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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Oil change with synthetic
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Message started by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/08/06 at 16:09:57

Title: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/08/06 at 16:09:57

Well today I finally got around to changing the oil. I decided to use the AMSOIL 20W-50 seeing how I couldn't find any MOBIL 1 Vtwin around locally. Most of the stealerships were only carrying a blend like Spectro or whatever. I wanted to go full synthetic. After researching online it turns out the AMSOIL tested best. I took the bike for a 100 mile run today, being a perfect fall day. The bike seemed much quieter and shifted a lot better. I was much more confident taking it up to 70 on the highway than before. I'll check my gas mileage as I go along this week. In fact the engine noise is so reduced all I can hear is the stupid headlight rattling. If it aint one thing it's another. So far thumbs up on the AMSOIL but it cost me $9.50 a quart. Yeesh!

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by barry68v10 on 10/09/06 at 05:29:24

Glad to hear that's working out. I've been using Amsoil in everything I own for about 12 years now and have been thoroughly impressed with the product and company.

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by bikingb on 10/09/06 at 08:04:25

Wow. That is a pretty powerful testimonial for synthetic oil. Makes me want to try it. Thanks.

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by PerrydaSavage on 10/09/06 at 11:53:15

Hmmmm? Most things I've read about Synth in Bikes with wet clutches, is that it can cause clutch slippage? Reason I ask, is 'cause my brother (who Rides an '03 Honda 750 ACE ... but don't hold that against him!) is considering becoming a local rep for AMSOIL products ...

Just finished an oil & filter change on the LS ... used Suzuki 10W-40 dino m/c oil ...

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by barry68v10 on 10/09/06 at 12:00:18

Generally speaking, friction modifiers cause clutch slippage in m/cs not synthetic oil. Then again, if your steed has some stout clutch springs compared to hp you could be ok even with friction modifiers...

I'm an Amsoil dealer, just to get discounts for myself. With the high $ stuff that translates to about $2-3 less per quart. ;D

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/09/06 at 12:36:40

PerrydaSavage wrote:

I looked into the wet clutch issue and both the AMSOIL and MObil 1 Vtwin specify being completely compatible with wet clutch systems that share the crancase oil. They apparently leave out the additional friction modifying additives that bind to the clutch plates that can cause slippage. All I know is that my thumper seems to be loving the AMSOIL and running smooth.

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Rogue_Cheddar on 10/09/06 at 12:40:59

barry68v10 wrote:

Barry, my man! Dude! Sahweeet! How bout a 3 quart sample for free gratis? Friend to the end! :D

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Savage_Rob on 10/09/06 at 13:35:33

I've been using motorcycle-specific pure synthetics in my Savage since I got her over two years ago. Until very recently, I've had no problems with clutch slippage. The slight slippage I have now exists also when using dino juice and I think it's due to spring compression over time. I have new springs and plan to replace them soon. I had planned to replace them this past weekend but I had to work on Saturday and our washer broke down Sunday. What is it they say? Something like "Life is what happens while you're making other plans"?

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by PerrydaSavage on 10/09/06 at 14:22:20

;D Thanks guys ... my bro and I had that conversation about synth & wet clutches when he mentioned considering becoming an AMSOIL rep ... he'll be very happy to hear y'all's take on the product when I talk to him tomorrow!

One further question 10W-40 vs 20W-50? I've always run the 10W-40 Suzuki dino juice. What are the advantages of the 20W-50 over 10W-40 (which my MOM reccomends ...)?
Thanks in advance!

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Reelthing on 10/09/06 at 14:34:44

I do I guess a winter summer deal - 20w50 M1 v-twin when's hot and back to 10w40 m1 mx4t december through march - makes the engine run a fair bit quiter and doesn't breakdown do to the heat as easy

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by barry68v10 on 10/09/06 at 15:20:46

Ok, here's the straight scoop with oil...
The weight ratings 10-40, 20-50 etc were created to specify how an oil reacted to temperatures with viscosity modifiers added. In cold temps, oil would get too thick, then in hot temps the oil would be too thin, thus the multi-weight rated oil.
However, synthetics are TOTALLY different and really don't follow the same rules as dino juice. For instance, 20-50 Amsoil synthetic has a pour point below -40 f! That's much lower than any 10-30 dyno juice on the market! In addition, since synthetic has MUCH higher resistance to thermal breakdown 20 weight synthetic "acts" thicker than any 50 weight dyno juice at 500 f. So why does synthetic even have multi-ratings?

