike I undid all the bolts that hold the supports and the sissy bar And put the support brackets between the fender and chrome Sissy bar holder (or what ever it is called). Then I put the longer bolts that came with the supports in and tightened everything back up . It leaves a slight gap between he fender and chrome thing but everything is tight and if you did it properly and did it both sides and put some spacers in the gaps I think it would work out ok. Any thoughts on this appreciated
Steve