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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
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Message started by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 19:43:33

Title: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 19:43:33

Came flying up on a stop sign not all that long after pulling the brass cap from the idle mix? screw & adjusting same & the flippin thing coughed & shut off. Not new, really. Quick release throttle & & hard braking have killed it before. It was running really well & was warmed up after about 20 miles. The adjustment was, turn it in to make sure I couldn't get it worse than the factory. It was out a whole 1/2 turn. Rode a bit to warm it up. Started backing the screw out till the idle maxed out. Screwed it in till it started to slow a bit & back out till it peaked again. Called that good considering the main jet & exhaust are still stock. SOO! The question is, Why did the thing shut off? Kickstand interlock? Clutch switch? It wouldn't turn over at the stopsign. I checked the killswitch, it was set to run. I turned the motor over by putting it in 5th & rolling it so I knew it wasn't the engine. After I tried running with it & jumping on in 5th( which did not even come CLOSE to working, LOL) I hit the starter & VOILA! It cranked!
( I tried the starter numerous times before running with it & I poked the kickstand switch & messed with the microswitch under the clutch pivot, NOTHING!)

I don't see how it could be the adjustment on the carb.It ran too well for too long to make me think that was it. Suggestions?

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Steve530 on 11/21/06 at 19:54:06

Did you have any problems before you adjusted the carb?

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 20:02:47

Nope, Just the typical Bakkfire stuff. Now it runs a bunch better. Only 1 time has it stopped & failed to crank.Today. The time between the adjustment & the problem makes me think they are not related. I rode over 20 miles after the adjustment before the "No Crank" & the starter didn't click or anything. Then it just started like nothing ever happened. I think it's magic. like eloctrenics! Wuhhh? Electronics...

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Starlifter on 11/21/06 at 20:04:35

Could it be a loose battery connection or other electrical problems?

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 20:18:15

Hmmm, COULD it be? I spose it could, but when it's an intermittent problem & only happened once it is tuff to narrow down the culprit. I ( really) wish you hadn't askedTHAT cuz I hadn't even considered it till you did. Now I am forced to. So, the list of potential problems are , Clutch switch, kickstand interlock, battery connections, I guess Starter? too? When it started there was no hesitancy, like clicking & dropping the starter out. just cranked & fired up like normal. It was totally dead, no crank, no click, horn worked, lights on, neutral light on. Everything LOOKED fine, just no joy. Does that help? I am totally baffled. That is worse that partially baffled I spose. Thanks for the ideas.

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Steve530 on 11/21/06 at 20:25:39

I'm sorry, I didn't notice you said that it didn't crank. Obviously, adjusting the carb shouldn't keep the engine from cranking. I can't see how it could be anything but electrical.

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 20:32:16

MMMkay Steve, I can only agree, But now how do I decide what to look at? maybe just bypass the kickstand switch & clutch switch & neutral switch? What else is there? I pulled the battery about 1000 miles ago.Filled & charged & reinstalled, (cleaned connections & I have experience so I doubt I did it wrong, but human & anything is possible, excluding being rich, famous & good looking)

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Steve530 on 11/21/06 at 20:53:01

Well, You really should check the battery connections. Could be they are loose. If that was the problem, the lights would have been dead, too.

I think it's more likely that one of the switches are the problem. It could be real difficult to chase down a problem that rarely occurs.

You might try "exercising" the switched parts one at a time and then hitting the starter. The kickstand switch seems to be more of a problem than the others because it's exposed. Moving that up an down when the problem occurs might tell you the kickstand switch is the problem. There's also a neutral switch in the transmission, so try shifting it into neutral a few times. Move the clutch lever back and forth. And cycle the kill switch a few times.

Other than that, you'll have a tough time testing a component with an intermittent failure. Of course, you could just throw parts at the problem, but that is expensive.