Well, one reason is for the size of the oil passages, tolerance of bearings, etc. Where the oil rating gives the user/manufacturer an idea of how fast the oil will flow and how resistant it is to being "squeezed" out of place under pressure. Thus, 10-40 will flow faster at a given temp than 20-50, but 20-50 will resist being squeezed out due to pressure. Therefore, when running full synthetic oil you don't have to worry about the whole summer/winter debate. It's best to use the grade recommended by the manufacturor unless you've made modifications.

I'm installing an oil cooler on my bike, which suzuki didn't take into account when they spec'ed 10-40, so I'll likely run 30 wt. full synthetic year round since my oil will be cooler than the design spec under all operating conditions. I could go on here, but I'm afraid I'm explaining how to build a watch at this point when somebody only mentioned what time it was... :-[

Bottom line:10-40 full synthetic is MORE than sufficient for the hottest temps your Thanksgiving turkey will encounter. ;)

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Reelthing on 10/09/06 at 15:38:15

The '95 @24k miles is a noticably quiter engine w/20w-50 v-twin, haven't used anything but 10w-40 in the '02 -the heavier oil might be making up for some wear on '95

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by barry68v10 on 10/09/06 at 15:52:48

Check out this white paper on oil. A number were tested, both synthetic and conventional. The Mobil 1 failed the gear lube test which might be where the '95 needs the most help, and is a specific weakness of Mobil 1 10-40... (foam control and acid neutralization were other relative weaknesses of Mobil 1 10-40.)

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2156.pdf

If you REALLY like Mobil 1, I'd recommend running 20-50 year-round...

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Reelthing on 10/09/06 at 17:28:22

I use amsoil in the guzzi because of the odd requirement of 5w-40 syn (dry clutch) but otherwise
try to stay away from the amway type of marketing and use mobil1 - but oil threads can and will run on for ever - a very good source of information from a site not trying to sell you something

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/

look around has oil tests from everything with an engine

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by ThumpinSquid on 10/09/06 at 19:17:35

Right on. I'm a full synthetic guy myself, but I run Royal Purple. At the time I raced tough trucks it was found to be the best by numerous independent testers, and they did right by me a lot with their sponsorship of me and what not. I still use them today, albeit due to brand loyalty. I know lots of guys that run AmsOil and RedLine and Mobil1 with similar testamonies.

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Savage_Rob on 10/10/06 at 06:32:48

With Maxum4 Extra I used 15w50. With Mobil1 I use 20w50. Except that the last time I was in Wal-Mart, they only had 2 quarts left of M1 20w50 and several of M1 10w40. Since she takes more than 2 quarts, I bought the two of 20w50 and one of 10w40. I'm pretty sure that'll be fine. And yeah, www.bobistheoilguy.com is very good info.

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by JerryAssburger on 10/16/06 at 00:22:47

Rotella-T Synthetic has no "friction modifiers" and is about $15/ gallon at WallyMart. The possible(?) downside is it's only available as 10-40w. I have a friend with a 1200 Sportster who tried the Rotella-T and then the V-twin 20-50w- he said its quieter with the 20-50w........? (HD recommends 20-50w.)
Rotella-T comes in both dino and synth versions. I've tried them both, and to be honest, the butt-dyno, the ear-dyno, the shifter foot-dyno, and the look-at-how-nasty-the-oil-looks-after-1000-miles dyno really detect no difference. On an air-cooled engine I feel better putting in the synth, but that's just mental. I think.

Maybe...?

...who said that?

Title: Re: Oil change with synthetic
Post by Savage_Rob on 10/16/06 at 10:40:48

JerryAssburger wrote:

Rotella-T Synthetic has no "friction modifiers" and is about $15/ gallon at WallyMart. The possible(?) downside is it's only available as 10-40w.

At my local Wal-Mart it's about $8 a gallon and it's 15w40. It's about $9 a gallon at the local Autozone for the same thing.