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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Low idle speed can damage the cam.
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Message started by justin_o_guy on 01/03/07 at 14:41:03

Title: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by justin_o_guy on 01/03/07 at 14:41:03

I thought nothing of the idle speed when I bought the bike. Never even dawned on me the oil system might need more RPM to keep everything healthy. I set it as low as I could & it not gag when I gave it the gas to pull away. Now, 13,500 miles later, no signs I am AWARE of that anything is injured. Naturally, it is noisy when I stick my head down by the engine. Question is, should I pop the cover off & have a look ? Maybe it's time to pull the cover on the side too & have a look at the chain adjuster? I don't ride it like it's a cruiser ya know. Sure would hate for it to lunch in a corner. That would be bad. Anything I can look at without making a science project out of it?

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by thumperclone on 01/03/07 at 14:53:56

idle spec..1000-1200 rpm..keep the life blood flowing..
bike does sound better at low idle but this is a low pressure oil system..7.1-10.7 psi...

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by YonuhAdisi on 01/03/07 at 14:55:28

I was wondering that myself, and by the sound of my idle, I reckon I have it just about right.

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by klx650sm2002 on 01/04/07 at 00:22:46

With KLX I go for 1200-1250rpm, KLX is bucket & shim.
Will this make any difference ?
Thanks

Clive W :D

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by Fat Bastard on 01/04/07 at 02:57:11

Can I open up the camchaincover to check the chain tensioner without doing something first? Like draining the oil.. or is it seperated from the oil compartment? Is there a gasket between the cover and the motor when I take it off.. and if so should that bee reused or changed? all this talk about cam chain and tensioner and the possilbility of an complete brakedown with bent valves and burned pistons and..and...and has made me worried about what state my chain is in... and same as justin_o_guy I don't ride mine like a cruiser.

Title: Re:inspect chain
Post by franch on 01/04/07 at 04:52:16

You must drain oil then take right side cover off to check cam chain tensioner.
there is a gasket on the right side cover but I have reused with a sparse amout of permatex where the gasket tore. Or you may want to buy a new gasket.

Title: Re: Re:inspect chain
Post by Greg_650 on 01/04/07 at 05:58:34

franch wrote:

I would warn you if you reuse the gasket...

There is an oil passage, shown below, that runs along the top of the cover which goes to a jet that lubricates the clutch. It is kinda dependent on the gasket to seal correctly...

(Best picture that I have uploaded right now)

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b277/gmdinusa/ClutchAssy01webcrop.jpg

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by Reelthing on 01/04/07 at 08:16:26

klx650sm2002 wrote:

With KLX I go for 1200-1250rpm, KLX is bucket & shim.
Will this make any difference ?
Thanks

Clive W :D

Looks like the right answers are showing up - except for the bucket and shim business -

while there is no way to tell how a low speed idle effects oil pressure on a bike with a bucket&shim valve train without a test - what is for sure is the difference - as a bucket&shim wears it gets tighter so the likely hood of burning a valve vastly increases and clearence settings are quite important - where as on the ls650 valve train as it wears it gets loose which may make noise or drop a bit of performance but doesn't fry the valves if your a bit lax

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by Greg_650 on 01/04/07 at 10:20:22

BTW-I if there is nothing wrong with the way the engine runs, I wouldn't worry about the cam chain. Just because you lugged the engine at idle isn't enough reason to worry. Wait for some other reason to go in there.

Here is a better view of the case. I had dropped the cam chain to remove the head.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b277/gmdinusa/ClutchAssy02web.jpg

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by Kropatchek on 01/04/07 at 11:49:15

Greg_650 wrote:

Here is a better view of the case. I had dropped the cam chain to remove the head.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b277/gmdinusa/ClutchAssy02web.jpg

Good picture Greg. Shows excactly the oil passsage to the gearbox AND the cilinder head. It's the hole just above the attachment of the chain tensioner.
Advise to use a NEW gasket that has the dried -up permatex( sort of) along the area of the oil channel. Or use the liquid gasket of your preference on both side of the ( old) gasket.

On the picture you see some oil above the tensioner; if you have not sealed this area properly oil can drain back into the clutch casing leaving you with NOT enough oil going to the head.

Suzuki modified the gasket not without reason

Greetz
Kropatchek ;D

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by Fat Bastard on 01/04/07 at 13:11:26

Greg_650 wrote:

Thanx for the that good picture...
I want to open it up to check if the tensioner is at his limit... The motor doesn't run bad just that it's gone over 25000miles 40000km and I don't know if something has been done. I don't want a total crash of the motor to bee the reason to go in there.... How does a motor with problems with camchain run?

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by vroom1776 on 01/04/07 at 13:16:38

usually if the cam chain snaps or the tensioner fails, it doesnt run. Mine did, but I had no acceleration to speak of and a top speed of 60 mph, even downhill.

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by Kropatchek on 01/05/07 at 01:45:20

Not excactly on-topic but interesting pictures.
The tensioner and chain in new condition ( 10 mm out) and at the end of it's useful life. When the tensioner breaks in 2 pieces the chain can jump a tooth (or more), valves off timing and the consequences.

Greetz
Kropatchek ;D

http://www.ls-650.de/Thumperbike/html/body_steuerkettenspanner.html

Title: Re: Low idle speed can damage the cam.
Post by thumperclone on 01/05/07 at 07:04:17

read a review of the ls 650..articles' only complaint about the design was the long distance oil passages to lube the cam bearings..author felt this,and the type of cam bearings could afffect the longevity of this engine..
have seen posts of some high mileages for the ls 650..
this is an enrty level type bike, i wouldnt expect mileages like the ($20k +)goldwing...