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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1161567735 Message started by phasender on 10/22/06 at 18:42:15 |
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Title: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by phasender on 10/22/06 at 18:42:15 So about a third of the time that I shift down to first, instead of shifting smoothly down, the gear shift seems to hit something, I feel something clicking on it repeatedly, and when I release, it's still in neutral. The same thing happens sometimes shifting up or down into second. My old bike, honda cm400t, used to do the same thing, but it happened very rarely. Any thoughts on why it might be doing it, or how to fix it? Am I destroying the transmission everytime it does that? Or is this just a normal thing? It's a '97 Savage with 2600 miles on it. Thanks everybody! |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by barry68v10 on 10/22/06 at 19:28:49 How fast are you going on the down shift? The owners manual says not to shift into first until you stop, I've been shifting into first just before I stop otherwise I have to play the clutch a little to get it to drop into gear. It sounds to me when I've shifted into first too soon like part of the transmission where the gears are spins at whatever speed the rear tire is going regardless of clutch engagement, and shifting into first with the clutch in at 35 or 40 MPH (done it once) produced a whiring sound (I think that's a word) from the gears at the rear of the case. Also, I'd be curious to know what type and weight oil you are using. I also had two different Honda motorcycles that would do the same thing along with the famous--I mean infamous Honda miss-shift from 1st to 2nd...That was a function of transmission design vs. anything "wrong" mechanically (other than design ;)) |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by spike on 10/22/06 at 22:32:06 I don't go down into first unless I'm going extreamly slow like just about stopped or just before turning into my dirt lane. I have 2700mi on and I don't seem to have that trouble. It may just be that you are dropping it into first to soon. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/23/06 at 09:57:42 It sounds like to me, that you are releasing the clutch a little too soon during your downshift from 2nd to 1st, and the noise is the gear not quite meshing. I know that a shift from 1st to 2nd or vice versa, requires a little more positive reenforcement as you are also slipping past neutral, compared to other gears. I know if I dump my clutch too soon, or I don't really emphasize that shift, I'll sometimes miss it. Just a thought. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by Savage_Rob on 10/23/06 at 10:53:55 Also, check to be sure the linkage rod isn't bent. This can happen from stomping on it to downshift. I know because I bent mine. It's about maybe five inches long I think, low on the left side. If you start at the shifter and follow the linkage, you'll see it. I also find it better to downshift while still moving. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by Hashbrown on 10/23/06 at 11:29:06 personally i hardley ever down shift to first. If im comming to a stop i slow down by combination of front and rear brake and downshifting. By the time i get to second gear, im coasting to a stop anyways and tap it to neutral. Personal opinion: First gear is for going forward not stopping. Just my two cents |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/23/06 at 14:36:14 Hashbrown wrote:
Me, I always downshift through all the gears, using front and rear brakes and engine braking, being careful not to downshift too soon. When I'm down into first, I try to keep moving if traffic will allow and see how slow I can go without dabbing my feet. I always want to be in the correct gear for the speed I'm going. I only pop it into neutral when I'm stopped at a long light and need to adjust my goggles or something. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by georgekathe on 10/23/06 at 15:05:00 I come up to an almost stop in 2nd (hey, with a low revving bike like the Savage it does not stutter). Put it in neutral @ almost stop & leave it there (was told by Dad as a youth leaving bike in gear @ lights can prematurely wear out clutch or @ least springs (?). then snick it into gear when light changes. If tought to get in first I just roll bike a little as I gently push down on lever, usually avoiding any of that nasty grating sound. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by phasender on 10/23/06 at 16:41:07 It actually happens a lot when I'm stopped at a light and shift down from neutral, so I don't think it has anything to do with the speed. It also happens sometimes when I'm shifting to/from second. I thought that it might be because I wasn't hitting the gear shift hard enough. Hitting it hard helps, but it still happens a lot. Would a different weight of oil help? I think I used 10w40 last time. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by thumperclone on 10/23/06 at 18:10:02 check to insure linkage is not bent or loose...i changed to a syn oil(amsoil)on my 05 after 2500 miles and has improved shifting..1st is still sometimes a bit of a do from neutral .. i just got the feel for engagmaent by feathering the clutch while pushing down(DONT STOMP!!)on shift lever.. rockin the bike front to back sometimes.. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by sluggo on 10/23/06 at 19:10:42 georgekathe wrote:
