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Message started by georgekathe on 03/12/07 at 20:21:39

Title: Fixing plug leak
Post by georgekathe on 03/12/07 at 20:21:39

Question maybe for Gregg 650, but hope others will leap in, too.

Greg - know you work on your bike a lot (& seem to be on this site all the time so have no idea when you find time to work on it! ;D ) & know you did the (what looks to be excellent) piece on fixing the plug leak, so question -

do you have a list or can recall a parts list of what I should buy from Ronayers/bike bandit like seals & washers so I ensure I don't get leaks or not replace what I should do, please?

also, I know you said you copied the view of the head & punched holes in it & taped it over a box so could ensure bolts were put back in correctly. I don't have abilities to make one & wondered if you have a copy whether you can e-mail me one, please - my address is tosti22@juno.com.

If anyone else has info then please feel free to leap in - I'd welcome all help I can get - can do basic bike stuff but have been shying away from this project as I feel it is beyond me & know I need to do it (the leak is there & isn't getting any better, I know that!)

(my project for next winter - it is now in the low/mid 60s here & can only get better from here on - but want to know what I'm tackling - well - in advance!)

thanks in advance for help! george :)

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by tbalam on 03/12/07 at 20:38:50

I am not a sub for Greg, but here is some information.

But first what year is your bike, how many miles?

The head diagram can be found here and printed out:
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1099227295

and the plug cap part number from ronayers is 11145-41B01

make sure when you install it that you put some permatex on iit. I can tell you that this new one fits much tighter than the one that is currently on your bike.

ask any questions here, these guys are great. I am currently doing a cam chain, clutch, chain conversion, and a few others all with the help of these guys.

The suzuki is a very forgiving bike, so it is great to learn wrenching on.

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Max_Morley on 03/12/07 at 21:28:12

Don't forget to order the figure 8 shaped rubber o ring that goes under the cover to direct the oil to the rocker arms. Also consider the 6-8 copper washers (mine came as a rubber lined copper) that go under specified cover screws. Be stingy with the sealer on the cover as you do not want blobs of that getting into the oil pump pickup and blocking it off. Max

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/12/07 at 23:08:42

georgekathe wrote:

Well, since I first posted my little guide, quite a few others have done the same job now and are quite as proficient.

(Believe it or not, back in '02 when I fixed mine, I didn't know anyone that had done it themselves. Everyone took it to a dealer)

But I thought that I listed some parts...maybe I need to go look again.

Anyway, I'll email the bolt pattern to you. Not a problem.

In the mean time just start gathering your tools and parts and wait for a rainy day. Myself or a few dozen others will keep you on track.

...shoot, soon you'll be giving this advice in the future, too ;D

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by georgekathe on 03/13/07 at 13:47:35

tbalam - it is a 96 with about 10,000 miles on it. leak started about 1000 miles ago - not bad unless I go along interstate.

what I'm looking for is list of what I need in addition to the actual plug cap (numbers if possible) for any gaskets & washers. know I'm asking a lot, maybe, but thought knowing how organized some of you are out there thought maybe some would have a list of what they bought when they did it on their Savage.

help would be appreciated... :)

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by tbalam on 03/13/07 at 14:06:47

I included part numbers in my above post,

if you use gregs bolt pattern, then you won't need anything but some permatex to seal the head cover.
Good Luck!!

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by georgekathe on 03/13/07 at 21:24:10

tbalam -

I noted the parts # you gave for the plug cap - thanks - but wondered if anyone had list (with #'s would be terrific!) of other parts needed - the link you gave me did not seem to supply that info either (or maybe I'm blind!)

thanks to anyone who has that info!

george

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/14/07 at 08:45:57

You should also get a manual so that you can follow certain steps before just removing the cover...

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by georgekathe on 03/14/07 at 12:21:41

have the clymers - should that be good enough, Greg? (I know about their error when turning the doohickey to get TDC!) :)

any other suggestions, anyone? (besides what is in the tech section on its repair? - either what Greg said or the additions?

