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Message started by Ed_L. on 05/04/07 at 17:38:15

Title: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Ed_L. on 05/04/07 at 17:38:15

Finally was able to get a little data on flow and temperature on my oil cooler. Can't afford inline temperature sensors so ended up using a meter with the temp probe sitting directly behind the cooler. I was able to position the probe behind the inlet of the cooler for one set of readings and behind the outlet of the cooler for a second set of readings. Here's a picture of how it was positioned, gotta love duct tape.
http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/886953/
Here's how I mounted the meter
http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/886952/

Here's the information

Inlet Temp Speed mph Outlet Temp
Degrees C
40-41 50 37-40

47 60 41

48 70 37

48 75 36

Start/Stop in Traffic

52-54 52

Air temperature was 26 degrees C at the start of the ride. I allowed 15 miles at 60 mph for a warmup ( steady at 41 degrees) and rode 20 miles one way for the inlet test and 20 miles back the other way for the outlet test with the bike in 5th gear.
What does it mean? well start/stop traffic was when the air around the cooler got the hottest, no big surprise. There seemed to be some, 3-4 degrees C, cooling at 40 to 50mph. Above 60 mph the temp difference increased to almost 10 degrees C and stayed about the same up to 75mph.
I also noticed that under WOT both the inlet and outlet temp would rise quickly by about 8 degrees C, seemed that the higher the engine rpm the hotter the cooler would get. There is not a lot of data here but it seems that the cooler is working it's best at highway speeds.
I also was able to check the flow thru the cooler at 1500 rpm. Here is a couple pictures of the test chamber I set up.
http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/886954/
http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/886955/
The chamber has a total volumn of 550cc and took 45 seconds to fill. This gives a flow of .73 liters per minute. The oil pressure gauge on top of the chamber read 12 psi. I couldn't run any more flow tests cause the clear tubing got real soft real fast when the hot oil hit it and I didn't want to risk a hot oil blowout. I'm happy to answer any questions about the test and cooler setup, hope this made some enjoyable reading even though I couldn't get the columns of the temp chart to line up.

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by azjay on 05/05/07 at 06:32:07

good read, thanks for the effort

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by justin_o_guy on 05/05/07 at 07:40:00

Well,that's some neat info. I don't know enough about heat & oil to know exactly what it means, but surely, at highway speeds, staying cooler is better. I wonder what the temps would be without a cooler? Just having the increased oil capacity has to help. I really wonder what the "Stop & go, stop light" temps would have been without the added volume. I hope the cooler is holding that reading down, too.

Thanks for all the time you spent bringing this to us,

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Greg_650 on 05/07/07 at 11:00:41

Just a question about the numbers...

Doesn't the idea of a cooler mean that the air is going to remove heat from the oil as it passes through the cooler?

If that is the case, then wouldn't the outlet side air be warmer than the inlet air?

I love duct tape too, but could it have affected the probe?

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by verslagen1 on 05/07/07 at 11:39:08

Greg,

What I think Ed is referring to is the air near the oil outlet of cooler versus the air near the oil inlet.

As long as the duct tape doesn't cover the sensor part, it's fine.

Ed, you could place the sensor directly on the outlet, cover with fiberglass insulation and wrap with duct tape. Air temp is great info but still not oil temp. You might consider the temperature strips I found.

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Ed_L. on 05/07/07 at 11:39:40

The air temp was taken at the inlet and outlet of the oil cooler not the engine. The oil out line from the engine (hot oil) was the inlet of the cooler. The oil in line to the engine (cooled oil) was the outlet of the cooler. The flow in the cooler is set up from the bottom to the top to prevent any air pockets from forming. The picture of the probe duct taped to the frame is measuring the temperature of the air on the outlet side of the cooler. To measure the inlet side air temperature all I did was flip the probe assembly around so the tip of the probe was at the bottom middle of the cooler instead of the top middle position. Not real scientific but the best I could come up with using what I had on hand. Ideally I should get two inline temp senders tied into a switch and a readout. Then I would be able to monitor the cooler inlet and outlet temp by flipping a switch. I would think it would be easy enough to do but I just don't have the cash handy to do it.

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Greg_650 on 05/07/07 at 12:03:56

Oh, so you were measuring the air temp around the surface of the 2 oil lines.

I was thinking inlet/outlet being like front/back of the cooler.

If nothing else, since the oil was cooler, then the air should have been warmer :P

I still like duct tape.

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Ed_L. on 05/16/07 at 12:05:15

Well just did a oil and filter change and while I was in there I slipped a plug in the internal passage way so the cooler is getting the full flow of oil from the engine instead of splitting it. Really don't expect any trouble by doing this, the internal oil passage ways are about 3/8 inch and that is the size of the tubing and fittings on the cooler. When I fired it up the top end sounded fine with no valve tapping or banging but still need to get it out on the road. Wish me luck on this one. ;D

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Savage_Rob on 05/16/07 at 12:20:10

Good luck! ;D

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Reelthing on 05/16/07 at 12:43:38

agree - good luck - if the oil cooler is going to make them clack it might take awhile as the cam runs in a puddle with the rest more or less splashed oiled

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Ed_L. on 05/17/07 at 08:05:07

I don't think there will be any problem with oil getting to the top end. It might take three or four more seconds for the oil to pump thru the cooler but once all the oil passage ways are full everything get lubed as usual. I just give an extra 30 seconds to a minute at an idle to get everything pumped up before getting out on the road. Most of the engine oils advailble have extra lubrication additives to prevent wear during startup. Next project might be a small fan on the cooler for when I'm stuck in traffic but that might look too cluttered. :-/

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by smokin_blue on 05/17/07 at 10:11:22

One thought people could use in designing a new one would be to put both the inlet and outlet at the top of the cooler. My old GSXR's are that way and then the oil cooler doesn't drain back into the sump. This keeps the system full and could keep from ever dry pumping the cams at start up.

I read one of the posts on this forum (taken from another forum) that the oil filter relocation systems (on I believe yamahas) were destroying top ends. I kind of wonder if those drain back and create a dry shot.

Just a thought.

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by barry68v10 on 05/19/07 at 02:34:52

Quote:

put both the inlet and outlet at the top of the cooler. My old GSXR's are that way and then the oil cooler doesn't drain back into the sump. This keeps the system full and could keep from ever dry pumping the cams at start up.

I don't like that design for one main reason, you can't drain the oil in the cooler unless you go through some procedure to evacuate the lines. Granted the cooler and lines may only hold 2 or 3 cc's of fluid, but I'd have a hard time living with that.

Now if you leave a small hole for the main oil passage instead of blocking it completely, you allow oil to flow quickly into the filter housing upon start-up. Then high rpm running would begin to force a majority of the oil thru the cooler lines.

That's my theory at any rate, I'll let you know how it works out. ;D

Title: Re: Oil Cooler Update
Post by Ed_L. on 05/19/07 at 07:10:15

Reducing the internal passageway makes more sense than blocking it off, thanks for that idea, I'll modify the plug so it has a bleed hole in it. I was a little nervous about closing off the internal passageway and that idea is a better option. ;D Well back to the shop, Thanks