big no no in my 30 plus riding experience. you are extremely at risk while stoped. ie rear ender, car taking corner wide, ect. you must be able to quickly accelerate to avoid collisions. stop lights are not the place to relax. most of the collisions i've seen have been stopped bikes getting hit. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by georgekathe on 10/23/06 at 21:58:40 I beg to differ in my 39 years of riding, sluggo, but that's what makes the world go round - differences of opinions, even allowing for years of experience on both our parts. ;D |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by sluggo on 10/23/06 at 22:28:16 georgekathe wrote:
ditto: i just prefer safety over parts. ::) |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by verslagen1 on 10/23/06 at 22:35:12 I've had the same experience as barry68v10. And my motivation to get into first is it will stick in 2nd requiring a little clutch action to get it all the way into 2nd so I can shift into 1st. And Sluggo that's exactly the way the MSF courses are taught. Be alert, be ready. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by Savage_Rob on 10/24/06 at 06:02:35 I almost always stay in gear at stops - as well as a path out of my "parked" position. If I need to replace a $12 set of clutch springs a bit more often, I'll take that as the cost of reserving an escape. It's definitely a personal choice but staying in 1st gear at stops is what the Motorcycle Safety Foundation teaches and I happen to agree with it. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by barry68v10 on 10/24/06 at 14:29:10 To piggyback here, how many folks do you know have been rear-ended at a stop-light or stop sign? I have never personally had that happen, but I know a lot of people who have. Remember...in a car you need to get a new bumper and see a chiropractor a couple of times to work out the kinks. If it happens to you ONCE on a M/C...game over! I'm a big fan of the "escape strategy" myself. Don't trust other drivers! |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by sluggo on 10/24/06 at 14:38:39 i saw a nasty one in l.a. i was riding west on the 10 freeway about robinson or so, i glanced over to the other side of freeway just in time to see a m/c stopped in traffic on an off ramp, it was slammed into by a cage. threw the passenger over top onto the trunk of the car ahead. it was ugly, and i only got a short look. on another occasion i was by lax stopped. it was late virtually no traffic when i saw the headlites coming up quickly, saw he wasnt going to stop and was able to make a quick right on imperial ave. it was close. had to change my shorts after that one. had i not been paying attention, i wouldn't be here today. stop lights are not the place to relax. |
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Title: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by georgekathe on 10/24/06 at 14:43:23 darn - feel like both moderators are playing tag wrestling with me! ;D seriously, on both occasions I have been rear-ended on a bike (yes, on both sides of the Atlantic!) it happened so quick. one car came round a curve fast into me & bunch of cars @ the light. damaged bike - but his insurance more than covered it. no damage to me & (scared friend on back s@%tless). other time driver went "brake, gas, oh s@%t, brake again" as he realized he jumped the gun @ the light ("my foor just slipped off the gas" - don't think so as he punted a 630lb bike & me into the car waiting in front.) lucky not hurt but one of us left in "bracelets" & it wasn't me or the cop! both times I was in line in 2 traffic lanes so even if in gear could not have got out of way - also even if @ front of line would not fancy risking pulling into traffic going across my path. moreover, cost of springs might not be great but don't want drag (clutch drag? - no pun intended!) of having to change them. so far in almost 40 year not broken a bone on a bike despite 10,000 miles a year in London traffic for 20 of them so happy with how I drive. Like I said - each to their own, though. know as well the MSF teachers here don't preach what they teach so have doubts about some parts of that way of doing things. my last word on subject - partly included because the second guy's excuse was so funny I almost laughed if I had not been pissed about the damage to my B & I wanted to share it, partly because as I said felt like I was being gang attacked (kidding!) :) ;D As far as changing into first while on the (slow) move - don't really have problems - been trying it more since this link started & seems to go smoothly enough (runnning standard Valvoline 10-40). |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by 911radioman on 10/24/06 at 15:20:58 I stay in gear as well when stopped. One of the first things taught in an MSF class as well. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by sluggo on 10/24/06 at 15:35:40 georgekathe wrote:
WARNING EXPLICIT CONTENT FOLLOWS, NOT FOR THE SENSETIVE OF MIND. I guess that's better than getting gang banged. :o :o :o sorry folks just had to say it. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by georgekathe on 10/24/06 at 16:21:39 darn - I said last entry was my last but sluggo - your words were the exact ones I wanted to use, but didn't in case PC people read this site!! :o |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by sluggo on 10/24/06 at 16:46:36 i've been called alot of things over the years, but sluggo and politically correct have yet to be used in the same sentance. not only do i call a spade a spade, i call it a F'N shovel. 