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/14/07 at 15:45:16

georgekathe wrote:

Manual is good.

Don't remove the headcover bolt on the right side that has the phillips slots in the top. It just retains the rocker shaft.

Don't remove the bolt on the left side by the decompression lever and the valve cover. It just retains the decompression cam shaft.

Don't forget the 2 bolts inside the valve covers.

Torque wrench? You won't be the first one to break one of those headcover bolts if you aren't careful...it isn't a fatal mistake but taking the cover back off with the silicone sealer is a messy drag.

Take your time. Double check everything. Clean, clean, clean. The next time it'll be like clockwork.

When you put it back on don't forget the upside down bolt on the left and remember to put that one bolt back in the middle of the cover before you put the cover on (I did that. The one you can't get all the way out).

If you're a beer drinker, an ice cold 6 pack is good too ;D

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by franch on 03/14/07 at 18:30:14

uh oh, whats this figure 8 o-ring ?
is it the one that goes on top right side over a pin/dowel ?

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/14/07 at 20:47:44

franch wrote:

uh oh, whats this figure 8 o-ring ?
is it the one that goes on top right side over a pin/dowel ?

Figure 8? There is one that is kinda egg shaped...just happens to be in today's sigline too :)

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by franch on 03/16/07 at 17:50:59

oh, that one
i remember it now
i just reused the original but had to carefully place during head cover reinstall.

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/17/07 at 06:07:23

franch wrote:

oh, that one
i remember it now
i just reused the original but had to carefully place during head cover reinstall.

I always reuse an o-ring as long as it isn't cut, pinched, cracked, flattened or radioactive.

A thin film of silicone will hold it up in the headcover while you put it back together. Yep, a little sealer on a seal.

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Gonzina on 03/19/07 at 13:11:47

I have a major oil leak problem as in the picture....can anyone help me out and indicate if it is a head gasket or a plug leaking?

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156030/1293140Why@6700web.jpg

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Savage_Rob on 03/19/07 at 13:14:17

Greg_650 wrote:

Figure 8? There is one that is kinda egg shaped...just happens to be in today's sigline too :)

Hmmmm... unfortunately in this instance, the sigline changes regularly.

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/19/07 at 14:25:08

Gonzina wrote:

That was my leak, so you're in the right topic :P

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/19/07 at 14:25:42

Savage_Rob wrote:

Hmmmm... unfortunately in this instance, the sigline changes regularly.

I don't know what you mean ???

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Gonzina on 03/20/07 at 11:28:12

Greg_650 wrote:

That was my leak, so you're in the right topic :P

Hi Greg, so what's the norm of this leak do you think it stems from the plug or the gasket?

I was reading other posts and seems like when the plug leaks, the oil comes out from the middle of the cylinder!

Cheers

Claudine

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by Greg_650 on 03/20/07 at 16:15:41

Gonzina wrote:

Those are 2 separate leaks, even though the plug leak can blow all over the place and look like it.

I'm gonna try to focus on that middle stud leak when I reassemble mine. I actually think that is a little bit of a design flaw in the head gasket.

There is an oil passage that is sealed by the head gasket, and the gasket has two sealing ridges...one inside and one outside. I believe the stud leak comes from oil that weeps around between those ridges in the seal, and since the nut has no gasket it can leak out around both of those nuts.

My nuts (I can't wait) had small oil drops on it when I took off the head, and I found the gasket was wet with oil all the way around...and yet the combustion chamber was sealed just fine.

This is actually the second time I've done this, and the first time I really paid attention to my torquing to make sure it was sealed right. I leaked anyway.

I think the leak is the head gasket but not in the traditional "blown" way.

Title: Re: Fixing plug leak
Post by franch on 03/24/07 at 13:52:26

Greg,
any updates on that possibly poorly designed head gasket ?
I did the plug cap and have a sneaky suspicion that it's still leaking from the head gasket. looking at the front of the engine the head bolt just left of the exhaust port looks to be weeping; you know; the bolt that the plug cap gives access to.