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Reelthing on 11/21/06 at 21:01:12

If you didn't even get a click (the decompression solenoid clicks) but the lights and such were on the battery seems ok - might want to remove the seat and make sure all the connectors are together proper, next on the list would be the interlock switches with the kickstand switch first on the list of a problem child

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by SavageDude on 11/21/06 at 21:02:53

If you have the Clymer manual handy, take a look at the wiring schematic for the one that apply to your beast. Start out from the battery and see what is the next connection down the line. Check for operational condition on each component to see if they operate properly with and Ohm meter. I HATE TROUBLESHOOTING ELECTRIC PROBLEM but that is how I do it on the airplane. It's is PITA but doable, just take time. Good luck Dude :'(

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 21:08:25

Thanks Steve, I spose there's just no real straight answer. Just gonna have to work it out. I will look at posts on bypassing switches. I know I have seen one that details most of them. Hope I can find it.

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Steve530 on 11/21/06 at 21:20:01

Yea, I'm afraid there's no easy answer as far as I know.

Of course, you could just wait until it fails.

Good Luck.

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 21:30:14

Reelthing, If the kickstand or clutch switch didn't tell the starter to start, would the decompression solenoid fire?

sAVAGEdUDE. i HAVE A sUZUKI SHOP MANUAL. HAVEN'T LOOKE IN IT YETAARRGH danged cap lock button! sorry. Is that as good as the Clymers? I have an Ohm meter, used to work on cash registers & copiers, I don't like electrical probs eother, especially intermittent ones.

Okay folks, I tried the search for Bypass safety interlock switches & did not get the comprehensive link I read a day or so ago. Whoever did that work could y6ou send me to it? I will just bypass the clutch & kickstand switches & whatever you folks think I will just bypass & not worry about any goofy gremlin filled switches,,Thanks all!

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Reelthing on 11/21/06 at 21:50:56

justin_o_guy wrote:

Reelthing, If the kickstand or clutch switch didn't tell the starter to start, would the decompression solenoid fire?

don't believe it can, the interlocks are all in series with a timer (forget how long and no shop manual at the beach :) ) in the decompress module - so you get a click and a pause before the engine spins

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by justin_o_guy on 11/21/06 at 22:06:11

Okay, I think I know how I would like to proceed.

I would appreciate it if anyone could find the link to a post that covered ( I guess) all switches that could be bypassed. I saw it, I read it, along with a few days worth of reading. Now, I wish I had bookmarked it,, HMMM wait a SECOND! Nope, I only bookmarked carb stuff. Owell, if anyone can find the post that covers bypassing the various switches I would appreciate a link to it.

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by stinger on 11/22/06 at 00:42:33

Justin, I had the same problem with my bike. it just all of a sudden died and I had nothing. i took the battery out and it tested good. After like 4 frustatiing hours, I found the problem in the kickstand. Its not the switch, I tried that a dozen times. look under the kickstand and you will see a large bolt. I tightened it and it fired right over. I have no idea why it was the bolt, but it definatly was the problem. It has came loose a couple of times and each time it just wouldnt start

Title: Re: Shut down at a stop sign & no crank,,,
Post by Kropatchek on 11/22/06 at 02:12:36

You said the engine stopped at the trafic sign , that can happen if you close the throttle rapidly, no problem.

Then you was in a hurry to get the engine started, maybe you forget to pull the clutchlever, or the sidestand was not completely retracted?

Trouble shooting electrical problems start at the source: the battery and its connections.

Then work your way up to the component that's not working.

Electrics? It's like magic, read this:

One day I started by bike to go to the gasstation to refill.
When I wanted to start again the only noise was a rapid clicking sound from under the seat, what the F%$#k.
Pushed the bike home and after taking the seat off I discovered that the sound came from the starter solenoid. Luckily I had a spare so replaced the sol.

Bike started right up, problem solved? NO WAY

Started the bike maybe 5,6, or more times over a period of a couple of days.

Then , one day , nothing, no juice, only the green neutral light and when hitting the starter button no lights at all.

Battery flat?
Decided to take the battery out and recharge it.

Seat off again to reach the negative terminal.
Well, that was the problem: LOOSE connection

Also the CDI works only when powered by electricity, maybe an intermittend loose connection that caused the engine to stop.

Happy trouble shooting.
And when you're at it also check the general negative wire. That's the little wire attached to the big negative wire. It has a connector about 8" away from the battery: disconnect, clean and reconnect.

Greetz

Kropatchek 8)