8) |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by phasender on 10/24/06 at 19:35:21 LOL you guys are great. Thanks for alll the advice. Yesterday on the road, I suddenly found myself without the ability to shift. I checked the gear shift rod and I saw that.... it was being held together by duct tape. I only bought it a week or two ago. I did some Macguvering with what I could find... electrical tape, a plastic marker housing, and some picture hanging wire, so it's running again. It's a $6 part you can install with pliers! Why would someone not replace it? Hopefully I'll get the rod next week, and maybe I won't have that shifting problem anymore. Since the discussion's shifted to motorcycle safety, would you all agree that in slippery conditions it's best to brake first with the rear brake and avoid squeezing the front brake too hard? I only ask because the day BEFORE yesterday, it was raining, I was stopped at an intersection, light turned green, accelerated, SUV decides to rush a left turn in front of me, I squeezed the front brake, and even though I thought my wheel was straight on, the front wheel slipped to the left and I had my first spill. After that, I was VERY careful with slowing down and made sure to use my rear brake every time. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by phasender on 10/24/06 at 19:37:43 Hell, while I'm at it, I'll ask, is the little plug that comes out of the left hand grip an accessory plug of sorts? Can you plug a cigarette lighter into it? |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by barry68v10 on 10/25/06 at 02:32:33 phasender: You should get into the habit of ALWAYS using the front and rear brake together. The front brake will handle 70-90% of the stopping duties, but the rear break at the same time will help straighten out the bike and minimize front-end dive. It takes practice/experience to know just how hard you can apply the brakes in different scenarios w/o locking up. Do you ride left of center in the lane you choose? The reason I ask is there is usually oil in the center and in the summer time a/c units on cars usually drain into the right side of the lane. Riding left of center in the cage tire path will help maximize tire traction. I'd recommend getting into a MSF course if you haven't already. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by spike on 10/25/06 at 02:52:46 Posted by: phasender Posted on: 24. Oct 2006 at 22:37 Hell, while I'm at it, I'll ask, is the little plug that comes out of the left hand grip an accessory plug of sorts? Can you plug a cigarette lighter into it? What plug?? Was the road damp? And if so was you in the center of the lane? If I'm in slick situations, wet, snow or gravel I usally apply more of a bake brake then front. Sometime in certain situations I will not use front brake. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by phasender on 10/25/06 at 08:00:05 Thanks Barry. I always try to stay off the dark line in the center of the lane, but usually I pick the left side or right side based on how much I trust the cars in the other lanes, and where the blindspots are (I ride around the city during rush hour a lot). I actually learned how to ride last year through a state MSF course, but since I didn't know how to ride at the time, I don't remember all the rules, e.g. I forgot about the MSF rule of not shifting into neutral at a light. The state course was free, but it was too boring and basic for me to go through again. Do you think the MSF advanced rider course is worthwhile? |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by phasender on 10/25/06 at 08:56:38 Yeah, the road was quite slick, and I was probably close to the center of the road, in the intersection. Big mistake, right? Coming out of the switch box on the left grip is a 1-2" piece of wire with a little electrical plug at the end. I thought I could plug my hand warmers into it, but it doesn't fit. Too small. I ended up wiring the warmers directly to the battery, which is great, as long as you remember to turn the warmers off, which I didn't the other day. I'm hoping that if I wire them into the plug, that they'll automatically turn off when I remove the ignition. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by spike on 10/26/06 at 02:53:18 If the road was real slick and you were in towards center chances are a tad to much front brake (OUCH :o! that'll leeave a mark). Now you got me courious. I have never noticed a wire at the hand grip anywhere. It's a 06. Have to take a good look. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by barry68v10 on 10/26/06 at 04:52:43 I took the Advanced MSF course recently (required by my employer) and even after riding for 20+ years I learned a few things, met some great people, and brushed up my skills on my new-to-me Savage. If it's free, I'd say it's worthwhile especially since most insurance companies will give you a break if you've taken it. It only lasted about 4-5 hours and was almost all riding. ;D |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by lpgoldtop on 10/26/06 at 05:21:20 georgekathe wrote:
The MVA book says to always leave it in gear when stopped, but I've always heard that it's bad for the transmission. I suppose its down to saftey or wear, riders choice! Also, I've had a similar problem with an 01 with 130miles on it. Only I couldn't get mine in any gear. |
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Title: Re: Clicking/sticking transmission, 1st gear Post by Ed_L. on 10/26/06 at 19:27:27 I was having trouble downshifting my '02 into first gear, tried moving the shifter arm on the side of the transmission two or three splines clockwise. So far it seems to work better with no hangups in neutral. If your clutch cable is adjusted right then try moving the shifter arm, it worked for me. |
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